MADD At Odds Over DUI Proposal (For Seaoats)

It is not an either/or choice, we need to do both. We need mandatory ignition interlocks in every car as standard equipment, like the seatbelt, airbags, turn signals, and brake lights. I have no problem with the Sheriff's program, but it is a thinly veiled attempt by the alcohol merchants to stop the totally successful interlocks from expanding........by golly happy hour will not be so happy when Joe drunk tries to go home and his car will not start........the Smith family however will forever be grateful that the Mother's are finally focusing and standing up to the alcohol industry.

I would think that something as simple as a "Aerosol can of "crank my car" or some thing similar could defeat any interlock system. How is the "piss" tests working out? People carry piss around with them to defeat the test and that is with people watching. People will go extremes to defeat any system. Given the demand, some hacker will be on it like stink on Sh,t. You would have to have all the states included it in their vehicle inspections to make sure it worked. Hell, many states, Florida and Alabama for example dont even have Vehicle inspections. Bald tires, Bad brakes, defective Tie rods? No problem...

That is really funny. My daughter in the SA office four years ago dealt with all the people that thought they could outsmart the interlocks. Sorry, they have protocols which catch about 95% of the violators, and she had some hysterical stories about the ankle bracelets. Sorry to pop your bubble, but that boy did not have a bit to drink, and all this dumb asz folks are going to go out drinking thinking that their air mattress fan will get them home....too funny. Certainly, there is always ways to outsmart systems, but when there is redundancy and checks within the protocols most folks are going to be getting compliance. If every car had them on, it would cut up to 30k deaths and serious injuries caused by drunk drivers. Such a small price to save lives and cut insurance rates is being fought for only one reason.....death peddlers who think their bottom line will be impacted....it will.

I have a problem with doing both.

I don't want drunks on the road either, I have children out there driving and one not very long. its scary.

but at some point with this program and many others you need to weight the effectiveness of spending so much money. There needs to be a actual measurable improvement.

If there is no improvement then spending this money is doing nothing but satisfying the ignorant.

Then you would have to mandate that every vehicle has a at least a OBDII engine management system. My old Ford truck is Carburetored with a stand along ignition system. It would be very hard to prevent me from driving it. If you had read the Blog link, you can see where the people discuss the sophistication of such systems. But I think such issues beg the question about the real issues. How about liability for false readings? What happens in an emergency if the system malfunctions and some one dies? Will there be over ride provisions? How much more complex will it make the servicing and repair of vehicles? Look at the hue and cry over the latest GM "key" issue. Auto manufacturers have problems with electrical/computer systems with out the added complexity of another complex, sophisticated system that requires additional input from the driver. Would people with Lung issues not be able to drive?
It is a interesting topic. The weak link may be the people who service such devices. People who have devised ways to defeat such systems are not about to publish such information for free or where it will known to the general public. People can hack your new Iphone in a flash, if they choose to do so.
Compliance based on technology will always raise the ire of many people.

The enemy of good is perfect. To argue that 30k people have to die or be injured by drunk drivers every year, and that the balance of Americans spend hundreds of billions of extra insurance rates, extra police, extra jailers, extra prosecutors, and pain and suffering of victims because less than 5% of drivers may have malfunction or compromise, is simply stupid. When air bags were first implemented it took a decade to make their engagements less traumatic on the passengers and more protective.

The design will require modules which will allow software and hardware upgrades which allow the redundancy and protocols, and those exists today. As to liability issues, there is a simple solution. Tax the death peddlers and establish a compensation fund. I remember vividly in seventh grade debating mandatory seatbelts in cars as an assignment in an english class. It was argued that if a person crashed they would burn up because they were strapped in, or if they drove into a lake drown. Idiocy. The cost will be miniscule because almost all vehicles now have onboard computers which will allow small relative costs to bring sanity to the current broken system where huge profits are being made by the merchants of death, and folks with vested interests in keeping full employment in the criminal justice system.........this could have been done five years ago and double the people lost in Viet Nam have died while the death merchants and their special interests fight interlocks........a guaranteed process which lower their profits by ten percent or more....of course they would rather see families suffer from impaired drivers than seek solutions which impact their bottom line.....

..this could have been done five years ago and double the people lost in Viet Nam have died while the death ..

Assuming of course that interlock devices completely eliminate any deaths from an impaired driver. That is going to be one hell of a good system.

Your Logic is flawed......

I'd hate to go through life so worried that a drunk driver was going to plow into me that I would suggest putting yet another inconvenient piece of equipment on all cars. Drunks will drive no matter what, just accept the risk and move on.

