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Pensacola Discussion Forum » General Discussion » Bobby Knight No Longer Biggest Asshole in Basketball History

Bobby Knight No Longer Biggest Asshole in Basketball History

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Sal

Sal

Sheesh ...

2seaoat



Cry me a river. I was shoved and pushed, and I once had a coach get angry and throw the ball up against the wall because in scrimmage we were not running the play......well it rolled off his fingers and hit me in the face full blast.....he just about crapped in his pants......apologized, and then the entire team stood their laughing at me.....and finally he could not keep it in and began laughing. I do not encourage this behavior and perhaps the Rutgers coach should have lost his job, but damn we have become a country of wussies. I am so tired of the male perspective being powder puffed until we are a bunch of eunichs who are politically correct......Mr. Seaoat.....will you please slide over and set the pick and hold your ground.......I am sorry....was my voice too stern........would you like to take a time out and think about what we discussed?

knothead

knothead

I disagree Mr. Oats. Probably the very best coaches in the country use tactics much more intelligent . . . . . can you imagine Coach K throwing a hissy fit like this character . . . . . . . I was coached tough as well and punished where necessary by running an extra 100 laps around the court AFTER practice for rule infractions but this is bullshit pure and simple, he belongs in the hall of shame with Knight.

2seaoat



My son in law played college ball with Curtis Granderson who is the Yankee centerfielder. They went to the college world series and got beat by a very good Stanford team. He did not get along with one of the coaches and the guy disrespected him and he went after the coach and had to be held back by players. He is a big boy and would have crushed this coach.......the coach apologized in front of the whole team.....if somebody is disrespecting me and I am in college......they are going to get some feed back, and I do not like uninvited physical contact......but really......do you think a warning or a couple days without pay is more constructive than firing this guy. I really do think this country has turned boys into girls starting in 7th grade where they are systematically broken down if they show too much energy or even the slightest male defiance. It is not by accident that our schools have such a high drop out rate among males......this one size fits all mamby pamby crap really has reached the far reaches of the pendulum.....and we need a kick in the pants every once in awhile without getting our panties in a wad to bring that pendulum back to the middle.

Guest


Guest

Sal wrote:Sheesh ...


Gotta ask the question....would HOF Coaches like Bear Bryant...Bob Knight..Woody Hayes...etc., and others even have had the opportunity to coach in this politically correct environment?...Not defending the Rutgers coach because in this day and age he should have known better and what the outrage would be...

Guest


Guest

I never played any college sports. But I know how things work in the real world. I have worked some very rough jobs where manners were not required.
I remarried in 97 and invited my new wife to some down to work and watch the launch of a new boat. The way we do it is slow and stressful. There is zero room for error. We had a few issues and things really got busy, After awhile I looked around to see how she was doing. I found her in the car and she was crying. I asked What the matter? She said "All of you are so mean and hateful to each other, How can you stand to work in such a place? "I thought you were a good person." I said "We are working, we are men, it is just what we do. It may not be right or correct but that is the way it is"
The next week we had a launch party. It was always a big deal and the boss always went first class for us. Catered food, beer, wine , whiskey, Etc , music, and most of the time a bonus. She could not believe we were all very good friends and could party together and would help each other out in times of need. But it was true.

Sal

Sal

newswatcher wrote:

Gotta ask the question....would HOF Coaches like Bear Bryant...Bob Knight..Woody Hayes...etc., and others even have had the opportunity to coach in this politically correct environment?...Not defending the Rutgers coach because in this day and age he should have known better and what the outrage would be...

Bob Knight and Woody Hayes lost their jobs due to their violent outbursts.

That's not coaching, it's bullying.

I've had many coaches, and I coach currently.

