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You’re not just imagining it: the Hillary Clinton vs Donald Trump vote totals do look rigged

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Floridatexan

Floridatexan


http://www.palmerreport.com/opinion/youre-not-just-imagining-it-the-hillary-clinton-vs-donald-trump-vote-totals-do-look-rigged/104/



"As a political journalist, I hate empty conspiracy theories. I like to go where the bulk of the evidence is pointing. So even though I’m as shocked at Donald Trump’s victory over Hillary Clinton as anyone else, I have been unwilling to preemptively accuse the vote totals of having been rigged or altered. It’s taken me nine days of looking at the numbers and trends and patterns, but I’ve come to the conclusion that for once, the conspiracy theorists appear to have been right: this election looks rigged.

There is no single smoking gun in the voting results which led me to this conclusion of its own accord. Rather it’s the totality of all of what I’m about to lay out which has led me to the conclusion that there was indeed something fishy with the numbers, the sheer number of highly unlikely red flags. So bear with me as I lay out a mountain of evidence.

What first made me suspicious was the notably low general election voter turnout. Pundits have explained that away by pointing out that Clinton’s favorability rating was fairly low and Trump’s was even lower. But throughout the primary season, the American voters made clear that they very much wanted to turn out for or against these two candidates. And despite all the talk about favorability, these two candidates each got millions more primary votes than any of their challengers. So the notion that the 2016 election would receive two and a half million fewer votes than the 2012 election, which most Americans considered to be a far less consequential election, is odd. But the demographic breakdowns are what truly raise eyebrows.

Some have pointed to voter suppression in certain swing states as the supposed reason for lower voter turnout. But the 2012 election was subject to the same kinds of suppression. And for that matter, so were the 2016 primary contests. Despite the voter purging and long lines, we saw African-Americans in southern states come out of the woodwork to vote for Hillary Clinton in the 2016 democratic primary, even though they didn’t necessarily dislike Bernie Sanders. But according to the official tallies, those same African-Americans in North Carolina suddenly decided they no longer cared if Hillary Clinton won the 2016 general election, even though she was now facing an opponent in Donald Trump whom they viewed as an abhorrent racist.

Other states and other demographics raise other red flags. For instance, somewhere around seventy percent of all the votes cast in the 2016 general election in Florida were cast early. Various exit polls pointed to Hillary Clinton receiving as somewhere between 54% and 59% of the Florida early vote, much of it from Hispanic-Americans. That meant Trump would have had to have received somewhere between 59% and 71% of the election day voting in Florida in order to have caught up and tied the state. He would have needed between 62% and 74% of the election day vote to have won it by the one percent overall margin he supposedly won it by.

Although democrats tend to do somewhat better in early voting and republicans tend to do somewhat better on election day, it’s virtually impossible for Trump to have come back and won Florida after it was already basically in the bag for Clinton before election day even arrived. See my full mathematical breakdown for Florida voting in the middle of this article for why he simply couldn’t have come back to even tie up Florida, let alone win it.

There has also been much made of how the polls ended up being so wrong. Having spent the past year and a half observing the polls in this election, I fully agree that it’s easy for one or two polls to end up being very wrong. We saw it all the time in the primary season. But historically speaking, going back through the eighty years in which presidential polling has been conducted, it’s virtually impossible for the polling averages to have been this thoroughly wrong. In fact the last time they got a Presidential general election wrong outside the margin of error was in 1948 – and polling was unsophisticated crap back then.

But nevermind the overwhelmingly unlikely odds of the 2016 polling averages having been wrong. The more immediate trend is one which we saw during the primary season. In any given hotly contested primary state, Donald Trump tended to perform the same as, or worse than, his polling averages. We saw it in his very first contest in Iowa, where he shockingly lost despite being favored. We saw it again in Wisconsin and other states. In contrast, Hillary Clinton tended to perform about the same as, or better than, her polling averages in most states. For instance she was favored to win South Carolina by around twenty points and she won it by more than forty points.

In a general election matchup between one candidate who had spent the past year underperforming his poll numbers, and one candidate who had spent the year outperforming her polls numbers, the logically expected outcome is that Hillary Clinton would have won by the same amount she was ahead in the polling averages or more. Now she did win the popular vote in the general election by around one percent. But logically, based on the final polling averages and the existing pattern observed in the primaries, she should have won it by four points or more.