Fear is a great driver of statism.

http://responsibility.org/drunk-driving/drunk-driving-fatalities-national-statistics

According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) 33,561 people died in traffic crashes in 2012 in the United States (latest figures available), including an estimated 10,322 people who died in drunk driving crashes, accounting for 31% of all traffic deaths that year.

Since NHTSA began recording alcohol-related statistics in 1982, drunk driving fatalities have decreased 51% from 21,113 in 1982. Since the inception of The Foundation for Advancing Alcohol Responsibility and our national efforts to fight drunk driving, drunk driving fatalities have declined 35% from 15,827 in 1991. (Source: NHTSA/FARS, 2013)

Hmmm.  Well, clearly this little statist experiment has ran its course.  The results are in and they are clear.  Cough bullshit cough.  Repeal all policy as it pertains to drunk driving!  The state is taking away our freedom to die violently in an alcohol related car crash! Let us return to the better days of self governance, and when DUI fatalities were double what they are today!

Right, PkrBum?

BAN PRIVATE CARS..!!

Apparently in "Libertopia", there is no policy that exists between "BAN ALL CARS!!!111" and "DRIVE AS DRUNK AS YOU LIKE!!!!!111" And this makes sense. If we use our local libertarians as a guide, it is clear that they haven't quite thought this whole "Libertopia" thing through.


Right, PkrBum?

boards of FL wrote:Apparently in "Libertopia", there is no policy that exists between "BAN ALL CARS!!!111" and "DRIVE AS DRUNK AS YOU LIKE!!!!!111" And this makes sense. If we use our local libertarians as a guide, it is clear that they haven't quite thought this whole "Libertopia" thing through.


Right, PkrBum?

People make bad decisions... so the fewer they have the safer we all are. Laws might not stop people that break laws... but there's no reason not to make as many as we can think of. Prohibitions promote a free society... cheers comrades..!!

33000 deaths from impaired drivers. I'd be willing to bet that more people die from drowning or being beat by a claw hammer than that.

Perhaps they can tell us how little it cost and how wonderfully it works when they voluntarily installed one in their car?

Mr Ichi wrote:It would be logical to approach the issue on relevance.  First things first.  

Top Accident Causes

Driver distraction and speeding ranked above drunk driving as the leading causes of motor vehicle accidents, but in 2010, deaths due to speeding and alcohol were about equal. NHTSA reported that 32,885 people were killed in 2010, of which 10,228 died in alcohol-related crashes and 10,395 as a result of speeding. It's important to note, however, that 39 percent of the speed-related crashes were by males aged between 15 and 24. The 21 to 24 age group also accounts for 34 percent of all alcohol-related fatalities

So only 10,000 died due to impaired driving? Good lord! Why is this even in debate?

Because it promotes govt controls. You have to realize the sort of people we're dealing with. Govt is God to them.

PkrBum wrote:Because it promotes govt controls. You have to realize the sort of people we're dealing with. Govt is God to them.

That's right.

These people sit up there looking at every little flaw in humanity and then come up with some gov solution. sell it to the gullible public in order to create more control for them. More need for them and more of our money going towards them. And I have yet to see many of their gov solutions actually produce worthy results.

It seems to me that it should also be noted that "alcohol impaired" does not mean legally drunk. MADD, and other advocacy groups use the figure to advance their cause. Many times to their own detriment.

I guess 2seaoats wants the same for marijuana, every other type drug and how do you have a ignition lock for texting?

Have you considered banning 5 gallon buckets? Infants drown in them every year.

Hard as it is to imagine, stuff happens. It is not anyone's business if I wear or do not wear a seatbelt.

There is a simple solution if all these folks really want to save thousands of lives from accidents.

Instead of a stupid lockout system, each and every car is equipped with a sharp pointed, six inch spike, pointed at the driver in place of the airbag on the steering wheel. Oh, at the same time, do away with all traffic signals.

I guess 2seaoats wants the same for marijuana, every other type drug and how do you have a ignition lock for texting?

There are currently effective cell phone blockers which block a cell phone when are car is running. You could have block with car running in park, or turned off. There is no reason that a cell phone should operate in a car which is in gear. We went fifty years without them, and we can save lives by mandating blocking of cell phones in a vehicle which is on and in gear.

Pot, prescription drugs, and other agents which can impair driver performance have to be looked at in the future. However, the enemy of good is perfect, and to wait for a system that can detect the full spectrum of agents which impair is simply silly. We need mandatory ignition interlocks, and some people who have the courage to fight for the legislation and take on the alcohol industry.