How to build a Community

I like that a lot. I bet seaoat does too. I think we've found something you two can agree on with this.

I just hope there's a few gun owners willing to protect your little utopia from the government intrusion you are bound to experience.

Needs more cowbell....other than that, pretty decent list.

The new Library has opened up a new venue for me to do so. I am energized.

That is excellent,and hopefully others will find their way as well,but the truth is book check outs nationwide have been declining, and we are failing in our mission to train our children in the new methodologies of the world so at least they can have the tools to compete, because in fact jobs do exist for those trained and ready......so

I must create a system or be enslaved by another mans; I will not reason and compare: my business is to create.
William Blake


so we fail....and in fact in time we will in fact be enslaved....not because it was predestined, rather we became soft and comfortable in failure, and reasoned that Mayberry can be returned to if we only step back in time and follow a script on what makes a good neighborhood or lose focus and the very ability to differentiate the same......nope.....I love libraries....I love vibrant communities, but when your children do not have the tools to compete, when your nation has lost its comparative advantage in growing industries, and when we pour our resources down the rabbit hole of misguided aspirations while ignoring the obvious.....well no....Seaoat is not in agreement......not even close to being in agreement, when the need is so great, and the solution so ill conceived.

other than that, pretty decent list.

Agreed....it is a very good list......but quite frankly its assumptions are fascinating........in the omission of anything which deals with how economic development drives a community, it aspires to be nothing more than a window dressing for the assumed continued dominance of the American economic engine.......an assumption which takes more than a wish list. It takes coordinated policy from congress and funding to address the very survival of this nation which is blessed with so much in the way of natural resources, world class road systems, and once world class educational systems which fed the century of innovation........now we must endure quaint lists and congress working about half the time they need to work to address our nation's peril......but sure the library will work to close the growing systemic gap......between the very competitive world market we live and the Mayberry we want to return.....there is no right or wrong argument....there is only real solutions which accomplish real goals, and I guess some folks feel the new library is a solution.......I believe it is the problem......so no......we are not even near agreement.

2seaoat wrote:Seaoat is not in agreement......not even close to being in agreement, when the need is so great, and the solution so ill conceived.

Well now I'm confused. When I said I thought you would be in agreement, I was only referring to this. I didn't see it say anything about a library. lol

Bob wrote:

2seaoat wrote:Seaoat is not in agreement......not even close to being in agreement, when the need is so great, and the solution so ill conceived.

Well now I'm confused. When I said I thought you would be in agreement, I was only referring to this. I didn't see it say anything about a library. lol

I think SO was adding to the list the fact that a well organized utopian society needs a central zone of quiet knowledge...a Library. Mortar and brick...not something we find on goggle.

I would agree with that. I go to the Tryon Branch quite a bit.

http://cnsnews.com/blog/gregory-gwyn-williams-jr/patriotic-group-build-armed-defensible-neighborhood-fortress

A group of like-minded patriots, bound together by pride in American exceptionalism, plan on building an armed community to protect their liberty.

The group, named Citadel, intends to purchase 2,000 to 3,000 acres for the project in western Idaho. The community will comprise of 3,500 to 7,000 families of patriotic Americans who "voluntarily choose to live together in accordance with Thomas Jefferson's ideal of Rightful Liberty."

According to the Citadel website, Rightful Liberty means that "neighbors keep their noses out of other neighbors' business, that neighbors live and let live."

Citadel explains that residents in the community will be bound by the following:

Patriotism
Pride in American Exceptionalism
Our proud history of Liberty as defined by our Founding Fathers, and
Physical preparedness to survive and prevail in the face of natural catastrophes --such as Hurricanes Sandy or Katrina -- or man-made catastrophes such as a power grid failure or economic collapse.

I'll try to give myself a score (from 1 to 10) on the different things on that list.

turn off your tv......... -1

leave home............... 5

know your neighbors... 3

greet people............. 6

look up when you're walking.... 2

sit on your stoop.......... 5 (but only if I include my back patio LOL - 0 if it's the front stoop)

plant flowers................ 0 if they're live flowers, 10 if they're plastic LOL

use your library............ 1 (sorry, seaoat, I didn't see this one when I wrote that last post)

play together............. 8 (if drinking counts as "playing") lol

buy from local merchants... 4

share what you have....... 6

help a lost dog................. 5

take children to the park...... 0

honor elders.................. 8

support neighborhood schools........ 1

fix it even if you didn't break it........ 4

have pot lucks....................... 2

garden together................... 0

pick up litter.......................... 8

read stories aloud.................. 0

dance in the street................ 0

talk to a mail carrier............... 7

listen to the birds.................. 8

put up a swing...................... I gave my swing to yella's daughter

help carry something heavy....... 7

barter for your goods............. 10

start a tradition...................... 5

ask a question....................... 10

hire young people for odd jobs.... 0

organize a block party.............. 0

ask for help when you need it. 2

bake extra and share............. 0 but only because nobody wants what I bake.