Finally, there were four swing states in which Hillary Clinton was definitively favored to win, but she ended up losing: Florida, Wisconsin, Pennsylvnia, and Michigan. In the final tallies she lost each of them by right around one percent of the vote. That’s not how numbers work. If Trump had won those four states legitimately due to pockets of voters that pollsters didn’t know about, we would have seen a more random dispersion of the results. Trump might have won one of those states by four percent, won another of them by two percent, lost another one percent, and so on.

It is statistically suspicious that in every state where Donald Trump pulled off an upset, he won it by right around one percent, just what he needed to win it, no more and no less. Results don’t naturally play out that way. The final tallies in Florida, Wisconsin, Pennsylvnia, and Michigan read like someone went through and nudged each of them just over the mark so Trump would win them, but didn’t want to arouse too much suspicion by giving him any larger of a victory in those states than he needed.

So where does all of the above get us? It’s a mountain of statistical and mathematical and logical and demographic discrepancy and suspicion and nothing more. I can’t definitively prove that the vote tallies were rigged. And as a practical matter it would be so tricky for a hacker to rig the results in various states, without any of the local precinct overseers catching on, that no one has even been able to posit a plausible method for pulling it off. But still, these things can’t all have legitimately happened.

In order to believe that the official vote tallies are legitimate, you have to accept that all of the above legitimately happened: African-Americans in the south went from turning out in droves for Hillary Clinton in the primary to not caring if she won the general election. Donald Trump got sixty-something percent of the same-day voting in Florida. The polling averages were wrong for the first time in modern history. Trump beat his poll numbers despite having spent the primary season tending to fall below them. Clinton fell below her poll numbers despite having spent the primary season tending to beat them. In every state where Trump pulled off a shocking upset victory, he just happened to do it with one percent of the vote. And in an election that everyone cared particularly deeply about, no one really turned out to vote at all. I can accept any one of the above things happening as an isolated fluke. I cannot accept all the above happening. And so for once in my evidence-driven career, I’m left to believe that the conspiracy theorists are right: the vote tallies are rigged..."

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Floridatexan

Floridatexan



Exit polls in 4 states fall outside margin of error: Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Florida.

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

I don't buy any of  the vote-rigging arguments. Heck, PeeDog still thinks the vote was 'rigged' against Trump, even though Trump won. Razz

http://www.best-electric-barbecue-grills.com

Sal

Sal

The national results could be tipped by manipulating the vote in a fairly small number of jurisdictions.

A risk-limiting audit could pretty easily reveal such anomalies.

Given the Russian tampering of which we're already aware, it seems like a reasonable precaution.

2seaoat



Total nonsense. The folks most impacted by a Republican President failed to go out and vote. I have zero sympathy for their whining now. We each have a civic duty to participate, but when folks in Michigan and Wisconsin did not even bother to vote..........I do not want to hear about rigged elections. You live with the consequences, and other than my moral outrage, I will probably benefit financially from a Republican President, and those folks who did not bother to vote will be gutted and face serious economic impact. I guess it will take something more than civic duty to turn slugs into citizens.

Sal

Sal

2seaoat wrote:Total nonsense.  

It's not nonsense.

In an age when computers count the vast majority of ballots cast, and we have evidence that foreign adversaries have actively sought to manipulate the outcome, a routine audit should be an automatic assurance to our democracy.

This could be very effectively done by looking at a minuscule percentage of ballots cast.

Floridatexan

Floridatexan


http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/11/nsa-chief-wikileaks-democrats-emails-were-conscious-effort

(video)

gatorfan



Hilarious. During the campaign when Trumpet was tootling about voter fraud you liberals were absolutely certain it didn't exist. Now with the surprise outcome there are vast conspiracies of voter fraud/manipulation. What a bunch of hypocritical children. You've hit rock bottom yet continue to dig.

2seaoat



Again, nonsense. Hillary Clinton never went to Madison. There was a huge fired up progressive coalition in Madison and she took them and the Milwaukee voters for granted. The stupid son of bitches thought they were showing Hillary and her banker buddies with their protest not voting, but all they did was allow the potential for theft beyond anything in American political history. Pleaseeeeee stop. Will someone finally admit that dumb as a board far left progressives, Hispanics, and blacks stayed at home and did not vote. Ed Rundell warned Clinton not to take white blue collar voters for granted, yet no trip to Wisconsin after the primary........conspiracy my asz. I know Wisconsin elections and Walker made it more difficult with voter access legislation, but a committed voter gets to the polls and votes. I am sick of excuses. The vast majority of Americans wanted nothing to do with a President Trump, and the media had everybody convinced that Hillary would win, and people stayed home.....they made a conscious decision......quit it .

