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What if the universe didn't start but always was?

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Wordslinger

Wordslinger
There is a relatively new scientific theory that our universe did not start with the "Big Bang," but always was -- that it has expanded and contracted forever.

If so there is no God. Which is a conclusion many of us came to a long time ago.

For all of you who insist your imaginary friend is real, I'd like a few answers ...

Allegedly, we humans were created in God's image. OK, but why did God have a nose -- he or she or they didn't need to breathe air. Ditto for ears -- unless He or She or They had other Gods to talk to.

When you claim the universe always was, then you're saying there is no start or finish to time. Ditto for speed -- there is no limit to speed since speed is a product of distance traveled measured by time.

As for morality and ethics being a central element of "God's" philosophy, consider: All human infants are born with the instinct to gain approval from everyone around them. As they mature, this instinct also matures -- we gain the desire to contribute and show empathy to our group. In other words, our ability to sense what's right and what's wrong doesn't come from any God(s) or Bibles, but we are born with this ability or instinct as the central core of our individual survival -- because if we fail to nurture our groups desire to accept and like us, they will reject us -- and historically over the long haul -- that conclusion is tantamount to a death sentence. Not so long ago rejection by our group meant you got left outside the cave or were left on a floating ice flow.

It occurs to me that our desire to contribute is indeed a product of our ingrained survival instinct.

Its also a fact that all the Gods we've imagined, are portrayed exactly the same in every formalized religion. Whether the Torah, the King James Bible, the Koran, Budda's teachings etc. they all preach honesty, having compassion for all the unfortunate, self-discipline, living a virtuous life, and so forth.

The Holy Books also preach against murder, or harming others. So why is religion the most conflictive element in human culture -- name a war that wasn't based on "my imaginary friend is better than yours."

Prove me wrong ....

RealLindaL


Being of very similar mindset (that there almost assuredly is no God, certainly not as a personal entity involved/interested in our teeny tiny daily lives and selves), I'm not here on your thread to argue that point. I would, however, be interested in the source or sources for your mentioned "relatively new scientific theory."

Links?

Wordslinger

Wordslinger
RealLindaL wrote:Being of very similar mindset (that there almost assuredly is no God, certainly not as a personal entity involved/interested in our teeny tiny daily lives and selves), I'm not here on your thread to argue that point.  I would, however, be interested in the source or sources for your mentioned "relatively new scientific theory."

Links?

This month's Scientific American magazine (April 2020) see "Big questions from Alan Guth" -- a sponsored feature by Kavli Prize page 6

bigdog


It's very obvious that there was no beginning to time and that there is no ending to space. Anyone who says otherwise is not thinking clearly.
Does that mean that in this particular area of the universe there is no superior intellect or order that controls this incredibly tiny spot, really an almost invisible spot if you consider the vast space that has no boundaries?
I think anything is possible. I don't think everything is probable though.
I do know that any time that I even try to wrap my mind around unlimited space or time my brain literally starts to hurt so I have to quit. I don't think it is something that a finite mind can ever understand.
BTW, I haven't posted on this forum since last August and have read on it very rarely. This is the first post I've found interesting enough to consider thinking about.
What I do know is that I don't know and am not required to learn the meaning of life before I die. Or even if there is any meaning of life. I think all we can do is try and be kind to those we love and treat others fairly so we don't have to die regretting our past.
It's a bit depressing to stay home during CVD because we start to think about these things instead of what we are going to do today.
I'm managing pretty well with my husband and our two dogs, plus phone calls from my kids every day or so. They will not come to see us nor let us into their homes, which I guess is kind of sweet but also annoying as hell.
All I know is when someone tells me "God is Good," I don't think it's necessary for me to question their beliefs, no matter what mine may be. Humans do what they can to get through their lives, and if I'm happy enough with my beliefs I see no reason to openly argue with them over theirs.
Also, I don't understand why you or any Atheist (and there are several in my family) would feel the need to ask a believer to answer any of your questions regarding their religion.  You are either confident in what you believe, or you are not.  They admit that their beliefs are based on faith and not science, and once they've done that, it seems counter-productive to try and argue science with them. And if it's an argument between family members, which it was between one of my siblings and my mother for over  40 years, it can destroy relationships that may never be mended. I only think I know what my own kids religious beliefs are, but I don't discuss them with them at all.  Whatever they believe, I hope it brings them peace.
That's why I don't think too much about the limitless universe, it depresses me and makes me feel small. It gives me no peace. But I know it's there. I suspect a lot of people who call themselves Christians have just enough doubt that they do too. They choose to believe otherwise. And it is a choice, because whether we know the truth or not doesn't matter in the long run. All that matters is those last few seconds of life when we look back and remember whether we did more good or bad in our lives.

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