Finally the people are speaking......people need help....not judgment

Sal wrote:The children were unharmed in this case.

Neglect?

Possibly.

Felony child abuse?



Not even close.

2seaoat wrote:I only reported the truth that the windows were NOT closed.  However, let us say the mother went in for the job interview and the windows were completely open.........cannot a child die in a car with the windows completely open.....yes in the right conditions.   All I want is reliable links.   The usual suspects are doing exactly what they did with the victim in after Zimmerman killed Martin......looking for anything which made the person look bad to justify the unjustifiable.  There is absolutely no justifiable reason that these children should be taken from this mother or that she should be facing eight years in prison.  She should get pretrial diversion and be reunited with her children.   Maybe somebody can help her find a job with all the resources of the police state trying to put her in jail and destroy a family.

2seaoat wrote:Do you think Christ would try to help this woman and her children, or work to put her in jail for eight years and separate the children from their mother.  Some people here have advocated the same, and say I am calling racism.....duh....what Christian would not be working to help this woman....unless something in that person's subconscious disallowed Christian Charity to apply to some.......yep......I am wrong in picking up the usual patterns which when they repeatedly show up on so many threads, the usual suspects deny commonality.  

2seaoat wrote:I'm more inclined to help the helpless.....the children. This woman was getting help and her entire family lived in the area.

So you agree that she should be prosecuted and face eight years in jail?

Joanimaroni wrote:

Joanimaroni wrote:

othershoe1030 wrote:I think I fell asleep around page 10 of this thread last night. Round and round it goes and where it stops nobody knows.

What is the opposite of an echo chamber?

A chamber that you talk into and your words disappear without being heard. I think this is an imaginary thing but sometimes the discussions on this forum resemble such a creation.

No matter how many times oats and FT say the woman made a mistake they are not heard. They are accused of thinking her act was somehow justifiable by the opposition group.

This is another example of verbally hitting your head against a brick wall.

Personally I think the woman needs a group shelter to live in, parenting classes and of course a job. Things would get better for her and her children from that point on. Being sent to prison is just counter productive in my view as it breaks up the family further traumatizing the children.

I have volunteered with the Guardian Ad Litem people a bit and have seen horrible living conditions that exposed children to all sorts of dangers. Using that model children are removed from the dangerous situation until the parents have gotten their act together and then the family is reunited. That makes sense to me.

FT has not justified the acts of Ms. Taylor, however,  Seaoat continues to question the dangerousness of the incident and has minimized the seriousness of leaving the children in the car.   He questions the documented time in the car... and insists the windows were rolled down rather than just cracked.

Having been a Guardian Ad Litem you most likely have seen horrible situations for childrento live in.  There is a fine line judging if intervention and  parenting classes will work. In many cases you are gambling with the child's life.

I witnessed a situation of abuse involving 18 month old twins. The recommendation was temporary removal, counseling, and parenting classes. This recommendation was vehemently protested by the maternal and praternal grandparents to no avail.

The requirements were met and the twin boys returned to the home 6 weeks later.  Within a week....I watched my first autopsy on one of the twins......because the toddler was crying....his DADDY  held him by his legs and head slammed him into the wall until his brain was splattered everywhere.

Seeing dead children that are victims of parental abuse  changes your perspectives.

Behavioural change for adults is not always possible.

2seaoat wrote:I'm more inclined to help the helpless.....the children. This woman was getting help and her entire family lived in the area.

So you agree that she should be prosecuted and face eight years in jail?

othershoe1030 wrote:

Joanimaroni wrote:

Joanimaroni wrote:

othershoe1030 wrote:I think I fell asleep around page 10 of this thread last night. Round and round it goes and where it stops nobody knows.

What is the opposite of an echo chamber?

A chamber that you talk into and your words disappear without being heard. I think this is an imaginary thing but sometimes the discussions on this forum resemble such a creation.

No matter how many times oats and FT say the woman made a mistake they are not heard. They are accused of thinking her act was somehow justifiable by the opposition group.

This is another example of verbally hitting your head against a brick wall.

Personally I think the woman needs a group shelter to live in, parenting classes and of course a job. Things would get better for her and her children from that point on. Being sent to prison is just counter productive in my view as it breaks up the family further traumatizing the children.

I have volunteered with the Guardian Ad Litem people a bit and have seen horrible living conditions that exposed children to all sorts of dangers. Using that model children are removed from the dangerous situation until the parents have gotten their act together and then the family is reunited. That makes sense to me.

FT has not justified the acts of Ms. Taylor, however,  Seaoat continues to question the dangerousness of the incident and has minimized the seriousness of leaving the children in the car.   He questions the documented time in the car... and insists the windows were rolled down rather than just cracked.

Having been a Guardian Ad Litem you most likely have seen horrible situations for childrento live in.  There is a fine line judging if intervention and  parenting classes will work. In many cases you are gambling with the child's life.

I witnessed a situation of abuse involving 18 month old twins. The recommendation was temporary removal, counseling, and parenting classes. This recommendation was vehemently protested by the maternal and praternal grandparents to no avail.

The requirements were met and the twin boys returned to the home 6 weeks later.  Within a week....I watched my first autopsy on one of the twins......because the toddler was crying....his DADDY  held him by his legs and head slammed him into the wall until his brain was splattered everywhere.

Seeing dead children that are victims of parental abuse  changes your perspectives.

Behavioural change for adults is not always possible.

My God Joanie, how horrible!

2seaoat wrote:I'm more inclined to help the helpless.....the children. This woman was getting help and her entire family lived in the area.

