Homehttp://www.salon.com/2015/06/09/the_super_rich_are_taking_us_for_a_ride_the_obscene_concentration_of_wealth_at_the_top_partner/?source=newsletter
Pensacola Discussion Forum
This is a forum based out of Pensacola Florida.
Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article!
5 posters
Message [Page 1 of 1]
2 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/9/2015, 3:10 pm
othershoe1030
Wordslinger wrote:http://www.salon.com/2015/06/09/the_super_rich_are_taking_us_for_a_ride_the_obscene_concentration_of_wealth_at_the_top_partner/?source=newsletter
Good summary of the situation we're in now. Most people are oblivious to the extreme nature of the problem. I think the media (owned by the super rich for the most part) social media, independent media needs to constantly keep this situation in the public eye.
One thing that would be effective would be to collect facts that are easily grasped by most people. For example you could say: the average worker has to work "X" number of years in order to make as much as these guys make in an hour. Factoids like that would make people think.
This whole arrangement did not happen overnight. It will take a long time to correct it. Let's hope we don't totally turn into a banana republic before then!
3 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/9/2015, 3:37 pm
Wordslinger
othershoe1030 wrote:Wordslinger wrote:http://www.salon.com/2015/06/09/the_super_rich_are_taking_us_for_a_ride_the_obscene_concentration_of_wealth_at_the_top_partner/?source=newsletter
Good summary of the situation we're in now. Most people are oblivious to the extreme nature of the problem. I think the media (owned by the super rich for the most part) social media, independent media needs to constantly keep this situation in the public eye.
One thing that would be effective would be to collect facts that are easily grasped by most people. For example you could say: the average worker has to work "X" number of years in order to make as much as these guys make in an hour. Factoids like that would make people think.
This whole arrangement did not happen overnight. It will take a long time to correct it. Let's hope we don't totally turn into a banana republic before then!
I agree with your assessment completely. And we are well on our way to becoming a "banana" republic. The disparity between the rich and the poor in America is not much different that of Guatemala or Argentina, for example.
4 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/9/2015, 4:04 pm
Guest
Guest
Unfortunately (for the less discerning) the article compares apples to oranges. The tax rate on wages/salaries is one thing - the tax rate on capital gains is a different rate. And that's because people invest in the stock market, for instance, with money that has already been taxed.
Income tax ranges from 10% to 39.6% - that's effective for every wage/salary earner, whether you're Warren Buffet or his secretary.
However, Warren Buffet makes his investments with money leftover after he pays income tax on it. Any increase in the investment is taxed at capital gains rates - for most folks it's 15%. THE US CONGRESS STRUCTURED THESE TAX RATES - if you have a problem with these rates - BLAME CONGRESS.
The prevailing thought is that after income has been taxed, any investment income shouldn't be taxed at the same rate because a) the money for the initial investment has ALREADY BEEN TAXED, and b) investments are a necessary vehicle for commerce but they are inherently risky.
Income tax ranges from 10% to 39.6% - that's effective for every wage/salary earner, whether you're Warren Buffet or his secretary.
However, Warren Buffet makes his investments with money leftover after he pays income tax on it. Any increase in the investment is taxed at capital gains rates - for most folks it's 15%. THE US CONGRESS STRUCTURED THESE TAX RATES - if you have a problem with these rates - BLAME CONGRESS.
The prevailing thought is that after income has been taxed, any investment income shouldn't be taxed at the same rate because a) the money for the initial investment has ALREADY BEEN TAXED, and b) investments are a necessary vehicle for commerce but they are inherently risky.
5 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/9/2015, 4:19 pm
KarlRove
Class warfare
6 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/9/2015, 7:07 pm
Wordslinger
KarlRove wrote:Class warfare
Not really. It's just jolly old America continuing it's role as a country created by the rich, for the rich and of the rich.
7 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 10:10 am
othershoe1030
colaguy wrote:Unfortunately (for the less discerning) the article compares apples to oranges. The tax rate on wages/salaries is one thing - the tax rate on capital gains is a different rate. And that's because people invest in the stock market, for instance, with money that has already been taxed.
Income tax ranges from 10% to 39.6% - that's effective for every wage/salary earner, whether you're Warren Buffet or his secretary.
However, Warren Buffet makes his investments with money leftover after he pays income tax on it. Any increase in the investment is taxed at capital gains rates - for most folks it's 15%. THE US CONGRESS STRUCTURED THESE TAX RATES - if you have a problem with these rates - BLAME CONGRESS.
