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Rosenstein is out

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zsomething
PkrBum
RealLindaL
7 posters

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1Rosenstein is out Empty Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 11:11 am

RealLindaL



Based on multiple media reports this morning, including CNN, Rod Rosenstein has submitted his verbal resignation to John Kelly in anticipation of being fired, and is reportedly now on his way to the White House to formalize it.

2Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 11:22 am

PkrBum

PkrBum

Good. The guy that signed off on the fisa warrant should've been disqualified from overseeing Mueller.

3Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 12:10 pm

zsomething



I'm hearing varying things. Some say he resigned, some say he's getting fired, some say it's all just rumor.

I think Trump is trying to make him "resign" because then he gets to appoint his replacement. If they fire him, there's less control, and the optics are worse.

Trump's getting terrified because he knows Mueller's uncovering something he did. Anybody who's actually innocent would not have so much fear of an investigation that would clear them. Trump's setting up a constitutional crisis.

Especially now that it looks like he's built the makings of a financial one: https://www.newsweek.com/stock-market-1134867

Only one thing's certain: Putin is overjoyed.

4Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 1:02 pm

EmeraldGhost

EmeraldGhost

So ... if Rosenstein decides to walk away (and I wouldn't blame him one bit, I'd probably have done so months ago were I in his shoes) .... who gets to be the "Acting" Deputy AG (and for all practical purposes AG as regards the Special Counsel investigation) till a replacement is found, vetted, and confirmed?

https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/11/politics/rod-rosenstein-doj-succession-plan/index.html

5Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 1:23 pm

Floridatexan

Floridatexan

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/rod-rosenstein-who-had-been-overseeing-russia-probe-has-offered-to-resign/2018/09/24/d350477c-aad8-11e8-8a0c-70b618c98d3c_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0e120b2202cd&wpisrc=nl_most&wpmm=1

Rod Rosenstein to stay in job for now, will meet with Trump on Thursday, White House says

********

This is Drumpf trying to get Rosenstein to resign, which I don't believe he will do. Drumpf has floated the idea of firing him with staff, but doing so would (rightfully) be seen as further obstruction.

6Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 2:25 pm

2seaoat



I do not see him going anywhere in the short term, but I do understand why he has had enough with the freedom Caucus and especially congressman meadows who is on a mission to get him. I am sure he went to the White House and said get your attack dog to STFU, and let me do my job. The news has been woefully inadequate covering the freedom Caucus going after the assistant AG, but then we would be wasting media time on the gang raper. We are nearing a constitutional crisis. Exactly what Trump and his white nationalist want.

7Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 3:07 pm

RealLindaL



Guess I should've put a question mark at the end of this thread's title. My bad.

8Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/24/2018, 3:36 pm

EmeraldGhost

EmeraldGhost

Floridatexan wrote:

Rod Rosenstein to stay in job for now, will meet with Trump on Thursday, White House says

********
.

So it was "fake news" ? confused

9Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/25/2018, 4:23 pm

othershoe1030

othershoe1030

Rosenstein's fate is still unknown and concerns grow as to whether or not the Mueller investigation's findings, the report will ever reach the Congress since its release is up to the Assistant AG.

I just saw a 30 second ad on Twitter urging people to call their Senators and urge them to bring the "Special Council Independence and Integrity Act" to the floor for a vote. Of course McConnell doesn't want to do it but public pressure has worked amazingly well in the past on certain things. It's worth a try. All lines are busy but you can leave a message.

After all these months of Mueller and his team working with their heads down and away from all the whirling BS it would be a huge shame to never be able to see it.

I really feel that it would be given to the NYT's as the Pentagon Papers were.

Oh, and BTW there is a case coming up in the Supreme Court that is related to the Russia investigation.


According to Natasha Bertrand, investigative reporter for the Atlantic reports on the "case that will consider whether the dual-sovereignty doctrine should be put to rest. The 150-year-old exception to the Fifth Amendment's double-jeopardy clause allows state and federal courts to prosecute the same person for the same criminal offense. According to the brief he filed on September 11, Hatch believes the doctrine should be overturned."

