Fact-checking Paul Ryan

It was, by any reasonable standards, a staggering, staggering lie. Here’s Paul Ryan about Barack Obama:

He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.

“They.” “Them.” “Them.” Those words are lies. Because Paul Ryan was on that commission. “Came back with an urgent report.” That is a lie. The commission never made any recommendations for Barack Obama to support or oppose. Why not? Because the commission voted down its own recommendations. Why? Because Paul Ryan, a member of the commission, voted it down and successfully convinced the other House Republicans on the commission to vote it down.

That wasn’t the only bit of mendacity – lazy mendacity, incredibly lazy mendacity – in Ryan’s speech. Twitter lit up as soon as he started telling the story of the Janesville auto plant that Barack Obama didn’t save – a plant that, it turns out, closed before Obama was president. And of course there’s the infamous cuts to Medicare that Ryan lambasted Obama for without happening to mention that those very same cuts were in Paul Ryan’s own budget. Yes: absolutely everything in Obamacare is an abomination, says Paul Ryan, except for (as he forgets to mention) the cuts to Medicare that he supports – and yet he still singles that part out to use as an attack.

It isn’t even true in some symbolic or abstract way. The real truth is that Paul Ryan completely rejects the approach of that commission – because it includes tax increases along with spending cuts – while Barack Obama has, while not endorsing the exact plan that Ryan shot down, basically endorsed the commission’s approach. Nor was this a side point; Ryan's complaint about Obama on the deficit was absolutely central to his case against the president.

And then there’s the logic of the whole thing. As Seth Masket said, it all comes down to arguing “we must cut entitlements! Obama cutting entitlements is un-American.” There’s also, as many were pointing out, the plain fact that until January 2009 Paul Ryan faithfully supported all the tax cuts and spending increases which created the deficit problem he’s been so concerned about since January 2009.

But really, the proper response to a speech like this isn’t to carefully analyze the logic, or to find instances of hypocracy; it’s to call the speaker out for telling flat-out lies to the American people. Paul Ryan has had what I’ve long thought was an undeserved good reputation among many in the press and in Washington. It shouldn’t survive tonight’s speech.

By Jonathan Bernstein

reaper1948 wrote:Well why don't you post them for us then? Anyone with any common sense knows that they all lie.

reaper1948 wrote:All of them are funny to watch and have to back track on their lies. Yes, Biden I agree is somewhat of a jerk and they should have asked someone else to run as VP. I am still strictly up in the air and that's because all the republican platform has put forth is medicare, medicaid, abortion and they're against online poker. Nothing about the economy. If they legalized online poker the taxes would outweigh the risks. A gambling addict is an addict no matter how you look at it and will always find something to bet on.

reaper1948 wrote:All of them are funny to watch and have to back track on their lies. Yes, Biden I agree is somewhat of a jerk and they should have asked someone else to run as VP. I am still strictly up in the air and that's because all the republican platform has put forth is medicare, medicaid, abortion and they're against online poker. Nothing about the economy. If they legalized online poker the taxes would outweigh the risks. A gambling addict is an addict no matter how you look at it and will always find something to bet on.

Nekochan wrote:

reaper1948 wrote:All of them are funny to watch and have to back track on their lies. Yes, Biden I agree is somewhat of a jerk and they should have asked someone else to run as VP. I am still strictly up in the air and that's because all the republican platform has put forth is medicare, medicaid, abortion and they're against online poker. Nothing about the economy. If they legalized online poker the taxes would outweigh the risks. A gambling addict is an addict no matter how you look at it and will always find something to bet on.

Online Poker as an issue.... [/quoteor

It is with about 5 million U.S. online poker players and their are national organizations that have lobbying for years to make it legal and generate billions of tax dollars for the U.S. A handful of Republican law makers, Joe Barton from texas being one has had a bill in congress about a year to make it legal. Ex Senator R Diamato or however you spell his name has been lobbying for it. A handful of states have made it legal for intrastate and what is strange is Christie of New Jersey was trying to push it in Jersey. It would generate jobs right here in the U.S and not offshore where most online poker rooms operate from right now.

But really to top it off I am 64 why the hell should the government be allowed to tell me I cannot play poker online?

reaper1948 wrote:

Nekochan wrote:

reaper1948 wrote:All of them are funny to watch and have to back track on their lies. Yes, Biden I agree is somewhat of a jerk and they should have asked someone else to run as VP. I am still strictly up in the air and that's because all the republican platform has put forth is medicare, medicaid, abortion and they're against online poker. Nothing about the economy. If they legalized online poker the taxes would outweigh the risks. A gambling addict is an addict no matter how you look at it and will always find something to bet on.

