The wussification of America

I have now heard two witness testimonies where males were afraid of going out of their house to check out two people fighting in their back yard. In one case the person was looking for a knife before going out, and in the second case he at least stepped out and yelled at the combatants.

I simply do not understand the world I live in anymore. If two people are fighting behind my house......I am going outside and getting involved. I do not understand the need to carry a concealed weapon. I do not understand the need to cower in my house when somebody is fighting in my backyard. I do not understand how this even happened if people were not so damn afraid. What has happened in this country that we are afraid to go out in our yard and tell people to get the hell out of here with your fighting.

I am sorry.........a person like George Zimmerman probably was screaming for help. The one witness said he yelled for them to stop and he was going to call the cops......so when Zimmerman shot Martin he knew that a neighbor had yelled something and the police were going to come.......what kind of punk who initiates a confrontation shoots somebody in a scuffle.......this country is doomed if males have all become scardy cats who cower in their homes and shoot people in a fist fight.......none of this would have happened if some males had simple courage to walk out of their house......or not have courage in their pocket and had enough common sense not to follow people lawfully walking on a sidewalk.

People stay in their homes and watch TV.........we do not want to intervene in the real world.....we are safe watching Paris Hilton, or Donald Trump in a pretend world......but the real world has a fight in our backyard......and we want to retreat into our cocoon and call the police......we have turned our men into wussies.....we have broken their spirit and punished them for being male in junior high and want them all to follow the rules and be safe.

When the males in our society turn into wussies....people carry guns.....people stay in their homes......we are screwed.

It's a dangerous world, Seaoat.  I cannot blame the residents for not going outside.  I would love to have you for a neighbor, though.

I'm watching  the trial now and I think the young man on the stand now (with the beard) is very credible.  

Also, we don't know who confronted whom, do we? We don't know who initiated the fight.

I am really bothered by the wife telling the husband not to go outside. He did step out and yell to them that he was going to call the police......but what the hell is going on this country. When did we decide that going out of our house and confronting folks who are fighting in our backyard. The guy on the stand does not strike me as particularly under any disability which would not allow him to walk out and not approach these people......I am really sad we have sunk this low.

We are in a time when life is very cheap for some people. Someone trying to intervene and break up a fight could easily get shot. I'll be honest with you--I wouldn't have wanted my husband to go outside under those circumstances, either. IF he did, I would want him to be armed.

People w/common sense know not to get physically involved in a fight and call the authorities.

My wife just said after watching the testimony said she most certainly would have gone out of the house and approached the people wrestling in the backyard and yelled at them to knock it off. She is a woman. The man could not even tell who these people were, but they did not attempt to yell at them to stop and let both participants see that a neighbor had became involved. I do not understand this cowering in one's home. This is alien to my life experiences. I simply do not understand this pervasive fear...........if folks would have simply all left their homes and approached these two wrestlers......would the world have ended......no.....but the fear of an asteroid makes as much sense to me as cowering in your home when two people are wrestling around in your back yard.........If a child was yelling rape am I going to cower in my house......I do not get this.

A child being raped...that's a different thing. I would try to stop it.

People w/common sense know not to get physically involved in a fight and call the authorities.

Who has suggested that this wrestling match was going to have a neighbor become a tag team participant......physically involved..........no, but coming out of my house and standing over them and telling them to knock it off and move along......you bet I am not staying in my house.....I am not going to get a knife......I am not going to get a gun......WTF has this world come to........and if it was a child, or a woman who was being assaulted, you go ahead and talk about common sense all day long......I am not going to stand there and wait for the police..........wussification of this country has become so pervasive that we are now trying to rationalize this cowering behavior. Nobody wants to get involved........nobody wants to be a good neighbor.......hell in my wife's small town the neighbors just grabbed the burglar robbing a house......tied him up in the front yard......then went and called the police.....they knew it would take 15 minutes to get a response.......there are some parts of this country where the wussification has not taken hold......it is a sad day when people will not leave their homes.

It's not Mayberry any more.