The prevailing thought is that after income has been taxed, any investment income shouldn't be taxed at the same rate because a) the money for the initial investment has ALREADY BEEN TAXED, and b) investments are a necessary vehicle for commerce but they are inherently risky.
We are aware of the income tax rates and know also that this is set by congress. The problem at this point is that the structure has shifted over the decades to favor the well off. As SeaOat has pointed out many times, the rates need to readjust back to the rates of the 60's.
Rate adjustments and tax credits to industries making vast profits, such as the oil companies, do not need taxpayer support.
As for the congress, we all also know it is primarily run as a front by corporate interests. These people are looking out for their donors, not their constituents. The system as it is now is broken as far as 99% of us are concerned.
Why the "Don't Tread on Me" types want to continue supporting this set up is beyond me. They swallow the BS of the campaigns of these corporate shills and reelect corporate America. All in the name of what? They have their hooks in the Fox News crowd via the second amendment and anti-abortion emotion baloney.
8 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 10:20 am
othershoe1030
Right now Bernie Sanders is being interviewed on the Diane Rehm Show on WUWF for anyone interested in more information about him. If you miss the live broadcast the interview should be posted on her site's archives.
He's the one sticking up for the middle class.
http://thedianerehmshow.org
He's the one sticking up for the middle class.
http://thedianerehmshow.org
9 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 10:29 am
gatorfan
You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
10 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 11:32 am
othershoe1030
gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
I've heard this knee-jerk response before. It is an excuse to not address the imbalance we now see in our revenue collecting/spending system. The wealth gap was created by decisions congress has made over the years and it can be corrected by decisions congress can make in the future.
The wealth gap is too important and has too many negative consequences for our country to just throw our arms up in defeat and say there is nothing we can do about it. That is exactly what the corporations want. We have to organize to the point that people in congress start listening to us instead of them. It remains to be seen whether some of the current crop in congress can be brought to their senses or if they will have to be replaced.
It is the money in politics that the people are up against. Most of our clout comes from our numbers in the voting booth. We can't just let the corporations continue to run the country.
11 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 11:45 am
gatorfan
othershoe1030 wrote:gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
[color=#0033cc]I've heard this knee-jerk response before. ]
It's not a "knee-jerk" reaction, it's a fact.
I've always supported campaign finance reform (REAL reform) and term limits for Congress. Until voters figure out their involvement does not stop after they cast a vote the situation will never change. They have to stay in contact with their representatives and push issues to get this mess straightened out. Make enough noise and maybe even those hardheads will get the message.
12 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 11:51 am
Guest
Guest
othershoe1030 wrote:colaguy wrote:Unfortunately (for the less discerning) the article compares apples to oranges. The tax rate on wages/salaries is one thing - the tax rate on capital gains is a different rate. And that's because people invest in the stock market, for instance, with money that has already been taxed.
Income tax ranges from 10% to 39.6% - that's effective for every wage/salary earner, whether you're Warren Buffet or his secretary.
However, Warren Buffet makes his investments with money leftover after he pays income tax on it. Any increase in the investment is taxed at capital gains rates - for most folks it's 15%. THE US CONGRESS STRUCTURED THESE TAX RATES - if you have a problem with these rates - BLAME CONGRESS.
The prevailing thought is that after income has been taxed, any investment income shouldn't be taxed at the same rate because a) the money for the initial investment has ALREADY BEEN TAXED, and b) investments are a necessary vehicle for commerce but they are inherently risky.
We are aware of the income tax rates and know also that this is set by congress. The problem at this point is that the structure has shifted over the decades to favor the well off. As SeaOat has pointed out many times, the rates need to readjust back to the rates of the 60's.
Rate adjustments and tax credits to industries making vast profits, such as the oil companies, do not need taxpayer support.
As for the congress, we all also know it is primarily run as a front by corporate interests. These people are looking out for their donors, not their constituents. The system as it is now is broken as far as 99% of us are concerned.
Why the "Don't Tread on Me" types want to continue supporting this set up is beyond me. They swallow the BS of the campaigns of these corporate shills and reelect corporate America. All in the name of what? They have their hooks in the Fox News crowd via the second amendment and anti-abortion emotion baloney.
