Every word in the bible is true. Yeah, sure it is.

Joanimaroni wrote:

Dreamsglore wrote:

colaguy wrote:

Dreamsglore wrote:

Bob wrote:I don't understand these atheists.  I am totally convinced Jehova created the world.  All you have to do is observe how crazy the world is and it's a no-brainer that it had to be somebody as crazy as Jehova who created it.
I fully believe in him,  I just don't think he deserves to be worshipped.  He'd have to clean up his act first before I would even consider it.

LOL! He also has fallen down on his creation and left it to the dogs.

So, it's God's fault that we have done these things to ourselves?

Come on now? God created human beings ,right? So why did he create beings who commit evil? It's his fault. He can change all of that,right? You people who believe what people have written hundreds of years after Christ died need your heads examined. Fairy tale fables of Noah's Ark and parting the Red Sea? You're no different than the tribes who worship painted heads or India's worship of cows.

God gave individuals the ability to choose......good versus evil.

Wordslinger wrote:

VectorMan wrote:Atheists seem overly preoccupied with Christians. I wonder why.

They never talk bad about Islam or Muslims. Probably fear they'll get their asses kicked or killed.

What do you atheists have to say about the kuran? Careful, alha is watching you.

I'm an atheist -- and from my POV all religions are evil.  Of course, depending on the time, and the place, some more than others.

God and Allah can both kiss my ass.

How's that for equality?  LOL

Wordslinger wrote:

Joanimaroni wrote:

Dreamsglore wrote:

colaguy wrote:

Dreamsglore wrote:

Bob wrote:I don't understand these atheists.  I am totally convinced Jehova created the world.  All you have to do is observe how crazy the world is and it's a no-brainer that it had to be somebody as crazy as Jehova who created it.
I fully believe in him,  I just don't think he deserves to be worshipped.  He'd have to clean up his act first before I would even consider it.

LOL! He also has fallen down on his creation and left it to the dogs.

So, it's God's fault that we have done these things to ourselves?

Come on now? God created human beings ,right? So why did he create beings who commit evil? It's his fault. He can change all of that,right? You people who believe what people have written hundreds of years after Christ died need your heads examined. Fairy tale fables of Noah's Ark and parting the Red Sea? You're no different than the tribes who worship painted heads or India's worship of cows.

God gave individuals the ability to choose......good versus evil.

Jesus Christ ... we went through that issue last week!  Human beings don't need god to know what's right or wrong!  And if you believe in the bible, it's perfectly clear there are lots of times when God doesn't know right from wrong!

Damaged Eagle wrote:
Sign!!!!!..... I've already went through this once but it just doesn't appear to sink in...

What makes you think that your abstract human constructs of good and evil can be applied to God?

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9qAqwIW704

SheWrites wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:
Sign!!!!!..... I've already went through this once but it just doesn't appear to sink in...

What makes you think that your abstract human constructs of good and evil can be applied to God?

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9qAqwIW704

Well, if one believes the Bible to be God's word given to man, God has given guidelines for what is good and what is evil.  If one believes the Bible, then possibly one believes God created man/woman.  Story after story tells of good and evil's inception and attempt to destroy.

SheWrites wrote:I have no idea what it would feel like to be good or evil if I was born and did not have human influence teaching me (based on what they learned from the Bible) what is good and bad.  I suppose if I stuck my finger on a cactus I would say ouch and consider that something I'd want to stay away from.  Evil?  I don't know if that would be said but pain is experienced and associated with something to stay away from.

SheWrites wrote:Damaged, what is your scale for good and evil?

Damaged Eagle wrote:
After all if good and evil are abstract human constructs and those constructs are all relative then any scale will be simply a respective summation unique to the specific individual and will in all probability be meaningless to someone else.

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSFU8fYkqDg

 

SheWrites wrote:


So, are humans inherently good or inherently evil?  Does that come one size fits all and then we change or is it inherent that we are good or evil at our base?  

Bob wrote:The irony is that Jesus of Nazareth,  at least how he's portrayed in the Bible,  was just as much a "humanist" as any humanist I've ever heard of.

SheWrites wrote:

Bob wrote:The irony is that Jesus of Nazareth,  at least how he's portrayed in the Bible,  was just as much a "humanist" as any humanist I've ever heard of.

I feel there is nothing wrong with "being like Jesus" and I can say from my observations most "religious" people are nothing like him, Bob.

PkrBum - that's my question. I sum it up as it doesn't matter where the "rules" come from but without any guidance it would be a free for all til death.

So there may be a parable in that...  

SheWrites wrote:

I feel there is nothing wrong with "being like Jesus" and I can say from my observations most "religious" people are nothing like him, Bob.

 

Bob wrote:

SheWrites wrote:


So, are humans inherently good or inherently evil?  Does that come one size fits all and then we change or is it inherent that we are good or evil at our base?  