So you agree that she should be prosecuted and face eight years in jail?

2seaoat wrote:By that standard, most parents would lose custody of their children.  Certainly my wife and I both left the kids in the car for short periods of time which if something had happened we too would be facing eight years in jail......nonsense.   I have been a guardian ad litem.   I have seen abuse. This was not abuse, it was potentially neglect, but the punishment is stupid, this is a pretrial diversion case and should not be prosecuted.  Tell me PK where in the statute it says that five minutes in a car is ok, but six minutes is an eight year jail sentence.....idiocy....ever hear of discretion.....prosecutors and police use it daily, and without it the system which you fight to deny would not work.

Talking about twins who had been brutally beaten and associating the same with this case is offensive.   At a core level, terribly offensive.  This mother was fighting for her children by trying to find employment.  She did not intentionally put her children in harms way, but was at worse terrible negligent not understanding the risk and therefore wrong.  However, to talk about autopsies and beaten children in the same breath as a mother doing a job interview and saying she should be prosecuted and separated from her children is as wrong as leaving the children in the car.

2seaoat wrote:So I am assuming that a job application is a positive thing for this woman and her children.  No assumption......fact.    Am I assuming that she put her children in the car to kill them.  No assumption......she was going to a job interview and was not intending to harm her children.

You comparing this woman to somebody who swings children around and kills them is offensive.  Deeply offensive.  This type of hatred has nothing to do with the well being of these children, any more than digging up Trayvon's pot use had anything to do with him being shot.......yet you repeatedly do this as do others, and when I repeatedly point this out, it is I who is using the race card.  Nope.  Your underlying racism is simply so powerful and comprehensive that you honestly do not see the same.  How do I see this.......because my family shares your beliefs.  I love them all, but they were simply trained as children in a manner they can never shed without a conscious effort.......and you do not see it, so you will never make any attempt to stop the consistent underlying racism which guides your political beliefs......

Neko to come.....shut up seaoat
Joani to come......double shut up seaoat
PK to come........government does not work
Pace.......just some more seaoat white guilt
Dot.....who is on first

2seaoat wrote:So I am assuming that a job application is a positive thing for this woman and her children. No assumption......fact. Am I assuming that she put her children in the car to kill them. No assumption......she was going to a job interview and was not intending to harm her children.

You comparing this woman to somebody who swings children around and kills them is offensive. Deeply offensive. This type of hatred has nothing to do with the well being of these children, any more than digging up Trayvon's pot use had anything to do with him being shot.......yet you repeatedly do this as do others, and when I repeatedly point this out, it is I who is using the race card. Nope. Your underlying racism is simply so powerful and comprehensive that you honestly do not see the same. How do I see this.......because my family shares your beliefs. I love them all, but they were simply trained as children in a manner they can never shed without a conscious effort.......and you do not see it, so you will never make any attempt to stop the consistent underlying racism which guides your political beliefs......

Neko to come.....shut up seaoat
Joani to come......double shut up seaoat
PK to come........government does not work
Pace.......just some more seaoat white guilt
Dot.....who is on first

Floridatexan wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Sal wrote:You gotta admit, Markie possesses a rather unique combination of mind-numbing stupidity and condescending attitude.

Cue Socrates in 5 ... 4 ... 3 ... 2 ... 1 ...

lol

Actually I think that description fits you, Boards, FT, Seaoat, and a few other supposedly enlightened progressive liberals to a T.

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ljy6PTbX9I

  

But then you have to consider the fact that no one really cares what you think.

2seaoat wrote:I think there is a well established pattern.  I will say she consistently comes to the defense of children, but that is not what I am referring to.......I am referring to the clear pattern which crosses over from thread to thread.  The first time I see her having compassion for a person of color and giving that person the same compassion she would extend to a white person, I will begin to see a change.  However, it is consistently.......hang the black person.

If it were one or five posts, one could easily conclude that I am full of chit..... but after hundreds of posts where this pattern is established and we have this debate every six months.......one of us is right, and one of us is wrong.   There is no middle ground.

PkrBum wrote:

2seaoat wrote:So I am assuming that a job application is a positive thing for this woman and her children.  No assumption......fact.    Am I assuming that she put her children in the car to kill them.  No assumption......she was going to a job interview and was not intending to harm her children.

You comparing this woman to somebody who swings children around and kills them is offensive.  Deeply offensive.  This type of hatred has nothing to do with the well being of these children, any more than digging up Trayvon's pot use had anything to do with him being shot.......yet you repeatedly do this as do others, and when I repeatedly point this out, it is I who is using the race card.  Nope.  Your underlying racism is simply so powerful and comprehensive that you honestly do not see the same.  How do I see this.......because my family shares your beliefs.  I love them all, but they were simply trained as children in a manner they can never shed without a conscious effort.......and you do not see it, so you will never make any attempt to stop the consistent underlying racism which guides your political beliefs......

Neko to come.....shut up seaoat
Joani to come......double shut up seaoat
PK to come........government does not work
Pace.......just some more seaoat white guilt
Dot.....who is on first

Govt can and would work fine if it's job were as a simple arbiter... using simple quantifiable laws. No stake in the game... no picking winners and losers... no benefit or subsidy... no laws or codes so voluminous that they can't be known readily.

general welfare = to the benefit of all citizens

Scares the shit out of you... doesn't it.

Nekochan wrote:LOL, about Pkr--but hey, he's right about a lot of things!

Dreams, how was the Easter egg hunt?