That is an ineffective method of coaching, and more importantly, it's an abuse of a position of authority.

knothead

knothead

2seaoat wrote:My son in law played college ball with Curtis Granderson who is the Yankee centerfielder. They went to the college world series and got beat by a very good Stanford team. He did not get along with one of the coaches and the guy disrespected him and he went after the coach and had to be held back by players. He is a big boy and would have crushed this coach.......the coach apologized in front of the whole team.....if somebody is disrespecting me and I am in college......they are going to get some feed back, and I do not like uninvited physical contact......but really......do you think a warning or a couple days without pay is more constructive than firing this guy. I really do think this country has turned boys into girls starting in 7th grade where they are systematically broken down if they show too much energy or even the slightest male defiance. It is not by accident that our schools have such a high drop out rate among males......this one size fits all mamby pamby crap really has reached the far reaches of the pendulum.....and we need a kick in the pants every once in awhile without getting our panties in a wad to bring that pendulum back to the middle.

******************************************************

I don't disagree with your premise Mr. Oats . . . . . . for the record I do not advocate the mamby pamby crap either BUT this person is not a coach he is a classic bully. His pattern is beyond the pale . . . . . . I am for tough minded coaches who simultaneously motivate each player to be the best they can be. To not fire him sends a signal that it is basically okay to bully and that message then translates to the team, to the student body, to the school . . . . . . he absolutely should go . . . . . . .

Guest


Guest

2seaoat wrote:My son in law played college ball with Curtis Granderson who is the Yankee centerfielder. They went to the college world series and got beat by a very good Stanford team. He did not get along with one of the coaches and the guy disrespected him and he went after the coach and had to be held back by players. He is a big boy and would have crushed this coach.......the coach apologized in front of the whole team.....if somebody is disrespecting me and I am in college......they are going to get some feed back, and I do not like uninvited physical contact......but really......do you think a warning or a couple days without pay is more constructive than firing this guy. I really do think this country has turned boys into girls starting in 7th grade where they are systematically broken down if they show too much energy or even the slightest male defiance. It is not by accident that our schools have such a high drop out rate among males......this one size fits all mamby pamby crap really has reached the far reaches of the pendulum.....and we need a kick in the pants every once in awhile without getting our panties in a wad to bring that pendulum back to the middle.

He was already suspended for it,Seaoat. What are you talking about?

boards of FL

boards of FL

2seaoat wrote:Cry me a river. I was shoved and pushed, and I once had a coach get angry and throw the ball up against the wall because in scrimmage we were not running the play......well it rolled off his fingers and hit me in the face full blast.....he just about crapped in his pants......apologized, and then the entire team stood their laughing at me.....and finally he could not keep it in and began laughing. I do not encourage this behavior and perhaps the Rutgers coach should have lost his job, but damn we have become a country of wussies. I am so tired of the male perspective being powder puffed until we are a bunch of eunichs who are politically correct......Mr. Seaoat.....will you please slide over and set the pick and hold your ground.......I am sorry....was my voice too stern........would you like to take a time out and think about what we discussed?

Since when does "male perspective" equate to "raging asshole"?


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Guest


Guest

The coach, athletic director and school president will all end up losing their jobs over this.. Fuck'em they deserve it..

boards of FL

boards of FL

This guy represents the antithesis of manliness. He knows that these kids can't retaliate, so he feels free to act like a complete douche. How is that manly? How is picking on people that you know cannot fight back considered manly?

Just because someone holds a position that, behind closed doors at least, affords them the ability to be a total douche, that doesn't mean they should be a total douche.

Anyone ever see Coach K do anything even remotely close to this?



Last edited by boards of FL on 4/4/2013, 2:09 pm; edited 1 time in total


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2seaoat



My wife and I have discussed this topic for her 35 year career as a teacher. The first 20 years was as a fifth Grade teacher. She saw how unruly male students were systematically broken down and dismissed. She saw between the fifth grade and eighth grade boys and aggressive male rough housing was extinguished by a systematic beating down the spirit of boys. She had bright and talented fifth graders who were always a handful, but they were learning, and by the eighth grade they had given up on school....it was not a place for them.