The concern is that if this happened it would expand 45's power to pardon his buddies.

10Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/25/2018, 4:41 pm

Floridatexan

Floridatexan


Linda, some outlets reported this as fact, so don't be so hard on yourself. However, I believe it was a diversion from the Kavanaugh hearings. Now, Drumpf is at the UN making an ass of himself yet again.

11Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 1:57 am

RealLindaL



Floridatexan wrote:
Linda, some outlets reported this as fact, so don't be so hard on yourself.  However, I believe it was a diversion from the Kavanaugh hearings.  Now, Drumpf is at the UN making an ass of himself yet again.

Thanks, FT. Could be right about the diversionary tactic; definitely right about the ass. What an embarrassment before the world, but gotta give the UN members credit for laughing at his usual phony, lying brag about how great his presidency has been so far -- a refreshing change from the sycophantic applause such a lie would've elicited at one of his own rallies. And then the jerk later tried to pretend he'd said it in jest on purpose. What an absolute horse's patoot.

12Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 9:00 am

EmeraldGhost

EmeraldGhost

othershoe1030 wrote:

Oh, and BTW there is a case coming up in the Supreme Court that is related to the Russia investigation.

According to Natasha Bertrand, investigative reporter for the Atlantic reports on the "case that will consider whether the dual-sovereignty doctrine should be put to rest. The 150-year-old exception to the Fifth Amendment's double-jeopardy clause allows state and federal courts to prosecute the same person for the same criminal offense. According to the brief he filed on September 11, Hatch believes the doctrine should be overturned."

The issue of the Russia investigation aside, how do you think SCOTUS should rule on the dual-sovereignty doctrine?

Do you think it's A-Okay that one can be convicted of an offense in the State of Alabama and sentenced to State prison ... and then a Federal agency prosecute them for the exact same offense so they incur additional years of Federal prison time upon completion of their State sentence for that offense?  You do realize those are the circumstances of the instant case before the court?



Last edited by EmeraldGhost on 9/26/2018, 12:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

13Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 12:49 pm

Floridatexan

Floridatexan

EmeraldGhost wrote:
othershoe1030 wrote:

Oh, and BTW there is a case coming up in the Supreme Court that is related to the Russia investigation.

According to Natasha Bertrand, investigative reporter for the Atlantic reports on the "case that will consider whether the dual-sovereignty doctrine should be put to rest. The 150-year-old exception to the Fifth Amendment's double-jeopardy clause allows state and federal courts to prosecute the same person for the same criminal offense. According to the brief he filed on September 11, Hatch believes the doctrine should be overturned."

The issue of the Russia investigation aside, how do you think SCOTUS should rule on the dual-sovereignty document?

Do you think it's A-Okay that one can be convicted of an offense in the State of Alabama and sentenced to State prison ... and then a Federal agency prosecute them for the exact same offense so they incur additional years of Federal prison time upon completion of their State sentence for that offense?  You do realize those are the circumstances of the instant case before the court?  


Do the crime; do the time.

14Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 1:54 pm

EmeraldGhost

EmeraldGhost

Floridatexan wrote:
EmeraldGhost wrote:
othershoe1030 wrote:

Oh, and BTW there is a case coming up in the Supreme Court that is related to the Russia investigation.

According to Natasha Bertrand, investigative reporter for the Atlantic reports on the "case that will consider whether the dual-sovereignty doctrine should be put to rest. The 150-year-old exception to the Fifth Amendment's double-jeopardy clause allows state and federal courts to prosecute the same person for the same criminal offense. According to the brief he filed on September 11, Hatch believes the doctrine should be overturned."

The issue of the Russia investigation aside, how do you think SCOTUS should rule on the dual-sovereignty document?

Do you think it's A-Okay that one can be convicted of an offense in the State of Alabama and sentenced to State prison ... and then a Federal agency prosecute them for the exact same offense so they incur additional years of Federal prison time upon completion of their State sentence for that offense?  You do realize those are the circumstances of the instant case before the court?  


Do the crime; do the time.

Well, oh-kay then! You & I may have some disagreement on that, but whatever ... topic for another thread.

