Remember those lawyer commercials......

Joanimaroni wrote:There was a call!

How about that!   Could get interesting.

In any event, may be kinda tough for Maloney to run his offices out of state without transportation for at least a year.  Poor baby.

I figured it out. This guy was so tough and said "Don't come to me if you have a DUI."

Well, business is slow and he's figuring he's losing out on these DUIs, so...

The new commercial will go like this, "Have you been wrongly accused of a DUI? I've been where you are. Come see me. We'll bring justice to the system."

You guys are forgetting that Maloney is a personal injury attorney. DUI business is peanuts stuff -- actually lower than peanuts -- compared to potential PI verdicts.

Dui's are certainly not peanuts. Also, this conceptual flaw that a person that does DUIs cannot do personal injury is simply wrong in the real world. Part of a personal injury lawyer's income is from suing the self injured in accidents under arbitration where the insurance company is not paying on medical. Also with comparative negligence, a drunk driver can often NOT be at fault, and another sober driver is responsible for an accident. I am always questioning the basis of a police stop because of the flagrant abuses of the same.

2seaoat wrote:Dui's are certainly not peanuts.  Also, this conceptual flaw that a person that does DUIs cannot do personal injury is simply wrong in the real world.  Part of a personal injury lawyer's income is from suing the self injured in accidents under arbitration where the insurance company is not paying on medical.  Also with comparative negligence, a drunk driver can often NOT be at fault, and another sober driver is responsible for an accident.  I am always questioning the basis of a police stop because of the flagrant abuses of the same.

I was strictly comparing the monetary potential of a personal injury case for the plaintiff vs. a case defending someone charged with DUI.   There is simply no comparison, financially.  Period.   Being that my late father was a prominent PI/PL attorney and my brother still is, I think I have some standing on this particular topic, O wise one in all things.   Even if I didn't, it's strictly common sense.  I have no idea what you were going on about or why.

I feel pretty comfortable about the best dui lawyers not earning peanuts, and any lawyer can do PI.......it does not mean that they are wealthy from the same. Fred is a giant and comparing him to the most successful DUI lawyer in Florida, would be a peanuts comparison after the tobacco settlement.....but there are a great many very competent and successful PI attorneys who get burned by Juries. I have a close friend who had a lay down medical malpractice where his firm advanced 500k having won a 14 million verdict against Sears earlier in his career.....well that 500k hit hurt the firm and it took three years to recover and get things close to normal. If you think American juries are making PI lawyers rich.....yes some, but a heavy duty hitter on DUIs have incredible volume and actually do better than MOST PI lawyers by number.....sure the big hitter firms will regularly make what that DUI lawyer makes, but with TV both areas have economy of scale.

About 20 some odd years ago I was with a driver who got a DUI.
He was advised to use David Ackerman. Ackerman told him there was a flat rate to get you off on a DUI. $1000 for first offense. $4000 for second offense. He paid the thousand and got off.
Ackerman later become a County Judge.

2seaoat wrote:a heavy duty hitter on DUIs have incredible volume and actually do better than MOST PI lawyers by number.....

Would you care to provide a link to the site where your statement is proven, even if it were germane to the argument at hand?  You've decided to ignore my stated premise about monetary potential of the two types of cases and chosen to simply compare "heavy duty DUI" lawyers to "MOST" PI attorneys, throwing in an example of when one PI firm's case didn't turn out so well (gee, you think that might happen once in a while in the law business? Really??).

I would dearly love to see you debate Donald Trump because I think you could actually beat him at his own smoke and mirrors game.

No smoke and mirror. Juries are extremely stingy and the insurance companies have made it difficult for the average PI lawyer to bank what it takes to win, but the folks who are advertising on billboards are pulling the volume from competent small firms and this idea that the average trial lawyer doing PI work is making so much more than the volume DUI TV Lawyers who you think are making peanuts is ill informed. I have hundreds of examples of the same. A now deceased friend who I played baseball with won at arbitration a really good dollar amount judgment, but the insurance company rejected and went to jury trial......only to get pennies on the dollar from the arbitration award and ended up losing his asz and over three years of work. I see some DUI lawyers who ask for a 2k retainer on a first time offender and 5k on a two time loser, and with those facing felonies for repeat dui up to 10k. They stack their cases and can have 10-20 cases on a call and have an associate in court continuing 90% of those cases and billing an hour or up to 5k billing in one county, and cover two or three counties that morning within the TV station area.

