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Pensacola Discussion Forum » General Discussion » Hypothetical question: How dysfunctional does this federal government have to become before the citizenry becomes morally justified, morally obligated even, to take up arms against it?

Hypothetical question: How dysfunctional does this federal government have to become before the citizenry becomes morally justified, morally obligated even, to take up arms against it?

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dumpcare
TEOTWAWKI
Sal
cool1
Hospital Bob
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Sal

Sal

knothead wrote:
cool1 wrote:speaking of the ballot box --why not let the people vote on the thing -just the people -why not ?   I think hes to scared to let the people vote on this .

I mean if we have to pay money and not know what we are getting why not let the Americans vote on it --do you want this or not ?


But he wont do that he knows what would happen.  
cool, there was a ballot box on the PPACA . . . . . the election of 2012, remember? In fact, it was the central theme and platform of Obama and in opposition was Gov. Romney, remember? Obama won the election, hence, Obamacare had a jury trial at the ballot box and Obama won . . . . . end of story! It's not complicated . . . Rolling Eyes 
Not only that, but when you break Obamacare down into its individual components and remove the label, those components are quite popular with the public.

It's only when you wrap it up into one big package and call it "Obamacare", after years of Republican lies and demagoguery, that you get a majority disapproval.

But, even that is misleading because 16-20% of those disapproving are progressives who want single payer.

So in short, coolie, you're in the minority ...

... a very loud and very stupid minority, but a minority nonetheless.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Steve Doocy in all his glory.

http://americablog.com/2013/02/fox-news-solar-only-works-in-germany-because-its-sunny-there.html

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

the counterpoint to doocy

knothead

knothead

Nekochan wrote:I am sorry to say that knot is right.  People voted for Obama again and so this is what we have.   And we have a worthless Congress that also cannot come up with a budget.  

So we have Obama and his "care" and when Nancy Pelosi said that they'd have to vote on it first and then read what's in it....she should have said that they'd have to vote on it and then wait several years to see what it would actually be like. 

Putting off the mandate for a year doesn't sound like a bad idea given the problems that the Obamacare system seems to be having.   And just from reading some news stories it seems that Obamacare might not be the savior of the health care system that it was made out to be.
********************************************************

Your conclusion may be correct but only time will tell on whether it will be successful or not. I've always said that if it is the disaster the right portrays it to be then it will collapse under its own weight but some time must be given to allow the knotheads in Congress to identify and adequately address problems as they arise. Should they fail to do that (the right expressly wants it to fail) then the PPACA will have a rocky road ahead because there is no evidence that both sides are willing to work together.



Guest


Guest

cool1 wrote:speaking of the ballot box --why not let the people vote on the thing -just the people -why not ?   I think hes to scared to let the people vote on this .

I mean if we have to pay money and not know what we are getting why not let the Americans vote on it --do you want this or not ?


But he wont do that he knows what would happen.  
Why do you keep saying "we don't know what we're getting"? If you can read you know perfectly well what your getting when you buy a policy. The people voted Cool and that's what Obama ran on and was elected. To keep saying the people didn't want this is not factual. Romney lost by 5 million votes so the people most definitely wanted Obamacare. Get it?

Guest


Guest

http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=politics&url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57604959/why-obamacares-success-may-hinge-on-a-website/&catid=57604959

On Oct. 1 Americans will begin to sign up for health care plans as part of the Affordable Care Act. Despite all the efforts to sell Obamacare, a majority of Americans are still fearing the day. According to the latest CBS News/New York Times poll, 51 percent of Americans disapprove of the health care law and only 39 percent approve of it. Seventy-nine percent believe implementation will either not affect them or leave them worse off.

Sal

Sal

PkrBum wrote:http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=politics&url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57604959/why-obamacares-success-may-hinge-on-a-website/&catid=57604959

On Oct. 1 Americans will begin to sign up for health care plans as part of the Affordable Care Act. Despite all the efforts to sell Obamacare, a majority of Americans are still fearing the day. According to the latest CBS News/New York Times poll, 51 percent of Americans disapprove of the health care law and only 39 percent approve of it. Seventy-nine percent believe implementation will either not affect them or leave them worse off.
16-20% of those disapproval numbers come from progressives who want single-payer.

