Lets talk about GOV Pensions if we may

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Nekochan wrote:Doesn't sound like any education course schedule that I've heard of. Did you do the practicums, the certification exams, the internship?
Did you ever earn your teaching degree?

I realize the training and work involved in making rank in the military. But while you were working to make it to E-2, E-3, E-4, etc-- those in the teaching program were also studying and working, and doing so without pay and while paying for their schooling. At E-6, you'd be on a career track in the military...why would anyone get out after making E-6?

The colleges, and attitudes like yours, about military training; along with lack of funds to continue; forced me to reevaluate my decision of becoming a teacher in a progressive liberal politically motivated educational system.

That's alright. One less high school science and math teacher is no biggy in the grand scheme of things. I enjoy having to reteach things to my children and grandchildren because to the ineptness of our educational system.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

So basically, you didn't make it to the point of practicums, certification exams and internship. Is that it? Every college freshman is going to have classes in the humanities and arts--those classes are electives. The theory is that every college graduate should have some exposure to the arts and humanities. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lack of funds? You didn't have the GI Bill? Yes, college is a huge expense. That's what I meant when I said that while you were working and getting paid, education majors were working and NOT getting paid. When the military trains you, it's also paying you. When a teacher is training, they are not being paid--but they are paying a lot of money for that training.

I think extremely highly of military training and discipline. I told you that my son got excellent training in the Army. He was also paid while he received that training. He had a roof over his head and food to eat AND money in his pocket while he was training. That means a lot. He got some of the best training that the military offers. But just because he (or you or anyone) spent some time in the military doesn't mean that he then can waltz into college, take a couple of classes and have a degree. It doesn't work that way. No matter how good of a soldier he was--it doesn't work that way. He made a choice at 18 NOT to go to college. He took a different route. It's paid off very well for him, because he was able to get very good training in the Army. But does that mean that he can go to school, take a couple of classes and be a teacher? No. It doesn't take away the fact that while he was being paid to learn, some of his friends were paying to learn. His friends who chose college didn't have anyone, at 18 and in college, making sure that they got up in the morning in time to make it to class--AND paying them to be there in class. You cannot discount the 4 years that full time college students go without a full time job, while paying to learn their skill. How much money does the average military enlistee make in the 4 years after they enlist--60K or so? How much is their military training worth? A person who's spent 4 years in college is already 4 years behind in earnings. Which is why, for some people, especially if they can get a good specialty--the military is a very good choice. The big downside is that you lose rights when you join the military and if the military sends you into a battle zone--you have to go. No one has stressed that point, I think, on this forum, than I have. Which is why so many times I have said that the military cannot be treated like a civilian job. Military people should get special benefits because of the sacrifices they make and the risks that they take. I don't think that teachers should be put on a military pay scale anymore than I think that service in the military should be treated like any other 40 hour a week civilian job.

Nekochan wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Nekochan wrote:Doesn't sound like any education course schedule that I've heard of. Did you do the practicums, the certification exams, the internship?
Did you ever earn your teaching degree?

I realize the training and work involved in making rank in the military. But while you were working to make it to E-2, E-3, E-4, etc-- those in the teaching program were also studying and working, and doing so without pay and while paying for their schooling. At E-6, you'd be on a career track in the military...why would anyone get out after making E-6?

The colleges, and attitudes like yours, about military training; along with lack of funds to continue; forced me to reevaluate my decision of becoming a teacher in a progressive liberal politically motivated educational system.

That's alright. One less high school science and math teacher is no biggy in the grand scheme of things. I enjoy having to reteach things to my children and grandchildren because to the ineptness of our educational system.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

So basically, you didn't make it to the point of practicums, certification exams and internship. Is that it? Every college freshman is going to have classes in the humanities and arts--those classes are electives. The theory is that every college graduate should have some exposure to the arts and humanities. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lack of funds? You didn't have the GI Bill? Yes, college is a huge expense. That's what I meant when I said that while you were working and getting paid, education majors were working and NOT getting paid. When the military trains you, it's also paying you. When a teacher is training, they are not being paid--but they are paying a lot of money for that training.

