Study: Electric cars no greener than gasoline vehicles...a study from BERKELEY no less. How far to the left can we go?

Bob wrote:

othershoe1030 wrote:

So this design does away with a lot of the equipment under the hood of a conventional internal combustion engine? It doesn't need as many filters, gaskets, pumps etc.?

No the internal combustion engine in a hybrid still needs the filters,  gaskets and pumps.
The elimination of all that will have to wait for the fully electric vehicle to become practical.  And that will eliminate a whole lot more stuff we have to maintain and repair with a car motor.  No more valves,  fuel injectors,  pistons,  spark plugs,  exhaust systems and all the rest.  
An electric motor has only one moving part.

Joanimaroni wrote:I've ridden in the Tesla Roadster owned by Alabama Power...it is an awesome vehicle.

Joanimaroni wrote:You can google the Tesla at Alabama Power Tesla....it was orange but gorgeous. It was brought here in a truck.

CFJ wrote: 

I used to be into slot cars

Bob wrote:

Joanimaroni wrote:You can google the Tesla at Alabama Power Tesla....it was orange but gorgeous. It was brought here in a truck.

CFJ wrote:




I love this old Datsun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Cf89tawZX8

Bob wrote:

CFJ wrote:




I love this old Datsun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Cf89tawZX8

That video is showing us the markels er I mean the motorheads of tomorrow.

CFJ wrote:


The first time I saw that video I could not believe my eyes.  That ugly Datsun blowing away a 'Vette?

Bob wrote:

Damaged Eagle wrote:

Considering the coal that would have to be burned to make the electricity to charge that large of battery after every use and the hazmat disposal of such a large battery after it has reached the end of it's usefulness (It no longer charges adequately)... I think the pollution created by simply burning gasoline in the engine in the first place might be a lot less in the long run.

Firstly,  the lithium ion batteries used in electric cars are fully recyclable and are already being recycled.  No different than the lead acid battery you have in your car now (unless of course your car is started with a rope starter but that would mean you're driving a riding lawn mower with a dead battery and driving a riding mower on the street has it's own set of hazards).

And now here's something which addresses the second part of your post.


NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Ever since electric cars began commanding headlines a few years back, some have questioned whether the vehicles are really better for the environment.

Typical arguments look more or less like this one posted by a Facebook user in response to a CNNMoney.com story:

"What is the point of the plug-in when electricity has a carbon footprint since it's generated mostly by coal?"

Close to half of the country's electricity does come from coal, so it's a reasonable question.

It's true that running cars on electricity doesn't completely offset the environmental impact. A look at the numbers, however, shows that electric cars, taken as a whole, are cleaner than conventional gasoline or diesel powered vehicles. And the gap should widen.

Two separate air problems: When it comes to cars and electricity, there are two types of "air pollution" to think about. One is "pollution" in the traditional sense, dirty stuff in the air from power plants we don't want to breathe in. The other is carbon dioxide, the main gas most scientists say is behind global warming (which of course conservatives and republicans and steve doocy say is a myth anyway).

When it comes to either, it's coal generated electricity that causes the most concern. That's because coal emits a lot of CO2 and other pollutants.

Burning coal produces about three times as much carbon dioxide as gasoline, according to the Department of Energy. But an electric car, having a more efficient motor, can travel about three times as far using the same amount of energy. For instance, the Nissan Leaf gets 99 miles per "gallon equivalent" of electricity. So in the end, if all the electricity came from coal, the environmental impact would be about even.

But not all electricity comes from coal. The other half comes mostly from natural gas and nuclear power, both of which are far cleaner than coal.

The make-up of the nation's electric power infrastructure varies from region to region, however.

Northwestern states, with their abundance of hydroelectric dams, have particularly clean power. States in the Midwest rely more heavily on coal.

In the near term, people in heavily coal-dependent states would probably reduce emissions the most by buying conventional hybrid cars that don't draw power from the electric grid but instead generate electricity from their own engine and braking power, said Deron Lovaas, vehicles campaign director at the Natural Resources Defense Council.

In the longer term, shifting to all-electric cars will almost certainly result in lower CO2 emissions, he said, because most new power plants coming on-line nationally are not coal-fired. That point was echoed by Mark Duvall of the Electric Power Research Institute.

"New capacity is either natural gas or renewable," Duvall said.

Dirty air: Another problem with air pollution from cars is that it goes where the cars go and concentrates where the cars concentrate. Wouldn't it be better if tailpipe emissions from cars could be released far away instead of in cities and down near the ground where we are?

Well, that's one clear advantage of the electric car's "long tailpipe" -- the pollution from power plants is released where the plant is located, usually miles away from town.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/12/13/autos/electric_car_myths/index.htm

PkrBum wrote:We have a lot going for us partly because there are so many new needs. The buggy whip crowd will just have to get out of the way![/color]

Bob wrote:Read this CFJ...

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2009/09/audi-e-tron/

That maximum torque at all rpm's not only allows it to go 0-60 in 4.8 seconds.  It also allows it to go from 37 to 75 mph in 4.1 seconds.

Also interesting is this comment in the blog below the story...

The big rig truck manufacturers would drool at having 3300 ft/lbs of torque available, current trucks range about 500 to 1500, and have to slow down to go up hills in Pennsylvania and the Rockies in the west. Perhaps a "torque-boost" switch on the dashboard, a couple of these 800 ft/lb torque motors on any two wheels, and regenerative brake charging to a battery pack would help truckers get things done in excellent time! Kenworth, Freightliner, Peterbilt are you listening?