Guest


Guest

Sal wrote:
PkrBum wrote:http://m.cbsnews.com/storysynopsis.rbml?pageType=politics&url=http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57604959/why-obamacares-success-may-hinge-on-a-website/&catid=57604959

On Oct. 1 Americans will begin to sign up for health care plans as part of the Affordable Care Act. Despite all the efforts to sell Obamacare, a majority of Americans are still fearing the day. According to the latest CBS News/New York Times poll, 51 percent of Americans disapprove of the health care law and only 39 percent approve of it. Seventy-nine percent believe implementation will either not affect them or leave them worse off.
16-20% of those disapproval numbers come from progressives who want single-payer.
Doesnt matter what they want in place of it. Fact is the majority of people are AGAINST IT!

2seaoat



I wanted a serious discussion about this, Sal. Not a lesson in Goofy Golf. lol

Well goofy golf makes more sense than your question. We live in a great country. We have an exceptional history of people sacrificing to preserve this great nation. We live in a democracy which has been responsive to the people. We fought a revolution to overturn oligarchies and financial exploitation. The dysfunction of the government is rarely the cause of revolution, rather when a government runs efficiently but betrays the electorate, then and only then will you have the fear of revolution. The idea of inefficient government spawning a revolution is funny. Revolution will come when the electorate after voting has their government taken. It has nothing to do with efficiency, and it is not even on the radar screen....but carry on. We will correct mistakes within our constitutional system, and there is no inherent design flaw remaining in our constitution. There will be no civil war, and there certainly could be traitors and terrorist attacks, but to what end......we can vote for change.

2seaoat



Doesnt matter what they want in place of it. Fact is the majority of people are AGAINST IT!



If that is true it should be a walk in the park to amend the Affordable Care Act. Carry on.....

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Seaoat, I think if we were living in 1776 you would be one of the "loyalists" to King George. lol

Guest


Guest

Bob wrote:Seaoat, I think if we were living in 1776 you would be one of the "loyalists" to King George. lol
There's no doubt. He is a terrible steward for the constitution and self-reliance in general.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

By the way,  the pro-liberal pro-big-government pro-obama socialist communist mainstream media (NBC Nightly News) just revealed that 20% of the overall American economy is now provided by the federal government.

2seaoat



Seaoat, I think if we were living in 1776 you would be one of the "loyalists" to King George. lol


Never been prone to hissy fits or trying to fix something which is not broken. It reminds me of fights I have been in over the years. People spewing how they were going to mess me up. I hear a great deal of spewing and very little substance. These times are difficult because of economic challenges. Talk to me about revolution when we have a real economic melt down, but in the mean time record crops are being harvested. Windmills are popping up everywhere. I am actually watching factories being built, and last week went by two domestic auto plants with full parking lots and people working. My son and his wife are buying a new house from withering baby boomers at half price, and a new generation is beginning to have their claim to this country. Baby boomers had to have it all about sex when they were young and now I have to listen to grumpy old people........ quit whinning.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Of course NBC News is now owned by the giant capitalist for-profit Comcast Cable corporation and Cable tv provider corporations are not known for their socialism and communism.
Capitalist monopolies which gouge the fuck out of us no doubt like all capitalist monopolies, but not communists.

Just sayin

2seaoat



By the way, the pro-liberal pro-big-government pro-obama socialist communist mainstream media (NBC Nightly News) just revealed that 20% of the overall American economy is now provided by the federal government.




It has been a greater percentage in times of war, and we simply used common sense and did not let the war profiteers completely control our fate. It is simple common sense policy which is 80% bipartisan which needs to be worked on. The Negro in the White House will be gone in two years and without a scapegoat, perhaps we can get back to work without the hissy fits and drama. President Obama has done a very good job and history will judge him the same. However, the woman who replaces him will stir more fear and prejudice, and night lights will go on across America. We need this me generation to simply get old and become irrelevant, and maybe common sense will be restored.