If we agree that it is the CONGRESS that sets policy, laws, taxes, etc., why is it that "the people" do not decry the CONGRESS? Instead, we hear the "rich" and the corporations vilified. Let's put the blame where it should be: the CONGRESS. A grass roots effort to sway the CONGRESS to enact tax reform is sure to raise the awareness of the issue, and lead to action.
BTW - given the current set of tax parameters I would be first in line to take advantage, if I were in such a position. Wouldn't most people?
13 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 12:22 pm
Wordslinger
gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
By "drones in congress" who are spendthrifts, you are referring, I take it, to that pack of conservative fear mongers who want to increase military spending and engage in new imperialistic, losing wars, right?
Last edited by Wordslinger on 6/10/2015, 12:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
14 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 12:32 pm
gatorfan
Wordslinger wrote:gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
By "drones in congress" who are spendthrifts, you are referring, I take it, to that pack of conservative fear mongers who want to increase military spending and engage in new imperialistic, losing wars, right?
Negative. They aren't the only ones who waste tax payer money and you know it as well as I do. Ever take a look at grants.gov? There is waste in every nook and cranny of Congressional spending.
15 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 1:05 pm
Wordslinger
gatorfan wrote:Wordslinger wrote:gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
By "drones in congress" who are spendthrifts, you are referring, I take it, to that pack of conservative fear mongers who want to increase military spending and engage in new imperialistic, losing wars, right?
Negative. They aren't the only ones who waste tax payer money and you know it as well as I do. Ever take a look at grants.gov? There is waste in every nook and cranny of Congressional spending.
I admit you are indeed right on wasteful spending by both sides of congress. Tell you what, I'm for cutting social programs if you're willing to do the same with military spending. Deal?
16 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 1:10 pm
Sal
Screw that.
I would much rather the money be wasted on graft in the good ol' U.S. of A., instead of wasted on graft in Iraq, Libya, Israel, or any of the rest of those shit holes.
I would much rather the money be wasted on graft in the good ol' U.S. of A., instead of wasted on graft in Iraq, Libya, Israel, or any of the rest of those shit holes.
17 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 1:43 pm
othershoe1030
gatorfan wrote:othershoe1030 wrote:gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
I've heard this knee-jerk response before. ]
It's not a "knee-jerk" reaction, it's a fact.
I've always supported campaign finance reform (REAL reform) and term limits for Congress. Until voters figure out their involvement does not stop after they cast a vote the situation will never change. They have to stay in contact with their representatives and push issues to get this mess straightened out. Make enough noise and maybe even those hardheads will get the message.
The "you could tax the rich at 90%" statement is interesting. I'd like to see some numbers on that. Do you have any information that would shed light on that claim?
I still think it is accepted as an excuse by most people who pull that idea out of the bag. The thought is that raising taxes on the wealthy would do no good so why bother? Let's just leave them alone! I don't buy it. Somehow congress passes higher taxes on middle-class people so there must be some fiscal merit in the concept of raising taxes?
Pressing elected members is only a part of solving the problem of the wealth gap. I think we need "in the street" demonstrations, mass rallies, social media events and pressure of all peaceful types before congress will get the message that we are serious and are on to their game.
18 Re: Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article! 6/10/2015, 1:52 pm
gatorfan
Wordslinger wrote:gatorfan wrote:Wordslinger wrote:gatorfan wrote:You could tax the rich at 90% and it won't make a bit of difference since Congress would just waste the additional revenue anyway. Of course we have seen a LACK of revenue hasn't stopped the drones in Congress from obligating the country anyway....
By "drones in congress" who are spendthrifts, you are referring, I take it, to that pack of conservative fear mongers who want to increase military spending and engage in new imperialistic, losing wars, right?
Negative. They aren't the only ones who waste tax payer money and you know it as well as I do. Ever take a look at grants.gov? There is waste in every nook and cranny of Congressional spending.
I admit you are indeed right on wasteful spending by both sides of congress. Tell you what, I'm for cutting social programs if you're willing to do the same with military spending. Deal?
I have no problem cutting military spending starting with that piece of crap F-35 program, the LCS program, huge nuke subs when diesel boats would be more practical in many areas, wasteful and ridiculous procurement charades, and the list goes on.
We need social programs but it seems there is too much waste there too, recipients need to have some skin in the game and many programs are duplicated resulting in ridiculous administrative waste.
Message [Page 1 of 1]
Pensacola Discussion Forum » Politics » Love being screwed by the super-rich? You'll love this article!
Similar topics
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum