Gee....it looks like Biloxi after 9 years of trying is going to get minor league baseball

My Son and Daughter have left the area to find gainful employment.. They both really tried to make a go of it here. But there comes a time when they understand that things will not be getting any better. Pensacola has lost its focus. New comers to the area have trashed our history and belittled the very people that made this a once great place to live. A short ride outside of downtown and the results are obvious.
Pensacola has become like a crack addict looking for the next hit. Just one more concert, one more "slam dunk" deal, any thing but hard work and sacrifice for the common good. We will continue to pay the price until we either wise up and change our ways or completely collapse our financial integrity. Harsh words, but true.

New comers to the area have trashed our history and belittled the very people that made this a once great place to live.

There you go.....the essence of your prejudice against the Park and Mr. Studer.......he is a new comer. By golly, if all the new comers were gone.....it would be a miracle.....the factories and jobs would return.......stellar logic.

2seaoat wrote: New comers to the area have trashed our history and belittled the very people that made this a once great place to live.

There you go.....the essence of your prejudice against the Park and Mr. Studer.......he is a new comer. By golly, if all the new comers were gone.....it would be a miracle.....the factories and jobs would return.......stellar logic.

We might not be in debt for a 100 million bull shit Park. That is a fact
Try again.....................

We might not be in debt for a 100 million bull shit Park. That is a fact

No the above statement is exactly why I am right and you continue to tell outright lies. You are giving all the payments over a thirty year period as the total debt. It is like me taking out a mortgage for 100k, and in my truth and lending statement it tells me my total payments over thirty years will be 220k. You continue to lie telling us that the debt for the park is 100 million when you know this is a lie. If I ask you what your car cost, and a person tells me they spent 20k for the car........now under your continued lying, you would say you spent 30k for the car taking each of the payments over seven years and adding them up to determine the debt.

You are telling lies. Plain and simple. If the Bp money coming to Florida was used to pay some of the bond debt on the park.......would we get a 100 million dollar payoff letter.......continue with your lies and self delusion......but continuing to say the bonds owed are 100 million is simply a bold faced lie.....no other way to put it.

So how much are we really committed to pay?


just like your home or car......at any given time you can ask for a payoff letter. It will tell you the total amount owed. The Maritime Park payoff letter would be around 45 million to 50 million(I do not have that exact number), so in MS they are spending 35 million to get only a baseball stadium on land they do not even own. There is no 40 acres. There is no bay front property, rather it is across 90 and across from the Beau Rivage, and they have been fighting tooth and nail to get a minor league team and 10 million economic benefit.

Nobody lies when talking about how much they bought their house and the amount of the mortgage. The liars continue to try to overstate the debt to make this quite successful project seem like an economic failure. I have never heard anybody lie like the folks who do not like Studer. If you cannot even realize you are lying, then you have lost your mind or your integrity, and either choice is not very good.

I offer you a challenge. What will be the Pay off on the CMPA bonds in 2016 or any year you choose? Do you really think the pay off will be 45 to 50 million when they received 56 Million?

just like your home or car......at any given time you can ask for a payoff letter.

The CMPA Bonds are not like a car or a house loan.

Oats on the Biloxi Ball Park
There is no 40 acres. There is no bay front property, rather it is across 90 and across from the Beau Rivage,

You are right!!! A 880 million dollar Casino blocks their view of the water. What dumb asses. Of course there will be a walkway to the Casino/Hotel

hallmarkgrad2 wrote:You are giving all the payments over a thirty year period as the total debt

So how much are we really committed to pay?

Mr ignorant Oats is ignoring your question...he likes to ignore the important stuff.




New comers to the area have trashed our history and belittled the very people that made this a once great place to live.

There you go.....the essence of your prejudice against the Park and Mr. Studer.......he is a new comer. By golly, if all the new comers were gone.....it would be a miracle.....the factories and jobs would return.......stellar logic.




Studer is a carpet bagger.

BP Snacks wrote:

hallmarkgrad2 wrote:You are giving all the payments over a thirty year period as the total debt

So how much are we really committed to pay?

Mr ignorant Oats is ignoring your question...he likes to ignore the important stuff.




New comers to the area have trashed our history and belittled the very people that made this a once great place to live.

There you go.....the essence of your prejudice against the Park and Mr. Studer.......he is a new comer. By golly, if all the new comers were gone.....it would be a miracle.....the factories and jobs would return.......stellar logic.




Studer is a carpet bagger.

And you're a bitter twisted little troll hell bent on proving SO's point.

Come on troll....tell us about all of the jobs you have created, and why you should be our next mare (sic).

So you admit the debt is 56 million. Why the need to lie? Now lets talk about the payment......how is it structured to be paid back? Are we going to get more lies? Or will you have the integrity to state the truth? The bonds are being paid back by the leaseholders. So lets assume that we can take the current lie that taxpayers have had to cover the deficiency in the bond payments last year? they did not. However, there is projected shortfalls until the park is built out......let us assume that a 400k shortfall is a permanent condition. 56 million for the park....20 million for the ballpark, and 36 million for remediation and building the 40 acre park.......so without Studer ever being involved, and assuming a 3% return on the bonds.....the public portion of the park would cost the taxpayers about a million a year.....so instead the entire park is facing a 400k shortfall, or a windfall for the public of aproximately600k a year.....and they own the ballpark on top of it........

Why do you think Biloxi is building a ballpark.....do you think the 300k plus folks voting with their feet in Pensacola was a factor......let us try to be civil and start with telling the truth on the cost of the park and the debt.

The annual debt service requirements to maturity for long-term debt are as follows:
Fiscal Year Ending
September 30, Principal Interest Total
2013 $ -- $ 2,008,049 $ 2,008,049
2014 5,787 2,008,049 2,013,836
2015 5,787 2,008,049 2,013,836
2016 5,787 2,008,049 2,013,836
2017 337,365 1,873,159 2,210,524
2018 - 2022 7,534,616 9,329,459 16,864,075
2023 - 2027 9,467,596 7,755,201 17,222,797
2028 - 2032 11,928,740 5,781,533 17,710,273
2033 - 2037 15,035,327 3,296,448 18,331,775
2038 - 2040 9,816,769 523,837 10,340,606
Totals $ 54,137,774 $ 36,591,833 $90,729,607

You just cannot stop lying. First, who is "we".........is this Hallmark.....is it Joe down the street......or is it the leaseholders? Second, there is a difference in the definition of debt, and payment of debt. You argue absurd conceptual blends which make no sense. Every government in America will sell a bond obligation or refinance the same. The bond market may actually discount a bond issue and offer a payoff of that bond which offers higher interest rate and therefore buy the bond obligation for less than the DEBT.....they are purchasing the stream of payment which you confuse with debt.

So in the first instance, the we is not taxpayers, but leaseholders. In the second instance you continue to confuse debt with stream of payments, which is basically dishonest. Finally, you blame Studer for everything and baseball component of the debt is less than half. Sorry, you have not been truthful in this debate. If you want to say the debt is 56 million, and unless the leaseholds fill in......there could be taxpayer monies used to make the payments. I will have an honest debate. I will not remain quiet when the debate is dishonest. At the end of 2013 we can debate a taxpayer subsidy projected at 400k, but the reality is that these subsidies are temporary and consistent with building out the park. It is up to you to debate honestly, but continuing to call debt the stream of payments is dishonest. The debt is 56 million. Over half of that debt has nothing to do with the ballpark or Mr. Studer.

"You just cannot stop lying"/b]


[b]Fuck You!!!

Hell!!! Lets have a real pissing match. I assume you can not keep it Civil

I have kept it civil. It is a lie to say the debt on the park is 100 million and you have admitted the same. It is a lie to say that the taxpayers have paid $400,000 to cover a short fall........this is projected for 2013. So I will call a lie a lie........I have no qualms about putting my foot down on lies, or otherwise people begin believing lies.....and good people like Mr. Studer have their reputations stained by lies. There is plenty of truth in the fact that Mr. Studer bargained for a good deal on the baseball profits. He did negotiate a favorable disposition on the contract, and I argued the same for five years, but to resort to lies to make arguments........it is wrong........there is no middle ground when somebody posts a lie and says the debt on the park is 100 million. It was never 100 million. It may actually be less than the 56 million if the bonds are refinanced by the city.

You can discount my input on this issue because you want to characterize me as now out of state, but I was part of the Market the park was trying to attract in Santa Rosa County, and economic development in your myopic view is entirely local, yet the success of the ballpark does have a positive impact on the entire region and that includes Santa Rosa County and is regional in nature. You have not paid one red cent toward this park, and when you look at your tax bill this November, you will be talking about pennies of obligation if the 400k projected short fall becomes a reality. Sorry, BP makes personal attacks against the fish house and you make personal attacks against Mr. Studer, and I defend people wrongfully attacked by folks who cannot tell the truth.......tell the truth in the debate and you have my respect....but if you lie and call a 56 million dollar debt 00 million.....well you will be telling me to F off a great deal......not a problem with me.....the truth is far more important than worrying about someone cursing me.

No problem Mr Oats.... I just consider the source.

Fortunately living near the Ball Park gives me greater access to other venues in which for me to tell the truth about the CMPA.

hallmarkgrad2 wrote:If you were here in Pensacola then it would be a different story, but you are not. You are involved in something that is just a game or a test of your ego. Like others, you seem to know best for what is best for the people that live here, work here and pay taxes here. You do none of above. So excuse me if I seem a bit short with your observations. Proof is your comments on Biloxi. Are you some type of Global Baseball park Geru? You make it personal when you call me a lier and insult my integrity. The park is what it is. You never projected a 400,000 deficit. You just pick the facts that you think will work.
This also a game for me. I am retired. I have spent most of my life in this area.
Your game has been played before. You are gone from the area and I will wager that one day in future Studer will get enough and also leave.
I do not like being called a liar or having my integrity assaulted.

100% true.