Trying to apply the concept "is it good or is it evil" to human nature,  is like trying to apply it to anything in nature.  Nature is neither good nor is it evil,  it just is what it is.  And you cannot make a distinction between humans and nature.  We're a part of nature just like everything else.

colaguy wrote:

Bob wrote:

SheWrites wrote:


So, are humans inherently good or inherently evil?  Does that come one size fits all and then we change or is it inherent that we are good or evil at our base?  

Trying to apply the concept "is it good or is it evil" to human nature,  is like trying to apply it to anything in nature.  Nature is neither good nor is it evil,  it just is what it is.  And you cannot make a distinction between humans and nature.  We're a part of nature just like everything else.

Balderdash!

It is in the snake's nature is to strike the mouse and eat it. It is in the snail's nature is not to strike the mouse.  Humans have the power to reason - we can kill the mouse to eat it; we can kill our brother-in-law to eat him; we can chose to kill anything we see; we can chose NOT to kill anything. There are different "laws" at work here: the laws of nature are not subject to "morality". If gravity causes a boulder to fall off a cliff and strike a den of baby foxes, it is what it is - no evil going on.  The "laws" of humans, whether you call it morality, or God's laws, are such that there are consequences for our actions. We can purposefully cause the boulder to roll off the cliff onto the den of baby foxes and that is wrong or evil.  We have the POWER to decide to do it or not. If we do it, we cheapen ourselves by breaking the "laws" of humans.

Sorry to go all philosophical... I didnt study religion or philosophy.  It's just what's accumulated in my brain over the years.

SheWrites wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:
After all if good and evil are abstract human constructs and those constructs are all relative then any scale will be simply a respective summation unique to the specific individual and will in all probability be meaningless to someone else.

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSFU8fYkqDg

 

So, are humans inherently good or inherently evil?  Does that come one size fits all and then we change or is it inherent that we are good or evil at our base?  

Bob wrote:

colaguy wrote:

Bob wrote:

SheWrites wrote:


So, are humans inherently good or inherently evil?  Does that come one size fits all and then we change or is it inherent that we are good or evil at our base?  

Trying to apply the concept "is it good or is it evil" to human nature,  is like trying to apply it to anything in nature.  Nature is neither good nor is it evil,  it just is what it is.  And you cannot make a distinction between humans and nature.  We're a part of nature just like everything else.

Balderdash!

It is in the snake's nature is to strike the mouse and eat it. It is in the snail's nature is not to strike the mouse.  Humans have the power to reason - we can kill the mouse to eat it; we can kill our brother-in-law to eat him; we can chose to kill anything we see; we can chose NOT to kill anything. There are different "laws" at work here: the laws of nature are not subject to "morality". If gravity causes a boulder to fall off a cliff and strike a den of baby foxes, it is what it is - no evil going on.  The "laws" of humans, whether you call it morality, or God's laws, are such that there are consequences for our actions. We can purposefully cause the boulder to roll off the cliff onto the den of baby foxes and that is wrong or evil.  We have the POWER to decide to do it or not. If we do it, we cheapen ourselves by breaking the "laws" of humans.

Sorry to go all philosophical... I didnt study religion or philosophy.  It's just what's accumulated in my brain over the years.

No it's not balderdash.
And human "morality" is just as much a part of nature as anything else.
You can't separate anything human from nature.  We are part and parcel of nature.  How we behave,  the ideas we conceive,  all of it is part of nature.
Nature is the totality of everything in existence and we are simply a part of all that.

colaguy wrote:

It's possible for a guy to f@@k his sister, mother, brother, or a sheep, but is it moral?

SheWrites wrote:I think the stories of the Old Testament show the complete downside of mankind and no matter what they did to try to alleviate evil/ills of the world there was no answer.  

I think the revealing of Jesus, who himself said he was God in the flesh, came to say "You can't do it by yourself but it doesn't have to be about crossing every t and dotting every i."  His sermon on the mount gave a better understanding of what the commandments of the Old Testament were about.  And his commentary on those made it harder to live out, really, because it showed keeping a rule is easy compared to living by what is right in your heart.      That's why we'd rather have rules...in my humble opinion.

It's Jesus who said, "Love God with your whole heart and your neighbor has yourself."

He said this was the greatest commandment.  I mean think about it...wouldn't that solve a world of woes?

And you can find this same mindset in other philosophies and spiritual teachings.

I do feel men took something simple and screwed it up royally and called it religion.   

Here's something:  What do we call the polar opposites? If not good and evil, what then?

colaguy wrote:

Poppycock!

Certainly we can determine what humans do (and refrain from doing).  It's possible for a guy to f@@k his sister, mother, brother, or a sheep, but is it moral? Humans have the capacity to make choices - nature cannot. Nature's laws have been established (you may chose by whatever means), and they are inviolable. Rocks obey the law of gravity, they don't float in the air.  Elephants procreate with elephants, not zebras.  A corn seed does not sprout into a brocolli plant.