Sure once in a career my friend got the Sears case and a five million attorney fee. Over a thirty year career that one case actually generates a six figure gross salary, while the volume DUI lawyer can be bringing in year in and year out 250-500k. If Donald Trump knew what he was talking about he would be hard to beat in a debate......he might say that making a half million a year is peanuts.

2seaoat wrote:No smoke and mirror.  Juries are extremely stingy and the insurance companies have made it difficult for the average PI lawyer to bank what it takes to win, but the folks who are advertising on billboards are pulling the volume from competent small firms and this idea that the average trial lawyer doing PI work is making so much more than the volume DUI TV Lawyers who you think are making peanuts is ill informed.  

You either aren't perceptive enough to understand what her argument was, or you realize that you're wrong so you're now arguing against a straw man.  She said there is more money to be made in personal injury than there is in DUIs.  And now you're ignoring that and talking about volume.  

2seaoat, is the law school at UF named after a personal injury attorney or is it named after a DUI guy?  Is the crown jewel home of Pensacola on Muskogee Wharf owned by a personal injury attorney or is it owned by a DUI guy?  Who is more likely to get arrested for speeding in a Lamborghini on the beach, a personal injury attorney or a DUI guy?

Well, I will help you. The top PI people make more than the Top volume DUI lawyer. However, the top DUI lawyers who are advertising on TV in a market make more than the AVERAGE PI attorney. A top DUI lawyer does not make peanuts, and yes there are hundreds of examples of folks like Fred among PI lawyers.......not. Thirty years ago juries were being generous, but today it is the exception. In that same time frame, the government's all out war on DUIs and increasing penalties have made the volume DUI lawyers not making peanuts, but doing quite well. Meanwhile the small PI firm has to go out and do twenty depositions, hire experts, and spend firm money when an insurance company thirty years ago would at least make an offer, they now force that firm to go to trial, and the jury awards specials, when thirty years ago folks were settling for three time specials and were getting ten fold specials at trial. No, the illusion that all PI lawyers are rich and all firms are killing it.....is Hollywood, but yes Fred makes more on the interest on his money than any DUI lawyer in the country.

boards of FL wrote:

2seaoat wrote:No smoke and mirror.  Juries are extremely stingy and the insurance companies have made it difficult for the average PI lawyer to bank what it takes to win, but the folks who are advertising on billboards are pulling the volume from competent small firms and this idea that the average trial lawyer doing PI work is making so much more than the volume DUI TV Lawyers who you think are making peanuts is ill informed.  

You either aren't perceptive enough to understand what her argument was, or you realize that you're wrong so you're now arguing against a straw man.  She said there is more money to be made in personal injury than there is in DUIs.  And now you're ignoring that and talking about volume.  

2seaoat, is the law school at UF named after a personal injury attorney or is it named after a DUI guy?  Is the crown jewel home of Pensacola on Muskogee Wharf owned by a personal injury attorney or is it owned by a DUI guy?  Who is more likely to get arrested for speeding in a Lamborghini on the beach, a personal injury attorney or a DUI guy?

Very nice try, Boards, so right as usual, and I thank you.  As for me, though, I'm so over spending any more time on this thread.   In fact I'm no longer interested in trying to have a reasoned discussion with seaoat on any topic, watching his arguments become more and more circular, as he hunts for any way to declare victory for himself.  Have fun, sea; I'm done.

Peanuts.....yep....I would pack it up if I made that statement.

boards of FL wrote:

2seaoat wrote:No smoke and mirror.  Juries are extremely stingy and the insurance companies have made it difficult for the average PI lawyer to bank what it takes to win, but the folks who are advertising on billboards are pulling the volume from competent small firms and this idea that the average trial lawyer doing PI work is making so much more than the volume DUI TV Lawyers who you think are making peanuts is ill informed.  

You either aren't perceptive enough to understand what her argument was, or you realize that you're wrong so you're now arguing against a straw man.  She said there is more money to be made in personal injury than there is in DUIs.  And now you're ignoring that and talking about volume.  

2seaoat, is the law school at UF named after a personal injury attorney or is it named after a DUI guy?  Is the crown jewel home of Pensacola on Muskogee Wharf owned by a personal injury attorney or is it owned by a DUI guy?  Who is more likely to get arrested for speeding in a Lamborghini on the beach, a personal injury attorney or a DUI guy?