I would've run to physically break up the fight... if a gun shot went off I would've backed off till I knew it was safe to approach.

Seaoat, I wouldn't go out there without my gun. You're a braver man than me.  
And since one of the participants in the fight had a gun himself, I think the neighbors were wise to stay inside their homes. Calling 911 is the correct response.

I would've run to physically break up the fight... if a gun shot went off I would've backed off till I knew it was safe to approach.


Well of course you would not if you cowered in your house. I am not staying in my house if people are wrestling in the common area 20 feet from my sliding glass door. I am opening the door and going out and seeing what the hell is going on and telling them to knock it off and move along. If a gun shot has gone off, I am not leaving my residence. The idea that people are afraid to go in their own back yard and tell people to get the hell out of there.........different world than what I live in......I am not going to cower, I am leaving my house and I am yelling at them to get the hell out of there.......and if the fight involves a child or a person who is getting the crap kicked out of them where I fear for their life.....you bet I am getting involved......I do not understand this testimony at all.

I don't think you could tell in the dark that Traveon was a child. Like I said, I would have gone out, but only with my gun in hand.

2seaoat wrote:I have now heard two witness testimonies where males were afraid of going out of their house to check out two people fighting in their back yard.   In one case the person was looking for a knife before going out, and in the second case he at least stepped out and yelled at the combatants.

I simply do not understand the world I live in anymore.   If two people are fighting behind my house......I am going outside and getting involved.  I do not understand the need to carry a concealed weapon.   I do not understand the need to cower in my house when somebody is fighting in my backyard.   I do not understand how this even happened if people were not so damn afraid.   What has happened in this country that we are afraid to go out in our yard and tell people to get the hell out of here with your fighting.

I am sorry.........a person like George Zimmerman probably was screaming for help.    The one witness said he yelled for them to stop and he was going to call the cops......so when Zimmerman shot Martin he knew that a neighbor had yelled something and the police were going to come.......what kind of punk who initiates a confrontation shoots somebody in a scuffle.......this country is doomed if males have all become scardy cats who cower in their homes and shoot people in a fist fight.......none of this would have happened if some males had simple courage to walk out of their house......or not have courage in their pocket and had enough common sense not to follow people lawfully walking on a sidewalk.

WTH! How long did Zimmerman have to wait for help? His head was being banged on the sidewalk.Of course, he knew the police were coming. He called them.Martin went for his gun. He is supposed to allow him to get his gun and shoot him? This became more than a physical fight when Martin went for his gun.

Zimmerman knew police were coming--he had already called them. Perhaps he wanted to still be alive when the police arrived!

Seaoat, I wouldn't go out there without my gun. You're a braver man than me.

There is nothing brave about it. If I fear going outside because an asteroid might hit me, you all would say that fear was irrational. I have lived my entire life with only having a gun drawn on my once. I have had a knife brought to my neck after I intervened when a person was chasing a person around a car with a knife and I intervened........but 20 prior times when I have become involved I have never been threatened or feared that someone is going to hurt me. The truth is that there is an irrational fear which needs to be addressed in America. If folks are wrestling in your backyard......you need to go out and tell them to stop. It does not mean getting physically involved.....it does not mean getting a knife......it does not mean getting a gun........it means leaving your house and telling people to knock it off and move on.

I have broken up at least ten fights in my life, and I never feared that I needed a knife or a gun......I simply do not understand the world I live in today.........Now a gun shot goes off......I am staying in the house....because my experience with folks shooting guns.....they never hit what they are aiming at, and I am not leaving the house and reporting the gunshot to the police.......but what made these people cower in their homes at the start of this self described tussle.

Zimmerman knew police were coming--he had already called them. Perhaps he wanted to still be alive when the police arrived!


That is the part I simply do not understand. I hope he takes the stand so I can understand his fear. I do not get it. If you get out of your car after somebody has ran from you, and you now get in a tussle with that person after calling the police, why would you pull a gun an shoot the person because you were getting the worse of it in the tussle........I have a real problem with this pervasive fear that folks are living their lives......had Zimmerman never had his nose bloodied in a fight? I need to hear his testimony because none of this makes a bit of sense.