Online Poker as an issue.... [/quoteor

It is with about 5 million U.S. online poker players and their are national organizations that have lobbying for years to make it legal and generate billions of tax dollars for the U.S. A handful of Republican law makers, Joe Barton from texas being one has had a bill in congress about a year to make it legal. Ex Senator R Diamato or however you spell his name has been lobbying for it. A handful of states have made it legal for intrastate and what is strange is Christie of New Jersey was trying to push it in Jersey. It would generate jobs right here in the U.S and not offshore where most online poker rooms operate from right now.

But really to top it off I am 64 why the hell should the government be allowed to tell me I cannot play poker online?

Well, I personally don't care one way or the other, but if that's your issue, more power to you.
Heck, if they can pass pro gambling laws in the heart of the Bible Belt--Miss and AL, why can't you have online gambling? I guess some people think gambling online in your living room is just too tempting and potentially damaging to some people.
**I still haven't been to Tunica, MS...but it's on my list.

Nekochan wrote:We're in Huntsville, AL, so Tunica is a few hours drive from here. Apparently it's a hopping place. Just like Biloxi, they have pretty big names come there for concerts and such.

boards of FL wrote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/paul-ryan-fails----the-truth/2012/08/29/bbfe1eac-f254-11e1-b74c-84ed55e0300b_blog.html

It was, by any reasonable standards, a staggering, staggering lie. Here’s Paul Ryan about Barack Obama:

He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.

“They.” “Them.” “Them.” Those words are lies. Because Paul Ryan was on that commission. “Came back with an urgent report.” That is a lie. The commission never made any recommendations for Barack Obama to support or oppose. Why not? Because the commission voted down its own recommendations. Why? Because Paul Ryan, a member of the commission, voted it down and successfully convinced the other House Republicans on the commission to vote it down.

That wasn’t the only bit of mendacity – lazy mendacity, incredibly lazy mendacity – in Ryan’s speech. Twitter lit up as soon as he started telling the story of the Janesville auto plant that Barack Obama didn’t save – a plant that, it turns out, closed before Obama was president. And of course there’s the infamous cuts to Medicare that Ryan lambasted Obama for without happening to mention that those very same cuts were in Paul Ryan’s own budget. Yes: absolutely everything in Obamacare is an abomination, says Paul Ryan, except for (as he forgets to mention) the cuts to Medicare that he supports – and yet he still singles that part out to use as an attack.

It isn’t even true in some symbolic or abstract way. The real truth is that Paul Ryan completely rejects the approach of that commission – because it includes tax increases along with spending cuts – while Barack Obama has, while not endorsing the exact plan that Ryan shot down, basically endorsed the commission’s approach. Nor was this a side point; Ryan's complaint about Obama on the deficit was absolutely central to his case against the president.

And then there’s the logic of the whole thing. As Seth Masket said, it all comes down to arguing “we must cut entitlements! Obama cutting entitlements is un-American.” There’s also, as many were pointing out, the plain fact that until January 2009 Paul Ryan faithfully supported all the tax cuts and spending increases which created the deficit problem he’s been so concerned about since January 2009.

But really, the proper response to a speech like this isn’t to carefully analyze the logic, or to find instances of hypocracy; it’s to call the speaker out for telling flat-out lies to the American people. Paul Ryan has had what I’ve long thought was an undeserved good reputation among many in the press and in Washington. It shouldn’t survive tonight’s speech.

By Jonathan Bernstein

NaNook wrote:You do know the GM plant closed in 04/09? There is even a local TV comment on the closing. Watch the local news video, and call them liars....stupid.

The plant covers 4,800,000 ft³ (446,000 m³).[3] It employed around 7,000 workers at its peak in 1970, but was down to about 1,200 when it was idled in December 2008, with only 57 employees left when it completely ceased production in April 2009.[4][5]

During GM's 2008 annual shareholder meeting on June 3, 2008, CEO Rick Wagoner announced that the Janesville assembly plant would close by 2010, along with three other GM factories, and could close sooner if the market dictated.[10] The cutbacks announced, along with other changes, were expected to save the North American division $1 billion per year starting in 2010.[11]

Assembly work continued at the Janesville Assembly until April 2009, completing the GM/Isuzu light truck partnership and then an additional 40 to 50 "skilled trade employees" worked to decommission the plant.[15]

boards of FL wrote:

NaNook wrote:You do know the GM plant closed in 04/09? There is even a local TV comment on the closing. Watch the local news video, and call them liars....stupid.

