Why Americans are dying earlier than their international peers

Sal wrote:


Look for the union label.

Well actually the thing to look for is the made-in-u.s. label in Walmart (union or not).
And, regardless of all the bs about "manufacturing coming back home", that label is just as elusive as ever. In fact it's still almost non-existent. But Dollar Tree (should be called China Tree) is opening even more stores.

Besides being an obese society people want to compound the problem by legalizing marijuana. So by all means lets just keep shoving down big macs and smoke some weed. After all when we are all obese and dying from lung cancer or emphysema from smoking to much weed, we will have obamacare to save us.

Bob wrote:

Markle wrote:

Our children and our grandchildren will never enjoy the standard of living that we do

Yes and it's for a myriad of reasons. But the most significant reason is simply this.
For a half century we were in a period of economic prosperity. We were the manufacturer to the world and that gave us a thriving middle class.
But over time the rest of the world started competing with us on that. And they had and have an almost limitless labor force that will work for a helluva lot less wages than we require. That was the genesis of our transition from economic prosperity to economic decline.
And so far I see no light at the end of that tunnel. I'm trying, but I can't.

Each minimum wage increase forced that many more jobs overseas while accomplishing nothing but making the Progressives feel warm and fuzzy. Same with thousands of unnecessary and costly regulations.

NaNook wrote:I would suggest the average 65 year old couple having 75k in savings might be a clue. Then again, we live in a "provide for me" culture.

Get it??? Personal responsibility........where did it go?

The War on Poverty and Great Society of President Lyndon Baines Johnson.

The low income family unit once was one of the strongest and it is now one of the weakest. With almost every law we strongly discourage marriage and encourage single parents with children. The children grow up without a roll model and are taught that government will feed and take care of them.

Markle wrote:

Each minimum wage increase forced that many more jobs overseas while accomplishing nothing but making the Progressives feel warm and fuzzy.

I dunno, markel. If the answer was to bring our wages down to the same 50 cents per hour the Asians will work for, I'm just not sure if we could have then still afforded to buy the Walmart merchandise. And if we couldn't afford to buy the Walmart merchandise, then the "job creators" would be out of business too.
Not to mention that, without a "minimum wage", those workers would not have enough money to pay rent to those landlords you sell houses to, markle. And those houses would go unsold.

You see, all that election talk about the "job creators" missed an important point about job creation. It's not only the members of the Walton family who are responsible for creating the jobs, it's also all us Walmart customers who play just as important a role in that job creation. If we aren't putting money into Waltons' cash registers, then the Waltons of the world aint gonna be creating jack shit.
There's a symbiotic relationship between the haves and have nots. Unfortunately, neither Sean Hannity nor Ed Schultz were ever smart enough to comprehend that. And since the American public relies on either Hannity or Schultz to do it's thinking for it, the public aint smart enough to comprehend that either. So it champions either the democrat or the republican and, in the words of Ann Coulter, that's what makes it's IQ "higher than a toaster".

Bob wrote:Markle, I think you have a tendency to look at everything through the obama lens.
The obama lens colors your thinking. Since you're convinced obama and obamacare (and everything else obama touches) is so evil, you cannot bring yourself to take an objective look at the status quo. And in this case the status quo is the pre-obamacare health care system.
Yes, Obamacare may indeed prove to be a bunch of crap that will end up a complete failure costing us even more than the status quo. But just because one turd stinks, that doesn't make the turd that was already on the ground smell any sweeter.
Our country is in decline, markel. It was in decline before obama, it continues to be in decline with obama, and it will remain in decline after obama.

Hold on there a minute bob. this article gives no FACTS claiming the problem is our healthcare system. Yes, I read the whole thing. It does try to paint a picture supporting gov health, but in reality it goes all over the place trying to point fingers at different elements of the cause of our demise. So dont be rushing into blaming pre obama healthcare. and trust me, the after obama healthcare will and is NOT an improvement.

We have a large population of africans,african people have shorter lifespans couple that with a more increasing sediment lifestyle of sitting at home eating foodstamp gmo filled snacks, it probaly is a problem.

however, i still call bullshit on the whole article. it doesnt give you any actual data, just a lot of propaganda bs that goes all over the place tossing shit at a wall hoping something sticks in favor of socialized healthcare modeled after europe.

and pretty much every thing markle as stated is dead on. Ive watched on. He's very articulate and has the right information.

People really need to read the article carefully. it has an objective, and that objective is to prepare you or sell you on the idea of a health system like europes. thats it.

Bob wrote:Last edited by Bob on Fri 11 Jan - 7:41; edited 4 times in total

Hey, bds, would you please turn off the function that reveals all that. It makes me look retarded and obsessive.

Chrissy wrote:

Hold on there a minute bob.

We have a large population of africans,african people have shorter lifespans

Hold on there a minute, Chrissy.

African immigrants to Europe include European citizens and residents born in or with ancestors from Africa. Though it has increased massively in recent decades, immigration from Africa to Europe is not a recent phenomenon, with Africa and Asia traditionally being the largest sources of migration to the continent.

With over one million migrants a year and 299,000 asylum applications in 2006 alone, Europe is the primary destination for African migrants worldwide. Migratory flows from Africa currently make up the largest share of migration into Europe. The majority of African migrants living overseas are in Europe, approximately 4.6 million, according to the International Organization for Migration. But the Migration Policy Institute believes there are between seven and eight million irregular African immigrants living in the EU - the actual number changing depending on regularisation schemes in the member states. About two-thirds of Africans in Europe are from North Africa (particularly Algeria, Morocco, and Tunisia). An increasing number of immigrants are from Western Africa (mainly Ghana, Nigeria, and Senegal).[1][2]
concentrated mainly in Belgium, France, Italy, the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_to_Europe

Bob wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

Hold on there a minute bob.

We have a large population of africans,african people have shorter lifespans

Hold on there a minute, Chrissy.

African immigrants to Europe include European citizens and residents born in or with ancestors from Africa. Though it has increased massively in recent decades, immigration from Africa to Europe is not a recent phenomenon, with Africa and Asia traditionally being the largest sources of migration to the continent.

With over one million migrants a year and 299,000 asylum applications in 2006 alone, Europe is the primary destination for African migrants worldwide. Migratory flows from Africa currently make up the largest share of migration into Europe. The majority of African migrants living overseas are in Europe, approximately 4.6 million, according to the International Organization for Migration. But the Migration Policy Institute believes there are between seven and eight million irregular African immigrants living in the EU - the actual number changing depending on regularisation schemes in the member states. About two-thirds of Africans in Europe are from North Africa (particularly Algeria, Morocco, and Tunisia). An increasing number of immigrants are from Western Africa (mainly Ghana, Nigeria, and Senegal).[1][2]
concentrated mainly in Belgium, France, Italy, the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_to_Europe

do you not read your links before you give them? the black population is still way lower than ours.

we have 40 million
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_American

and then theres the infant mortality which isnt counted the same in every country. which is why markle brought that up.

The main problem is inconsistent measurement across nations. The United Nations Statistics Division, which collects data on infant mortality, stipulates that an infant, once it is removed from its mother and then "breathes or shows any other evidence of life such as beating of the heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles... is considered live-born regardless of gestational age."16 While the U.S. follows that definition, many other nations do not. Demographer Nicholas Eberstadt notes that in Switzerland "an infant must be at least 30 centimeters long at birth to be counted as living."17 This excludes many of the most vulnerable infants from Switzerland's infant mortality measure.

Switzerland is far from the only nation to have peculiarities in its measure. Italy has at least three different definitions for infant deaths in different regions of the nation.18 The United Nations Statistics Division notes many other differences.19 Japan counts only births to Japanese nationals living in Japan, not abroad. Finland, France and Norway, by contrast, do count births to nationals living outside of the country. Belgium includes births to its armed forces living outside Belgium but not births to foreign armed forces living in Belgium. Finally, Canada counts births to Canadians living in the U.S., but not Americans living in Canada. In short, many nations count births that are in no way an indication of the efficacy of their own health care systems.

http://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA547ComparativeHealth.html

nationally, black babies are more than twice as likely as white babies to die before the age of 1. Here in Pittsburgh, the rate is five times
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/15/us/efforts-to-combat-high-infant-mortality-rate-among-blacks.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

so not only do blacks have a lower life span, infant mortality is also much higher.

Theres nothing wrong with the care americans have been getting from this healthcare system. If you want universal healthcare fine, just say it. And when you do, please look at the countries that actually have it so you can see what your going to get. Its not the pretty picture people like to paint. But your free to buy into any propaganda you want. You are after all an american.

Here bob, you can see the distribution of blacks through out the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_diaspora

I got to go to work.