I wouldn't say it was irrational if you'd heard on the news that an asteroid was coming your way and you stayed indoors, or in a cave, or in a fallout shelter, or wherever. This fight was already there, it was already happening. You had two very angry participants clawing at each other on the ground. You could easily turn all that anger onto yourself if you interfered.

But if that would have been your response, the outcome might have been different. Either no one would have been killed, or two people might have been killed instead of one. One of them might have been you.



If you know the participants are unarmed, I might agree with you. I've also broken up fights without a weapon, but only when I knew the other people who were involved were unarmed too.

that anger onto yourself if you interfered.

I have broken up fights my entire life, and the vast majority of participants immediately stop when there is intervention, but this again is not physical....it is going out and seeing what is going on in your backyard and telling them to stop......today, rather than a gun or knife.....or even a dog.....I would take the cell phone and a flashlight. I am as dense as a rock.....I simply do not understand not going out, getting a knife or gun.....I just do not get it........it is no wonder the punk gangbangers have held this country hostage.......they have everybody afraid.........what if it was two brothers fighting over a baseball glove in your backyard.....are your going to call the police.......are you going to cower......or are you going to go out and find out what the hell they are doing in your backyard. I do not get the initial hesitation to go out and with my own eyes apprise the situation and tell them to knock it off. This is not about bravery......it is an immediate reaction.......I do not understand this fear, because it makes as much sense as worrying about that asteroid.

If the news tells me an asteroid is coming, I think it's logical to worry about it. I'd be heading to someplace that has some deep caves.

The real criminals in this case are the lowlifes who do the burgling.
If they didn't do that then people like Zimmerman wouldn't be motivated to want to help put a stop it. And the confrontation between him and Martin would have never happened.

I sympathize with the actions of Zimmerman and Martin both.
Zimmerman hated burglars and so do I.
Martin hated being profiled as a burglar when he wasn't one and I would hate that too.

All that led to a perfect storm of hate and violence. All caused by the fucking burglars to begin with. And now they're held completely unaccountable for any of it and likely are still out there doing their burgling. While Martin is dead and Zimmerman is facing long term imprisonment.

Zimmerman and Martin are not the "wimps" in this fucked up society, seaoat. They're both just more victims of it.

And as far as I'm concerned, this sacrosanct "justice system" you worship is nothing but a multi-million dollar dog and pony show that gives a lot of attention whores a lot of television face time. Some of which will end up with lucrative celebrity careers from it like the Greta Von Susterns and Marsha Clarks and Mark Fuhrmans and Johnny Cochrans and all the rest. Not to mention what a bonanza of sensationalism and profit it provides for the news media. All at the expense of the taxpayers.

The thing which puzzles me most,  seaoat,  is how you question the role of cops and what they do so much,  but at the same time are so enamored with the lawyers and judges.

I promise you this much,  if we do what you want and start tying the hands of the cops and taking them off the streets,   you're gonna see a helluva lot more Zimmermans out there taking their place and I'll probably be one of them (until I get too old).   And when that happens a lots more innocent Martins are gonna end up dead.  
And no amount of fancy pants lawyers and judges and "justice system" is gonna be able to stop it.

Mr Bob you should watch the movie SNITCH if you want to see how the system "works".

The thing which puzzles me most, seaoat, is how you question the role of cops and what they do so much, but at the same time are so enamored with the lawyers and judges.

I question both. I think we have the best justice system in the world. In the last 30 years the police have exceeded their constitutional parameters and I am closer to Scalia on this issue. I have no use for the hollywood trials.....they are not reflective of what is happening every day across this country. I have no use for prosecutors who do not charge or allow a case to go to a grand jury. I have no use for defense lawyers who use dilatory tactics. I am enamored with good police officers, prosecutors, investigators, defense counsel, and judges who everyday make our system work and do a good job. The vast majority of the same do a good job. I have no use for lazy and aggressive folks who need to find other employment.