I have coached. I have never lost my temper or made contact with one of my players. However, part of the problem is that players were submissive mostly because scholarships were involved. This coach in this situation conducted himself unprofessionally, but when dealing with males in sports I find the punishment does not fit the crime. He should have been suspended and put on probation. If he was on probation as Dreams has suggested, and was still conducting himself this way, then termination was correct. I would give the coach one freebee as a player, but if he regularly pushed me or threw a ball at me, I would go to his office and close the door so not to embarrass him in front of the team, and then make my situation worse. You sometimes have to toughen up and not be so politically correct. I know my opinion is not popular, but I think the trend over the last 30 years has resulted in a slight shift from females being statistically more likely to drop out, to now where males are dropping out at a higher rate, even though dropout rates are the best in years. I am suggesting that the removal of corporal punishment in a politically correct world where simple verbal commands should get responses has subjugated Junior High Boys to behavior which historically in the British tradition of corporal punishment allowed boys to remain high functioning and finish school.

So when we see a coach using a type of corporal punishment, we go into a tizzy fit and get our panties in a was without looking at the statistical trends in male education. I know this is unpopular, and I would certainly like to hear from some of our coaches and teachers.

Guest


Guest

I like your analysis and the context seaoat... but it's old school and won't be received well in this age.

I also think this guy crossed a line that good coaches wouldn't have simply because it is not the way to get the best results.

I would've expressed my objections right to the coach in private. If it continued to the ad. And if that didn't fix it leave. But if that sob put his hands on me or beaned me I'd have defended myself till the ambulance arrived for him. I could never have taken that.

Sal

Sal

It's poor coaching and an abuse of a position of authority.

Period.

2seaoat



It's poor coaching and an abuse of a position of authority.

Period.

I am not disagreeing, but I am qualifying what I think is a problem. When I was in Boy Scouts I had a Scoutmaster who weighed about 270lbs and was about six feet tall. He was a big man. He would often curse out scouts and intimidate them. He was trying to do that to three of us, when he said scout A you are a follower, Seaoat you are an instigator, and Scout C, you are a dumb asz...............to which I responded that he should not use curse words to describe a Scout in his troop. He hit me in the chest and I flew literally about six feet onto a gravel area which tore my pants, but I immediately got back up( I was not a small kid, but I was no match for this giant) and got in front of him, and said I hope you feel better, but you should not curse us or hit us and your behavior is unacceptable.......his face turned bright red....he wanted to hit me with a fist in the face, but fortunately a number of other Scoutmasters had seen him hit me, and they had seen me bounce back up and calmly tell him that his behavior was wrong.

I never had another problem with that man and became an Eagle Scout. I could have whimpered to somebody and had them punish him, but I have never been afraid of bullies, yet today our solution to bullies is to whimper to authorities rather than having kids simply not allow it to happen....yes that is easier said than done, but the trend is that some higher authority will resolve our problems.....and in transferring that jurisdiction we leave our gonads on the floor. These were college men. I am 100% with PK and as men we need to handle things looking a person in the eyeballs......now if that Scoutmaster had hit me a second time with a clenched fist to the face......well I probably would have been slow to get up, but I had shown no disrespect, and had simply stood my ground, and he was going to have to kill me before I backed down......a 13 year old kid can stand his ground yet 20 year old adults allow a coach to man handle them......no, the University never should have had to get involved....but again......we are training youth to accept no responsibility in the bully cycle, and transferring it to a higher authority......this just does not sit well.

Guest


Guest

Did they have a winning team?

Sal

Sal

2seaoat wrote:
I am not disagreeing, but I am qualifying what I think is a problem. When I was in Boy Scouts I had a Scoutmaster who weighed about 270lbs and was about six feet tall. He was a big man. He would often curse out scouts and intimidate them. He was trying to do that to three of us, when he said scout A you are a follower, Seaoat you are an instigator, and Scout C, you are a dumb asz...............to which I responded that he should not use curse words to describe a Scout in his troop. He hit me in the chest and I flew literally about six feet onto a gravel area which tore my pants, but I immediately got back up( I was not a small kid, but I was no match for this giant) and got in front of him, and said I hope you feel better, but you should not curse us or hit us and your behavior is unacceptable.......his face turned bright red....he wanted to hit me with a fist in the face, but fortunately a number of other Scoutmasters had seen him hit me, and they had seen me bounce back up and calmly tell him that his behavior was wrong.