Guest


Guest

I knew this was coming ....Dems have to complain about something and not accept the wholesale rejection of the last eight years of failure under Obama whom Hillary had hitched her chances to and failed. Obama has failed the middle class and that was the main issue.  Working people rejected the democratic bullshit because most are far worse off now than in 2008. Part of that is the obamacare tax. How stupid is it to tax(forced insurance) peope who can't afford insurance as it is and then make them pay a penalty for a product they can't afford to use? The middle class can't afford to subsidize those who can't afford insurance period. The economy was bad in 08, but to add thousands of dollars in insurance premiums onto people struggling to make ends meet was the exact reason the economy is worse. Top it off by bringing in more people from other nations to compete for already low paying jobs turned Working folks away from the Dems. This was even after Obama said he was going to put coal miners out of work for good. Made it very easy for trump to get those votes. Rejection of the Obama agenda cost Hillary the top spot. It's not rocket science.  

2seaoat



Wholesale rejection......hardly. Almost two million people voted for Hillary more than Donald Trump.......that is unprecedented in American History and dwarfs the 2000 election popular vote, and not since the 1880s has anything even close to the rejection of a winning President been present. Please do not confuse a two million vote win for Hillary to be a mandate for rejection of President Obama's success. The truth is Hillary was in Arizona campaigning for a historic mandate and was running such a poor strategy that she failed to realize she was in deep trouble in Michigan and Wisconsin which she assumed were automatic electoral votes. Huge error on her part, and not one scintilla of evidence of a mandate by the American people.

Guest


Guest

Remember the talkingpoint that the pub party was on it's death bed? If it's not a mandate... nothing is.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/11/12/these-3-maps-show-just-how-dominant-republicans-are-in-america-after-tuesday/

When it comes to control of state government, Republicans dominated at record levels during the Obama years. On Tuesday, they somehow managed to become even more dominant.

In part because Americans like a check and balance on their president, in part because Republicans played their cards right, Republicans grabbed more of America's statehouses and governor's mansions during the Obama administration than at any time in the modern era. And they held onto those majorities Tuesday.

Results are still trickling in, but it looks like Republicans will still control an all-time high 69 of 99 state legislative chambers. They'll hold at least 33 governorships, tying a 94-year-old record.

That means that come 2017, they'll have total control of government in at least 25 states, and partial control in 20 states. According to population calculations by the conservative group Americans for Tax Reform, that translates to roughly 80 percent of the population living in a state either all or partially controlled by Republicans.


Things are just as good for the GOP at the federal level, where Republicans have reached the trifecta. They just won the White House, they've kept their majorities in Congress and they have a chance to reshape the Supreme Court to a strong conservative ideological leaning.

Democrats, meanwhile, will go into 2017 without any significant gains in Congress and with total control of just five states.

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

Tellthetruth wrote:

I knew this was coming .... 


Nice regurgitation of some Breitbart Cliff's Notes, PeeDog....

How many threads did you start the week before the election declaring that it was being stolen for Hillary Clinton?

And you ABSOLUTELY know that had Hillary won, there would be 25 first-page forum threads crafted by you and Lame Dork poster Markle on how the election was 'stolen' from Donald Trump. Those threads would have started the Wednesday after election Tuesday, and would still be going today.

I do not believe the election was stolen, myself, so there. That being said, you can stuff the hypocrisy and get off your pedestal. You are the biggest whiner on this forum, and you know you were ready to whine about Democratic foul-play, which did not happen (no 3 million illegals from California voted in this election--I don't care what your wingnut trash-news sites are claiming on this).

http://www.best-electric-barbecue-grills.com

Floridatexan

Floridatexan

gatorfan wrote:Hilarious. During the campaign when Trumpet was tootling about voter fraud you liberals were absolutely certain it didn't exist. Now with the surprise outcome there are vast conspiracies of voter fraud/manipulation. What a bunch of hypocritical children. You've hit rock bottom yet continue to dig.

You are confused. There's a difference between voter fraud, which is practically non-existent, and electoral fraud.

Guest


Guest

Floridatexan wrote:
gatorfan wrote:Hilarious. During the campaign when Trumpet was tootling about voter fraud you liberals were absolutely certain it didn't exist. Now with the surprise outcome there are vast conspiracies of voter fraud/manipulation. What a bunch of hypocritical children. You've hit rock bottom yet continue to dig.

You are confused.  There's a difference between voter fraud, which is practically non-existent, and electoral fraud.  

Hahahahahaha Laughing

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