Bob wrote:

Bob wrote:Last edited by Bob on Fri 11 Jan - 7:41; edited 4 times in total

Hey, bds, would you please turn off the function that reveals all that. It makes me look retarded and obsessive.

I can't turn it off.

Chrissy wrote:Hold on there a minute bob. this article gives no FACTS claiming the problem is our healthcare system. Yes, I read the whole thing. It does try to paint a picture supporting gov health, but in reality it goes all over the place trying to point fingers at different elements of the cause of our demise. So dont be rushing into blaming pre obama healthcare. and trust me, the after obama healthcare will and is NOT an improvement.

We have a large population of africans,african people have shorter lifespans couple that with a more increasing sediment lifestyle of sitting at home eating foodstamp gmo filled snacks, it probaly is a problem.

however, i still call bullshit on the whole article. it doesnt give you any actual data, just a lot of propaganda bs that goes all over the place tossing shit at a wall hoping something sticks in favor of socialized healthcare modeled after europe.

and pretty much every thing markle as stated is dead on. Ive watched on. He's very articulate and has the right information.

People really need to read the article carefully. it has an objective, and that objective is to prepare you or sell you on the idea of a health system like europes. thats it.

Neither your not Markle's reply directly addressed the primary finding of the study, which is that our average lifespan is increasing at a slower rate than that of other developed countries. You two are trying to explain the actual lifespan itself rather than the rate at which it is increasing, hence all of your long winded replies are irrelevant. This is why I wonder if either of you actually read the article before responding.

I think we seem to be establishing a premise that those Americans of african descent are dropping like flies while anglos and other caucasians are far more healthy and live so much longer. And we're doing that in an attempt to rationalize the findings of this health study.

Being uneducated about this, I decided to google "health and lifespan of africans vs caucasians".

That takes me to this...

https://www.google.com/search?q=health+and+lifespan+of+africans+vs+caucasians&rlz=1C1KMZB_enUS515US515&oq=health+and+lifespan+of+africans+vs+caucasians&aqs=chrome.0.57.9643&sugexp=chrome,mod=4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

And the first google result I clicked on is this one...

U.S. racial gap in life expectancy shrinks: study

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-06-05/lifestyle/sns-rt-us-usa-health-racebre85417k-20120605_1_life-expectancy-racial-gap-ellen-meara

and there's also...

Life expectancy gap narrows between blacks, whites

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&ved=0CEsQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Farticles.latimes.com%2F2012%2Fjun%2F05%2Fscience%2Fla-sci-life-expectancy-gap-20120606&ei=minwUJPQI6Ke2QXDvYGoAg&usg=AFQjCNGmZYLnkfR8dD6ju73w9GcwhHa0-w&bvm=bv.1357700187,d.b2I

and this...

Lifespan Gap Shrinks Between Whites, Blacks

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&ved=0CFUQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fhealth.usnews.com%2Fhealth-news%2Fnews%2Farticles%2F2012%2F06%2F05%2Flifespan-gap-shrinks-between-whites-blacks&ei=minwUJPQI6Ke2QXDvYGoAg&usg=AFQjCNEXvJh-C3s4MDKptdptjQZ2PDLTKw&bvm=bv.1357700187,d.b2I

Chrissy wrote: If you want universal healthcare fine, just say it. And when you do, please look at the countries that actually have it so you can see what your going to get. Its not the pretty picture people like to paint. But your free to buy into any propaganda you want. You are after all an american.

If that's what I'm advocating then it sure is peculiar that I would post this on page 2 of the thread...

Yes, Obamacare may indeed prove to be a bunch of crap that will end up a complete failure costing us even more than the status quo.

What you're doing is exactly what I referred to earlier. Your mindset is that we have only two options.

1. the status quo which is costing us more than double per capita of the next country on the list (the Sean Hannity republican solution).
or
2. Obamacare (the Ed Schultz democrat solution).

I'm just crazy enough to believe that there can actually be ideas in this world OTHER than either of those two. But that's why my IQ is equal to a toaster.

boards of FL wrote:

Bob wrote:

Bob wrote:Last edited by Bob on Fri 11 Jan - 7:41; edited 4 times in total

Hey, bds, would you please turn off the function that reveals all that. It makes me look retarded and obsessive.

I can't turn it off.

Well in that case you're forgiven. And I'll just have to start taking enough time to get the posts the way I want em before I submit them.

But I must say that I've never read a book by an author and on the last page it says "for your information this author has edited this book dozens of times".