I think extremely highly of military training and discipline. I told you that my son got excellent training in the Army. He was also paid while he received that training. He had a roof over his head and food to eat AND money in his pocket while he was training. That means a lot. He got some of the best training that the military offers. But just because he (or you or anyone) spent some time in the military doesn't mean that he then can waltz into college, take a couple of classes and have a degree. It doesn't work that way. No matter how good of a soldier he was--it doesn't work that way. He made a choice at 18 NOT to go to college. He took a different route. It's paid off very well for him, because he was able to get very good training in the Army. But does that mean that he can go to school, take a couple of classes and be a teacher? No. It doesn't take away the fact that while he was being paid to learn, some of his friends were paying to learn. His friends who chose college didn't have anyone, at 18 and in college, making sure that they got up in the morning in time to make it to class--AND paying them to be there in class. You cannot discount the 4 years that full time college students go without a full time job, while paying to learn their skill. How much money does the average military enlistee make in the 4 years after they enlist--60K or so? How much is their military training worth? A person who's spent 4 years in college is already 4 years behind in earnings. Which is why, for some people, especially if they can get a good specialty--the military is a very good choice. The big downside is that you lose rights when you join the military and if the military sends you into a battle zone--you have to go. No one has stressed that point, I think, on this forum, than I have. Which is why so many times I have said that the military cannot be treated like a civilian job. Military people should get special benefits because of the sacrifices they make and the risks that they take. I don't think that teachers should be put on a military pay scale anymore than I think that service in the military should be treated like any other 40 hour a week civilian job.

I had the GI Bill had to take a couple of refresher math courses over though. Aced them. Needless to say it set me back in where I was headed.

I had over a year of intensive training in electronics for a six year cotract that meant that for five years they would have the opportunity to put me in harms way. At a pay that most people wouldn't work for. That was the deal.

I realize you don't think much of military training. That's pretty obvious from your above statement. Just like the colleges attitude about it or CLEP tests that a military member can take.

Choosing to go into a job field that doesn't pay very well was the choice of the college student. Not my problem. If you chose to pay for something that wasn't worth the money yhen live with it. Besides I thought teachers weren't in it for the money That must be my mistake... Besides there's plenty of people out there holding teaching credentials who want a job in that field. So the job pays what it pays... That's called 'supply and demand' baby. Live with it.

...Of course there's all those scholarships and government grants available to the college stundent also now isn't there? So your remarks of how much money those poor partying college students have to shell out of their own pocket doesn't ring quite true either. If you want to say that they paid their full way through college out of their own pocket then perhaps those scholarships and grants should go away also. I'll see what I can do about that OK?

Just like when they call me up for a donation I tell them to ask the college coach who's making $3.5 million dollars a year to cover me on that... Funny they haven't called in a couple years for any sort of donation... I wonder why?

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Nekochan wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Nekochan wrote:Doesn't sound like any education course schedule that I've heard of. Did you do the practicums, the certification exams, the internship?
Did you ever earn your teaching degree?

I realize the training and work involved in making rank in the military. But while you were working to make it to E-2, E-3, E-4, etc-- those in the teaching program were also studying and working, and doing so without pay and while paying for their schooling. At E-6, you'd be on a career track in the military...why would anyone get out after making E-6?

The colleges, and attitudes like yours, about military training; along with lack of funds to continue; forced me to reevaluate my decision of becoming a teacher in a progressive liberal politically motivated educational system.

That's alright. One less high school science and math teacher is no biggy in the grand scheme of things. I enjoy having to reteach things to my children and grandchildren because to the ineptness of our educational system.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

So basically, you didn't make it to the point of practicums, certification exams and internship. Is that it? Every college freshman is going to have classes in the humanities and arts--those classes are electives. The theory is that every college graduate should have some exposure to the arts and humanities. There is nothing wrong with that.

Lack of funds? You didn't have the GI Bill? Yes, college is a huge expense. That's what I meant when I said that while you were working and getting paid, education majors were working and NOT getting paid. When the military trains you, it's also paying you. When a teacher is training, they are not being paid--but they are paying a lot of money for that training.