I never had another problem with that man and became an Eagle Scout. I could have whimpered to somebody and had them punish him, but I have never been afraid of bullies, yet today our solution to bullies is to whimper to authorities rather than having kids simply not allow it to happen....yes that is easier said than done, but the trend is that some higher authority will resolve our problems.....and in transferring that jurisdiction we leave our gonads on the floor. These were college men. I am 100% with PK and as men we need to handle things looking a person in the eyeballs......now if that Scoutmaster had hit me a second time with a clenched fist to the face......well I probably would have been slow to get up, but I had shown no disrespect, and had simply stood my ground, and he was going to have to kill me before I backed down......a 13 year old kid can stand his ground yet 20 year old adults allow a coach to man handle them......no, the University never should have had to get involved....but again......we are training youth to accept no responsibility in the bully cycle, and transferring it to a higher authority......this just does not sit well.

So, you prefer to question the character of the victims of abuse rather than that of the abuser?

You're one tough hombre, Mr. Oats.

2seaoat



I don't want to make this simply a male/female issue when dealing with inappropriate coaching behavior, but I remember in High School my daughter had 11 varsity letters. She was intelligent and a great athlete. However her junior year they were beating everybody in basketball when her coach benched her and another player for no reason, and sat them for the last quarter, and the team lost the game on a Friday night. The parents were all upset. They wanted to go to the administration, and thought the coach intentionally lost the game to give some kind of lesson. I have to admit I was pissed, but I never said anything. I always told my kids they had to fight their own fights. Well, I have never been prouder of my daughter. The other girl was crying and emotional, my daughter simply walked up to the coach and in front of other players said I expect a full apology for what you did tonight, and I expect it in front of the entire team at Monday's practice.

Her Mom and I are hot, and start asking what the hell was that all about when she gets in the car after the game, and she calmly said........I took care of it, and I expect an apology for what he did tonight, and an explanation for his behavior. He apologized to the entire team and explained that he was angry with the two girls and rather than explaining what he wanted done.....he benched them, and that was wrong.

My point is that my daughter is a stronger person today dealing with a coach who was wrong directly. If you have kids participating in sports the petty intervention by parents wanting higher authorities to resolve some wrong being done to their kids who are not playing enough is just the tip of the iceberg which has been transforming this nation over the last 30 years. When we fire this coach we reinforce that the victims are helpless, rather we need to make sure every player in any sport knows that they have recourse and they have the right to defend themselves from a coach who has crossed the line. That starts at the athletic director, who in my opinion is more responsible than this prick.......that was his job....to monitor the behavior of his coaches.

2seaoat



So, you prefer to question the character of the victims of abuse rather than that of the abuser?

I prefer to create an environment where a league is established which clearly sets forth the rights of players to confront wrong doing. Not the parents. Not the league authorities, rather to instill self reliance and mechanisms which encourage the same. My proudest moments in my life was establishing youth athletic programs over two counties, and I have been the one who had to deal with 60 coaches in 4 sports to make sure the integrity of the entire program could be maintained. How would you like to wake up and read the morning paper and find out the coach of one of your soccer teams just robbed the local bank......it is a constant battle addressing inappropriate behavior, but my questions are not about the character of the victims, rather the process which allows them to become victims.....again the mamby pamby get your panties in a wad crowd are mostly correct, but I am suggesting in this political correction the pendulum has swung to far, and that young boys are being neutered as we instill this concept that somebody will take care of your problems........so to the extent that process can be addressed, we should never even have to question the character of the victims, because a coach like this would not be tolerated by his players.

Sal

Sal

2seaoat wrote:That starts at the athletic director, who in my opinion is more responsible than this prick.......that was his job....to monitor the behavior of his coaches.

Anybody and everybody except the prick is to blame for this, eh?