Here is what I am finding:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janesville_GM_Assembly_Plant

The plant covers 4,800,000 ft³ (446,000 m³).[3] It employed around 7,000 workers at its peak in 1970, but was down to about 1,200 when it was idled in December 2008, with only 57 employees left when it completely ceased production in April 2009.[4][5]

During GM's 2008 annual shareholder meeting on June 3, 2008, CEO Rick Wagoner announced that the Janesville assembly plant would close by 2010, along with three other GM factories, and could close sooner if the market dictated.[10] The cutbacks announced, along with other changes, were expected to save the North American division $1 billion per year starting in 2010.[11]

Assembly work continued at the Janesville Assembly until April 2009, completing the GM/Isuzu light truck partnership and then an additional 40 to 50 "skilled trade employees" worked to decommission the plant.[15]

The plant closure was announced in 2008. Operations were idled in 2008. Assembly work continued through April 2009 due to a partnership with Isuzu.

Obama's fault! Obama's destructive policies closed this otherwise perfectly productive plant in two months!

NaNook wrote:

boards of FL wrote:

NaNook wrote:You do know the GM plant closed in 04/09? There is even a local TV comment on the closing. Watch the local news video, and call them liars....stupid.

Here is what I am finding:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janesville_GM_Assembly_Plant

The plant covers 4,800,000 ft³ (446,000 m³).[3] It employed around 7,000 workers at its peak in 1970, but was down to about 1,200 when it was idled in December 2008, with only 57 employees left when it completely ceased production in April 2009.[4][5]

During GM's 2008 annual shareholder meeting on June 3, 2008, CEO Rick Wagoner announced that the Janesville assembly plant would close by 2010, along with three other GM factories, and could close sooner if the market dictated.[10] The cutbacks announced, along with other changes, were expected to save the North American division $1 billion per year starting in 2010.[11]

Assembly work continued at the Janesville Assembly until April 2009, completing the GM/Isuzu light truck partnership and then an additional 40 to 50 "skilled trade employees" worked to decommission the plant.[15]

The plant closure was announced in 2008. Operations were idled in 2008. Assembly work continued through April 2009 due to a partnership with Isuzu.

Obama's fault! Obama's destructive policies closed this otherwise perfectly productive plant in two months!

Didn't Obama PROMISE to keep the Plant OPEN???? It closed under his watch. I'll give you local video about the plant closing in 04/09.

Who is lying??????? Get your facts straight.......

salinsky wrote:Someone on the radio this morning described the speech thusly;

Lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, meet my mother, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, here's a story about my grandmother, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, meet my wife and kids, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, good night and God bless America.

boards of FL wrote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/paul-ryan-fails----the-truth/2012/08/29/bbfe1eac-f254-11e1-b74c-84ed55e0300b_blog.html

It was, by any reasonable standards, a staggering, staggering lie. Here’s Paul Ryan about Barack Obama:

1. He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.

“They.” “Them.” “Them.” Those words are lies. Because Paul Ryan was on that commission. “Came back with an urgent report.” That is a lie. The commission never made any recommendations for Barack Obama to support or oppose. Why not? Because the commission voted down its own recommendations. Why? Because Paul Ryan, a member of the commission, voted it down and successfully convinced the other House Republicans on the commission to vote it down.

2. That wasn’t the only bit of mendacity – lazy mendacity, incredibly lazy mendacity – in Ryan’s speech. Twitter lit up as soon as he started telling the story of the Janesville auto plant that Barack Obama didn’t save – a plant that, it turns out, closed before Obama was president.

3. And of course there’s the infamous cuts to Medicare that Ryan lambasted Obama for without happening to mention that those very same cuts were in Paul Ryan’s own budget. Yes: absolutely everything in Obamacare is an abomination, says Paul Ryan, except for (as he forgets to mention) the cuts to Medicare that he supports – and yet he still singles that part out to use as an attack.

It isn’t even true in some symbolic or abstract way. The real truth is that Paul Ryan completely rejects the approach of that commission – because it includes tax increases along with spending cuts – while Barack Obama has, while not endorsing the exact plan that Ryan shot down, basically endorsed the commission’s approach. Nor was this a side point; Ryan's complaint about Obama on the deficit was absolutely central to his case against the president.

4. And then there’s the logic of the whole thing. As Seth Masket said, it all comes down to arguing “we must cut entitlements! Obama cutting entitlements is un-American.” There’s also, as many were pointing out, the plain fact that until January 2009 Paul Ryan faithfully supported all the tax cuts and spending increases which created the deficit problem he’s been so concerned about since January 2009.

But really, the proper response to a speech like this isn’t to carefully analyze the logic, or to find instances of hypocracy; it’s to call the speaker out for telling flat-out lies to the American people. Paul Ryan has had what I’ve long thought was an undeserved good reputation among many in the press and in Washington. It shouldn’t survive tonight’s speech.

By Jonathan Bernstein