What Does the Vatican and the LAPD Have in Common?

PACEDOG#1 wrote:U r sick.

Bob wrote:Every institution the size of the LA Police Department or the Catholic Church has skeletons in it's closet. Even infinitesimally smaller units, like most families, have skeletons in their closets. And it's not news that they all try to hide those skeletons. Hell, that's why we say they're "in closets". lol

But to define the LA Police Department or the Catholic Church as being only that, is like trying to define a family that way.
The only thing the citizenry has protect it from robbers, murderers, burglars, home invaders, rapists and other assorted evildoers.
And that's not hyperbole. That's literally the truth. If those cops and that police department were not there, those evildoers would overrun the rest of us.

And to define the Catholic Church as ONLY being something that covers up child molesters is what is the hyperbole. It virtually invented the concept of "charity" as we know it. It feeds and clothes millions in poverty all over the world. It's started and protected many universities. It's sponsored and supported science and medicine. It developed the concept of "inalienable rights". It's sponsored and influenced art and architecture. And the list goes on.

Your appraisal of both the LAPD and the Catholic Church would be like somebody posting to say that what happened at Benghazi defines everything about Obama's presidency. That he should be known for nothing else except that.

Joanimaroni wrote:http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2010/04/07/mean-men.html

No formal comparative study has ever broken down child sexual abuse by denomination, and only the Catholic Church has released detailed data about its own. But based on the surveys and studies conducted by different denominations over the past 30 years, experts who study child abuse say they see little reason to conclude that sexual abuse is mostly a Catholic issue. "We don't see the Catholic Church as a hotbed of this or a place that has a bigger problem than anyone else," said Ernie Allen, president of the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. "I can tell you without hesitation that we have seen cases in many religious settings, from traveling evangelists to mainstream ministers to rabbis and others."



Since the mid-1980s, insurance companies have offered sexual misconduct coverage as a rider on liability insurance, and their own studies indicate that Catholic churches are not higher risk than other congregations. Insurance companies that cover all denominations, such as Guide One Center for Risk Management, which has more than 40,000 church clients, does not charge Catholic churches higher premiums. "We don't see vast difference in the incidence rate between one denomination and another," says Sarah Buckley, assistant vice president of corporate communications. "It's pretty even across the denominations." It's been that way for decades.










http://www.catholicleague.org/some-key-misunderstandings-regarding-the-child-sexual-abuse-scandal-and-the-catholic-church/


Children have been abused by priests and it is clear that this is a terrible betrayal of trust, a serious injury to these children, and a criminal as well as a moral failing. However, an examination of the best studies suggests that priests abuse at about the rate found in the general population; and that it is not clear that Catholic priests abuse children at a higher rate than other clergy. Certainly, beliefs that “most priests abuse” or that priests are more risk to children than other individuals, are not justified. Second, the pattern of abuse is rather unique: individuals who are victimized by priests are more likely to be adolescents and males. Thus, clinically these are cases of homosexual hebephilia rather than pedophilia—i.e., adolescents are being abused rather than prepubescent children. This does not make it any less of a crime or a moral failing—but it does suggest that an improved understanding of who is at risk which can be particularly important in future prevention efforts. Thirdly, there is evidence that priests have a higher rate of false and unfounded allegations than adults in the general population. Less than half of the allegations were found to be substantiated and even with those that were criminally prosecuted a large number—nearly a third—were found not guilty. This raises important questions about the phenomenon of false allegations. Evidence is reviewed regarding the formation of false memories, and lying for secondary gain. In addition, there is concern that cultural prejudices against the religious and particularly against Catholics can come into play.

Bob wrote:I'm a little skeptical when reading that too, joani. If the other clergy are just as prone to molest children, I can't imagine why those cases don't seem to come to light. I can't see how the baptists or methodists or the others would be any better at covering all that up.
Until you can show me different, I have to suspicion that those "studies" are agenda driven to defend the Catholic Church. We all know that "studies" can be exactly like statistics ("lies, damn lies and statisics/studies").

I do believe priests are more likely to resort to this simply because priests are ordered to be celibate and the other clergy are not. And I'm not surprised the organization tries to cover it up because, as I said, that is pretty much the modus operandi of all organizations, be it a church, a government, a charity, a corporation, a military or whatever it is. We all should have learned that by now.

My only point was that this is not the be all and end all of the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is far more than just priests molesting children.
And I stand by what I said before. If this defines the Catholic Church then, to be consistent, we need to argue that the Obama administration's attempts to cover up the negligence involving the Benghazi incident should define him too and that should be all he's known for as well. But of course wordslinger and sal are not consistent and would never hear of that. lol

Dreamsglore wrote:

Bob wrote:I'm a little skeptical when reading that too, joani. If the other clergy are just as prone to molest children, I can't imagine why those cases don't seem to come to light. I can't see how the baptists or methodists or the others would be any better at covering all that up.
Until you can show me different, I have to suspicion that those "studies" are agenda driven to defend the Catholic Church. We all know that "studies" can be exactly like statistics ("lies, damn lies and statisics/studies").

I do believe priests are more likely to resort to this simply because priests are ordered to be celibate and the other clergy are not. And I'm not surprised the organization tries to cover it up because, as I said, that is pretty much the modus operandi of all organizations, be it a church, a government, a charity, a corporation, a military or whatever it is. We all should have learned that by now.

My only point was that this is not the be all and end all of the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is far more than just priests molesting children.
And I stand by what I said before. If this defines the Catholic Church then, to be consistent, we need to argue that the Obama administration's attempts to cover up the negligence involving the Benghazi incident should define him too and that should be all he's known for as well. But of course wordslinger and sal are not consistent and would never hear of that. lol

There is no evidence that Obama covered up anything. There are thousands of cases of sexual abuse in the Catholic Church. The comparison doesn't even come close. The Catholic Church has lots more than sexual abuse to be ashamed of. Their intolerance and archaic beliefs to name a few.

Bob wrote:Every institution the size of the LA Police Department or the Catholic Church has skeletons in it's closet. Even infinitesimally smaller units, like most families, have skeletons in their closets. And it's not news that they all try to hide those skeletons. Hell, that's why we say they're "in closets". lol

But to define the LA Police Department or the Catholic Church as being only that, is like trying to define a family that way.

The police department is the only thing the citizenry has to protect it from robbers, murderers, burglars, home invaders, rapists and other assorted evildoers.
And that's not hyperbole. That's literally the truth. If those cops and that police department were not there, those evildoers would overrun the rest of us.

And to define the Catholic Church as ONLY being something that covers up child molesters is what is the hyperbole. It virtually invented the concept of "charity" as we know it. It feeds and clothes millions in poverty all over the world. It's started and protected many universities. It's sponsored and supported science and medicine. It developed the concept of "inalienable rights". It's sponsored and influenced art and architecture. And the list goes on.

Your appraisal of both the LAPD and the Catholic Church would be like somebody posting to say that what happened at Benghazi defines everything about Obama's presidency. That he should be known for nothing else except that.