I agree that the AD should be fired as well.

boards of FL

boards of FL

2seaoat wrote:I am not disagreeing, but I am qualifying what I think is a problem. When I was in Boy Scouts I had a Scoutmaster who weighed about 270lbs and was about six feet tall. He was a big man. He would often curse out scouts and intimidate them. He was trying to do that to three of us, when he said scout A you are a follower, Seaoat you are an instigator, and Scout C, you are a dumb asz...............to which I responded that he should not use curse words to describe a Scout in his troop. He hit me in the chest and I flew literally about six feet onto a gravel area which tore my pants, but I immediately got back up( I was not a small kid, but I was no match for this giant) and got in front of him, and said I hope you feel better, but you should not curse us or hit us and your behavior is unacceptable.......his face turned bright red....he wanted to hit me with a fist in the face, but fortunately a number of other Scoutmasters had seen him hit me, and they had seen me bounce back up and calmly tell him that his behavior was wrong.

I never had another problem with that man and became an Eagle Scout. I could have whimpered to somebody and had them punish him, but I have never been afraid of bullies, yet today our solution to bullies is to whimper to authorities rather than having kids simply not allow it to happen....yes that is easier said than done, but the trend is that some higher authority will resolve our problems.....and in transferring that jurisdiction we leave our gonads on the floor. These were college men. I am 100% with PK and as men we need to handle things looking a person in the eyeballs......now if that Scoutmaster had hit me a second time with a clenched fist to the face......well I probably would have been slow to get up, but I had shown no disrespect, and had simply stood my ground, and he was going to have to kill me before I backed down......a 13 year old kid can stand his ground yet 20 year old adults allow a coach to man handle them......no, the University never should have had to get involved....but again......we are training youth to accept no responsibility in the bully cycle, and transferring it to a higher authority......this just does not sit well.

I think you're completely missing the point here, 2seaoat. These Rutgers players didn't put up with with this asshole because they lack bravery, manliness, or gonads. If this type of thing were happening to them in something as casual as a boy scout troop meeting, any of these guys would have laid this asshole out where he stood. This is nothing like that. These are kids who are likely attending school on a academic scholarship, some with hopes of perhaps playing in the NBA. They can't lay this guy out or put him in his place because that would mean jeopardizing an opportunity at a free college education or a chance to play in the NBA. These asshole coaches know this so the "manliness" comes out.


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boards of FL

boards of FL

Lurch wrote:Did they have a winning team?

Nope. 15-16 on the season.


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2seaoat



Anybody and everybody except the prick is to blame for this, eh?

Well......yes. How do you stop bullying? Punishment of the bully? Really? Or creating an environment which does not allow bullying to even happen. In my opinion the players and the Athletic administration share responsibility for not correcting this classic bully conduct. I listened to the Prick, and he is a typical type A personality like my JV coach in high School......it was always more about him, and our varsity coach was this spitting image of Coach Wooden......calm and soft spoken.....in the real world we have to adapt and deal with the full spectrum, but our kids need to be taught that they can tell people no.....and that they can defend themselves.....not go run and have somebody help them.......It may seem that I am rationalizing his behavior....that is not my intent, but the problem is more systemic than this coach is a prick.......PK nailed it.

2seaoat



These Rutgers players didn't put up with with this asshole because they lack bravery, manliness, or gonads.

Sorry, I will respectfully disagree. My son in law had scouts from all over the nation with speed guns and clipboards watching Curtis Granderson and approached him repeatedly about minor league ball.....baseball was his whole life and he wanted to play in the majors.......when his coach crossed the line, he went after him and everybody on that field knew who was right........If we train people to allow injustice, then bullying exists, and we have this illusion that a bully will be corrected by "authorities" bullies need a community to deal with them....every player on that team, the administration, and the second you sell your soul to the devil is the day playing in the NBA means more than your integrity.....then you have nothing.....My son in law got less playing time after the incident, and decided not to do the minor league grind, but he did not tolerate a bully, and in the end he is a better person.

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