Neither it was Alan Levin's home. He was the guru for alternate dispute resolutions...his specialty expertise. Also known as the high priced divorce attorney. He also practiced general law including some personal injury.

The UF law school is named for Fred Levin, who lives in Gulf Breeze.

2seaoat wrote:Peanuts.....yep....I would pack it up if I made that statement.

PEANUTS IN APPLES TO APPLES COMPARISON OF POTENTIAL EARNINGS ON A CASE.  Pack it up yourself.

Potential.......many a young attorney thought about all that potential from the big one.....but it just is not that easy. The truth is that the most successful firms are not one dimensional, but do workers comp, business formation, criminal, and yes divorce along with the PI because they have to pay the bills in between that potential. If you think Fred is simply a PI firm.....that is funny. No, the DUI specialist over the last 30 years have carved out very nice practices. It used to be bankruptcy was the the bottom feeder of law, but today with advertising and some incredible fees in Chapter 11s most large firms have specialist on board. In good times the transactional real estate booms, and in bad times the BK pays the bills for these firms as they wait for your potential, but the volume DUI has a steady and quite predictable revenue flow which is not peanuts.........but heck.....I do not know what I am talking about.

2seaoat wrote:but heck.....I do not know what I am talking about.

Au contraire, seaoat knows absolutely everything about everything, don't we all know that by now??

He is right on his last comment about firms not being one dimensional.

Joanimaroni wrote:He is right on his last comment about firms not being one dimensional.

He may be correct on several counts unrelated to my point, but to repeat for the umpteenth time, here was my one and only premise, from several posts ago:

"I was strictly comparing the monetary potential of a personal injury case for the plaintiff vs. a case defending someone charged with DUI.   There is simply no comparison, financially.  Period."

And I stand by that statement still, despite the fact that sea decided to play the usual Devil's advocate in his favorite game of always being right, and proceeded to throw into the discussion everything but the proverbial kitchen sink -- also known as practicing smoke and mirrors, which charge I also stand by, as he's a consummate expert at it and, I continue to believe, could likely beat Trump at his own similar game.

But then, sea admits to his own arrogance and to his pleasure at irritating people with it.   Some foks really know how to have fun.

Linda.....Linda .....Linda.....you should know by now not to spit into the wind and mess with Leroy Brown. This is what you actually said:

You guys are forgetting that Maloney is a personal injury attorney. DUI business is peanuts stuff -- actually lower than peanuts -- compared to potential PI verdicts.

Maloney may be driving a fancy car and running a great many ads as to his PI practice, but there is high probability that some of the high volume DUI practices which you demeaned as "actually lower than peanuts" compared to "potential" ignores the real world which I have with precision pointed out. Potential is not money, and those lower than peanuts folks are probably making more money than Maloney. A good lawyer does not advertise. Does not have to, and Maloney who you seem to think has reaped his potential is probably not making what you think, and you certainly have zero knowledge on what a DUI practice can make.

I must insist, sea, sea, sea, that you cease and desist putting words in my mouth.  I NEVER "demeaned" DUI attorneys nor called them or their practices lower than peanuts.  READ MY LIPS:  I was ONLY, repeat ONLY, talking about the potential remuneration from the CASE TYPE itself -- and yes, the POTENTIAL for financial gain of one type of case vs. the other.  NOT overall practices, NOT good DUI guys vs. not so great PI guys, NOTHING BUT WHAT I SAID, PERIOD.  You were the one who, for whatever reason, decided to latch onto my statement and turn it into an entire condemnation of practice of DUI defense, to which you could then respond as the white knight.

Further, you have no idea what I think about Maloney.  As a matter of fact, just from his commercials I've always considered him a possible lowlife sleazebag -- a very small man trying to be a big shot.  He may not be any of that, but that's my initial impression.   The fact that he lives here and doesn't practice here is also a red flag.  No, there's no love nor respect lost in this house for David Maloney (nor for HIS potential earning ability --remember, I'm talking CASE TYPES, not people).

And further, you have NO IDEA what I know or don't know, much less that I know "zero" about DUI practices  -- or anything else, for that matter.  Good holy grief, how entirely presumptuous of you.

Bottom line?   You, sir, are no Leroy Brown, and your game does not intimidate me one iota.  Go pick on someone who will tremble before you.  It ain't me, babe.