open your shades........................ 0

sing together............................. 0

share your skills......................... 10

take back the night................... don't know what that means exactly

turn up the music........................ 7

turn down the music.................... 4

listen before you react to anger........ undecided

mediate a conflict..................... 7

seek to understand.................... 9

learn from new and uncomfortable angles.... 9

know that no one is silent yet many are not heard. work to change this... I would like to but I don't know how

Bob.....you should not be confused......the very list assumes American prosperity......as if ignorance and poverty will breed quaint neighbors and community. As if building a large monster library will do the same. When other nations plan economic advantage and prepare their citizens to compete in the world markets, we debate on how to build great communities without a moments question on the critical assumption.......How can we build communities when we fail to prepare our children to compete in the modern world and we lose our comparative advantage. The balance of trade and the collapse of the dollar will have far more impact on community building than holding a quaint block party or turning off the tv.

I spent my youth writing on economic integration and nation building in Latin America where poverty, despair, and dictatorships were the result of failed economic policy and government solutions. Today Argentina, Peru, Brazil, are having huge success and a growing median income while in America we fail to address the economic nexus and focus on window dressings like a failed and morally worn out empire. No, of course we can make improvements in neighborhoods by achieving some of the goals, but when Hallmark acts bewildered at the loss of quality jobs and the resulting despair, and argues that economic goals are bad.......well at least something as obviously successful as the park, and then argues that a library which once being built has resulted in 33% reduction in operating hours district wide....and now if we only work on making our neighborhoods better..........well we just fundamentally disagree where the focus must concentrate. I believe that national and regional economic development must be our focus, and that education must prepare our citizens for this competitive world.....and that the decline is based in part on natural cyclical economic trends, but too much is based on poor performance and guidance from our political leaders to address our economy and the loss of our comparative advantages. So when I hear criticism of the building of our economic system by key investment, and then hear about how grand inefficient expenditures in buildings which do nothing to fill the educational gap......well I simply get tired. You see after the grand opening.....the doors will remain shuttered.....the books checked out will continue to drop.....the kids will open the want ads and not have the skills of the so many jobs available to the skilled, as more factories get shipped abroad as we endure more uncoordinated economic policy....and so it goes.....fat and content.

2seaoat wrote: You see after the grand opening......
the books checked out will continue to drop....

in other words about like the "community maritime park". lol

Bob.....we will have all the time in the world to nail that list.....hell we will all be unemployed and sitting on the front porch.....after pouring billions down the rabbit hole of misguided public policy......we will watch our economic future continue to slide......and heck we can all work on the list.....we all will have plenty of time to make our neighborhoods better......yep.....a big thumbs up to that.

2seaoat wrote:Bob.....we will have all the time in the world to nail that list.....hell we will all be unemployed and sitting on the front porch.....after pouring billions down the rabbit hole of misguided public policy......we will watch our economic future continue to slide......and heck we can all work on the list.....we all will have plenty of time to make our neighborhoods better......yep.....a big thumbs up to that.

Hey Obama will save you...ROTFLMAO....through BIG GOVERNMENT...YOUR FAVORITE.

Bob wrote:I'll try to give myself a score (from 1 to 10) on the different things on that list.

turn off your tv......... -1

leave home............... 5

know your neighbors... 3

greet people............. 6

look up when you're walking.... 2

sit on your stoop.......... 5 (but only if I include my back patio LOL - 0 if it's the front stoop)

plant flowers................ 0 if they're live flowers, 10 if they're plastic LOL

use your library............ 1 (sorry, seaoat, I didn't see this one when I wrote that last post)

play together............. 8 (if drinking counts as "playing") lol

buy from local merchants... 4

share what you have....... 6

help a lost dog................. 5

take children to the park...... 0

honor elders.................. 8

support neighborhood schools........ 1

fix it even if you didn't break it........ 4

have pot lucks....................... 2

garden together................... 0

pick up litter.......................... 8

read stories aloud.................. 0

dance in the street................ 0

talk to a mail carrier............... 7

listen to the birds.................. 8

put up a swing...................... I gave my swing to yella's daughter

help carry something heavy....... 7

barter for your goods............. 10

start a tradition...................... 5

ask a question....................... 10

hire young people for odd jobs.... 0

organize a block party.............. 0

ask for help when you need it. 2

bake extra and share............. 0 but only because nobody wants what I bake.