I'm starting to think you & ole Jeff Sessions may just have a thing or two in common. He likes dual-sovereignty with regard to drug and immigration laws in particular.

"When your daddy's done beatin' you for whatever it is you did, your Uncle Sam's gonna come over and beat ya again for the same thing! "

So are you a big fan of our sweeping State and Federal civil asset forfeiture laws too?

15Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 3:17 pm

Floridatexan

Floridatexan


You can stop baiting me any time. I'm not buying your argument. We already know what implications this has.

16Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 3:27 pm

PkrBum

PkrBum

Floridatexan wrote:
You can stop baiting me any time.  I'm not buying your argument.  We already know what implications this has.  

"No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

17Rosenstein is out Empty Re: Rosenstein is out 9/26/2018, 3:42 pm

EmeraldGhost

EmeraldGhost

Floridatexan wrote:
You can stop baiting me any time.  I'm not buying your argument.  We already know what implications this has.  

I'm not "baiting" you ... t'was you brought it up!  If you agree that double-jeopardy is fine and dandy under the separate sovereigns exception, well fine.  I'm not so sure I do.  Neither does the ACLU.

It has real world implications that go way beyond Donald Trump's presidency and the Russian election meddling investigation ... and might not have anything to do at all with Presidential pardon authorities.  That's just (mostly unrelated,) speculation.


....
STATEMENT OF THE CASE

The Fifth Amendment’s Double Jeopardy Clause
guarantees that “No person shall . . . be twice put in
jeopardy” “for the same offence.” That guarantee
rang hollow for Terance Martez Gamble, who, as a
consequence of the Court-created separate-sovereigns
exception, has been subjected to two convictions, and
two sentences, for the single offense of being a felon
in possession of a firearm. As a result of this doubleconviction
and double-sentencing—and contrary to
the text, original meaning, and purpose of the Double
Jeopardy Clause—he must spend three additional
years of his life behind bars.

1. In 2008, Gamble was convicted of seconddegree
robbery in Mobile County, Alabama. J.A. 27.
Because second-degree robbery is a felony offense in
Alabama, both federal and state law barred him from subsequently possessing a firearm. See Ala. Code
§§ 13A-11-70(2), 13A-11-72(a); 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(1).

2. More than seven years later, on November 29,
2015, Gamble was driving in Mobile when a police
officer pulled him over for a faulty headlight. See J.A.
27. The officer smelled marijuana and, upon
searching Gamble’s car, discovered two baggies of
marijuana, a digital scale, and a 9mm handgun. See
id.

3. Alabama prosecuted Gamble for possessing
marijuana and violating a state law that “prohibits a
convicted felon from possessing a pistol.” Ex parte
Taylor, 636 So. 2d 1246, 1246 (Ala. 1993); see Ala.
Code §§ 13A-11-70(2), 13A-11-72(a). Gamble received
a one-year sentence. Dist. Ct. ECF No. 34 at 7.

4. While the state prosecution was pending, the
federal government charged Gamble for the same
offense under federal law: being a felon in possession
of a firearm. See 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(1) (prohibiting
felons from “possess[ing] in or affecting commerce[ ]
any firearm”). The federal charge was premised on
“the same incident of November 29, 2015 that gave
rise to his state court conviction.” Pet. App. 6a; see
also J.A. 27

Gamble raised one and only one objection to his
federal prosecution: that it violated his “Fifth
Amendment [right] against being placed twice in
jeopardy for the same crime.” Dist. Ct. ECF No. 18 at
1. He moved to dismiss his federal indictment on
that ground. Id.

The District Court, in a thorough opinion, denied
Gamble’s motion. Pet. App. 5a–10a. Although the
court recognized that Gamble had been subject to duplicative prosecutions, it had no choice but to adhere to this Court’s separate-sovereigns exception.
“[U]nless and until the Supreme Court overturns”
that exception, the District Court concluded,
“Gamble’s Double Jeopardy claim must . . . fail.
” Id.
at 10a.

....
https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/17/17-646/62536/20180904142141905_17-646%20ts.pdf

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