I think extremely highly of military training and discipline. I told you that my son got excellent training in the Army. He was also paid while he received that training. He had a roof over his head and food to eat AND money in his pocket while he was training. That means a lot. He got some of the best training that the military offers. But just because he (or you or anyone) spent some time in the military doesn't mean that he then can waltz into college, take a couple of classes and have a degree. It doesn't work that way. No matter how good of a soldier he was--it doesn't work that way. He made a choice at 18 NOT to go to college. He took a different route. It's paid off very well for him, because he was able to get very good training in the Army. But does that mean that he can go to school, take a couple of classes and be a teacher? No. It doesn't take away the fact that while he was being paid to learn, some of his friends were paying to learn. His friends who chose college didn't have anyone, at 18 and in college, making sure that they got up in the morning in time to make it to class--AND paying them to be there in class. You cannot discount the 4 years that full time college students go without a full time job, while paying to learn their skill. How much money does the average military enlistee make in the 4 years after they enlist--60K or so? How much is their military training worth? A person who's spent 4 years in college is already 4 years behind in earnings. Which is why, for some people, especially if they can get a good specialty--the military is a very good choice. The big downside is that you lose rights when you join the military and if the military sends you into a battle zone--you have to go. No one has stressed that point, I think, on this forum, than I have. Which is why so many times I have said that the military cannot be treated like a civilian job. Military people should get special benefits because of the sacrifices they make and the risks that they take. I don't think that teachers should be put on a military pay scale anymore than I think that service in the military should be treated like any other 40 hour a week civilian job.

I had the GI Bill had to take a couple of refresher math courses over though. Aced them. Needless to say it set me back in where I was headed.

I had over a year of intensive training in electronics for a six year cotract that meant that for five years they would have the opportunity to put me in harms way. At a pay that most people wouldn't work for. That was the deal.

I realize you don't think much of military training. That's pretty obvious from your above statement. Just like the colleges attitude about it or CLEP tests that a military member can take.

Choosing to go into a job field that doesn't pay very well was the choice of the college student. Not my problem. If you chose to pay for something that wasn't worth the money yhen live with it. Besides I thought teachers weren't in it for the money That must be my mistake... Besides there's plenty of people out there holding teaching credentials who want a job in that field. So the job pays what it pays... That's called 'supply and demand' baby. Live with it.

...Of course there's all those scholarships and government grants available to the college stundent also now isn't there? So your remarks of how much money those poor partying college students have to shell out of their own pocket doesn't ring quite true either. If you want to say that they paid their full way through college out of their own pocket then perhaps those scholarships and grants should go away also. I'll see what I can do about that OK?

Just like when they call me up for a donation I tell them to ask the college coach who's making $3.5 million dollars a year to cover me on that... Funny they haven't called in a couple years for any sort of donation... I wonder why?

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

Even in the academic community, classes do not always transfer from one institution to another. In fact, classes often do not transfer. It may not always be fair, but that's the way it is.

There is a soldier to teacher program now but I do not know the details on how that works.

At pay that starts in the mid-30K range and doesn't reach 50K until 20+ years of teaching--no, I don't think teachers are in it for the pay.

Not everyone goes to college on grants. Loans have to be paid back. Most college students are not getting a free ride. If they are on scholarship--well they earned that scholarship. And scholarships rarely pay the entire college bill. And there are young people who are working their butts off to make it through school. Yes, it's about choices. You made your choices, as well.

On this forum, I am probably one of the biggest advocates of the military and military training. For someone who is reasonably intelligent, if they are able to get a good specialty in the military, they can enlist out of high school and then leave the service a few years later and with their security clearance and training, walk right into a civilian job that pays $60,000+ a year. So I do not dismiss military training. Not at all. No matter what you keep saying.

I still do not understand why you couldn't take more classes on your GI Bill. Did you get a college degree or not?

Nekochan wrote:Even in the academic community, classes do not always transfer from one institution to another. In fact, classes often do not transfer. It may not always be fair, but that's the way it is.

There is a soldier to teacher program now but I do not know the details on how that works.

At pay that starts in the mid-30K range and doesn't reach 50K until 20+ years of teaching--no, I don't think teachers are in it for the pay.

Not everyone goes to college on grants. Loans have to be paid back. Most college students are not getting a free ride. If they are on scholarship--well they earned that scholarship. And scholarships rarely pay the entire college bill. And there are young people who are working their butts off to make it through school. Yes, it's about choices. You made your choices, as well.

On this forum, I am probably one of the biggest advocates of the military and military training. For someone who is reasonably intelligent, if they are able to get a good specialty in the military, they can enlist out of high school and then leave the service a few years later and with their security clearance and training, walk right into a civilian job that pays $60,000+ a year. So I do not dismiss military training. Not at all. No matter what you keep saying.

I still do not understand why you couldn't take more classes on your GI Bill. Did you get a college degree or not?

Sorry. The university I went to didn't know anything about any military programs that you want to bring up and didn't want to know.

All you're convincing me is how dysfunctional academia is...

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eD8RhPDU5Y



...and that the government should get out of supporting education at all levels and leave academia to do whatever it is academia does.