Wordslinger

Wordslinger

Face it, America started out as a government for the rich, by the rich and of the rich and it hasn't changed.

The real contest isn't between liberals and conservatives, it's between those who want it all and fuck everyone else, and the rest of us.

I don't know any republicans or democrats, liberals or conservatives who are the least bit happy with the way things are going.

But, that can be explained because I don't know any ultra rich folks either.

No overthrow of the current establishment government by force of arms will work at all.

But, if everyone stopped working for a week or two ... the ultra rich would bail out fast.

Screw Amerika Inc.!!

Reality.

Guest


Guest

2seaoat wrote:Doesnt matter what they want in place of it. Fact is the majority of people are AGAINST IT!



If that is true it should be a walk in the park to amend the Affordable Care Act.   Carry on.....
No, you are a dumbass. I guess you don't pay attention, the gov isn't doing what the people want. Its doing what it wants.

I don't want to hear that shit about that he got elected which means the people want odumbass care. no it doesn't. Lots of people voted for him just because of his big (D).

You want to talk about IQ's and points of insanity? well dear sir, save your breath because you are so full of partisan BS you make nancy Pelosi orgasm at your long winded speeches on here.

2seaoat



It is pretty simple. In a democracy the people vote for their government. Those folks govern. The losers complain. Keep complaining. Maybe in 2016 Rand Paul can get elected and I can complain.

Guest


Guest

2seaoat wrote:It is pretty simple.  In a democracy the people vote for their government.  Those folks govern.   The losers complain.   Keep complaining.  Maybe in 2016 Rand Paul can get elected and I can complain.  
I have a strange feeling youre going to b complaining before then. but im pretty sure your ego wouldn't let you post it here. Wink 

2seaoat



I have a strange feeling youre going to b complaining before then. but im pretty sure your ego wouldn't let you post it here. Wink

I am a ghost. My ego is a ghost. However, you are correct. I will complain.

Guest


Guest

2seaoat wrote:It is pretty simple.  In a democracy the people vote for their government.  Those folks govern.   The losers complain.   Keep complaining.  Maybe in 2016 Rand Paul can get elected and I can complain.  
Hypothetical question: How dysfunctional does this federal government have to become before the citizenry becomes morally justified, morally obligated even, to take up arms against it? - Page 2 Th?id=H.4687820561908704&w=250&h=188&c=7&rs=1&pid=1

Then you and your supposedly enlightened progressive liberal friends should quit whining about the House Of Representatives giving Obamacare the funding that the Obama promised it would cost the taxpayers... Not one thin dime.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhat-xUQ6dw

Smile 

Guest


Guest

Sal wrote:
cool1 wrote:why does everyone think because a president is elected ---- that your going to go along with every one of his ideas---Most Americans aren't liking this at all --we elect presidents to listen to the people not shove crap down our throats we don't want .

King Obama ---so stupid --you cant make decisions for yourself you have to do everything thing he says because he is president Laughing 
Stupid?

Really??

I guess you don't like Democracy much.

Democracy should not be a process of hostage taking to achieve an outcome you can't get from the ballot box.

Using government shutdowns and threats to destroy the U.S. and world economies as leverage to force a minority favored outcome is not how Democracy is supposed to work.

But then, Democracy can really only work when the electorate understands what's going on and what's at stake.

So, really YOU are the problem ...

... because YOU are a moron.
Hypothetical question: How dysfunctional does this federal government have to become before the citizenry becomes morally justified, morally obligated even, to take up arms against it? - Page 2 Th?id=H.4595710697865832&w=199&h=178&c=7&rs=1&pid=1

The United States is a constitutional republic not a democracy moron.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhat-xUQ6dw

Smile 

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Damaged Eagle wrote:

The United States is a constitutional republic not a democracy moron.

 
That only applies to one definition for the term "democracy".

Another definition and the one commonly in usage now is...

b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/democracy


Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

I've been thinking about this and I have something to say to the NSA and the CIA and the FBI and the ECSO and the PPD and the FDLE.

IF the politicians take us to a debt default and that causes me significant financial harm,  I may be forced to get violent. I'm a vengeful person.

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