open your shades........................ 0

sing together............................. 0

share your skills......................... 10

take back the night................... don't know what that means exactly

turn up the music........................ 7

turn down the music.................... 4

listen before you react to anger........ undecided

mediate a conflict..................... 7

seek to understand.................... 9

learn from new and uncomfortable angles.... 9

know that no one is silent yet many are not heard. work to change this... I would like to but I don't know how

Bob, you're so funny sometimes!

But I love the list and love your scoring yourself on it.

I guess I would start by confiscating the guns... limiting free speech... suspend protected rights... total taxation...

Then I'd go to sleep and dream up some great ideas for tomorrow.

What you posted got me to thinking, Pkr. It got me to thinking "what public policy do I think we should pursue to solve the country's problems?"

About 10 minutes has elapsed since I asked myself that question. And so far I'm drawing a blank.
And I think the reason is that it's just too hard a problem for anyone to be able to solve. Because I'm not aware of anyone else who has been able to come up with a solution either.

But right now I feel pretty certain of this. If I had to cite one individual who I think comes the closest to being able to cope with it now, I'd probably name Chris Christie.

There's no point in anyone making a response to this unless it's something I haven't already heard. And I've heard a whole lot of both the praise and the criticism on this guy. Hasn't fazed me yet.

Christie ? have you lost your fricken mind ? get government OUT of the way of free enterprise stop all this corporate fascism bullshit and fire all the Washington royalty.

TEOTWAWKI wrote:Christie ? have you lost your fricken mind ?

Help me out. What is it about Christie and his ideas and his job performance that you don't like?

TEOTWAWKI wrote: get government OUT of the way of free enterprise

stop all this corporate fascism bullshit

and fire all the Washington royalty.

I completely concur with firing the Washington royalty. But of course there's a pretty wide margin between wanting that to happen and what can actually make it happen. I don't have enough influence on voters for that.

But about the first two sentences. How can we stop corporations from behaving like fascists without government regulation (of corporations) of some kind?
The two things are not consistent.

Bob wrote:

TEOTWAWKI wrote: get government OUT of the way of free enterprise

stop all this corporate fascism bullshit

and fire all the Washington royalty.

I completely concur with firing the Washington royalty. But of course there's a pretty wide margin between wanting that to happen and what can actually make it happen. I don't have enough influence on voters for that.

But about the first two sentences. How can we stop corporations from behaving like fascists without government regulation (of corporations) of some kind?
The two things are not consistent.

Well the only power the people really have when the government and corporations are in bed together is the power of the purse....we shouldn't buy their crap...of course they have made that almost impossible by wiping out all their competition through EPA and other government intervention...

TEOTWAWKI wrote:



Well the only power the people really have when the government and corporations are in bed together is the power of the purse....we shouldn't buy their crap...of course they have made that almost impossible by wiping out all their competition through EPA and other government intervention...

But it's that consumerism for mass produced corporate product which is now the foundation of our entire economy. If we pursue a policy to abandon our support for that, it's going to produce one whole helluva lot of personal suffering.

See, that's why I said I have no solution. This thing is not as simple and easy as the public dialogue (either from national celebrities or bloggers like ourselves) pretends it to be.

Sorry... But I'm going to arrest you both since I've suspended due process and you're violation of my new free speech laws.

Have a nice day.

Bob wrote:

TEOTWAWKI wrote:



Well the only power the people really have when the government and corporations are in bed together is the power of the purse....we shouldn't buy their crap...of course they have made that almost impossible by wiping out all their competition through EPA and other government intervention...

But it's that consumerism for mass produced corporate product which is now the foundation of our entire economy. If we pursue a policy to abandon our support for that, it's going to produce one whole helluva lot of personal suffering.

See, that's why I said I have no solution. This thing is not as simple and easy as the public dialogue (either from national celebrities or bloggers like ourselves) pretends it to be.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<

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The hair club thing was superfluous....a mere distraction to confuse you while you're deciding to order those jeans.

And some gold while you're at it. Couple of coins to put in the pocket of those jeans.

Call now....all others may call later.