Another Shooter - 2 Firefighters Dead, 2 Firefighters Wounded, At Least 3 Houses Burned to the Ground

Audio to the shooting, my guys are professional as ever....even when shot.

Latest Updates:

West Webster Volunteer Firefighters Tomasz Kaczówka, also a 911 dispatcher, and Michael Chiapperini, who was also a Police Lieutenant and PIO with the Webster Police Department, were killed. Volunteer Firefighters Theodore Scardino and Joseph Hofsetter, also a full-time firefighter with the Rochester Fire Department, were injured. Both injured firefighters sustained significant injuries, both in Intensive Care according to the hospital. Both are conscious and alert.
Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering says 62-year-old William Spengler was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot to the head. He had served 17 years for manslaughter in the death of his grandmother. Police say he set fire to a car and house to lure firefighters to his house. When firefighters arrived, he opened fire, probably with a rifle.
Dispatch Audio: Initial dispatch was for a reported house fire -- units arrived with man shooting a gun at them. Compelling audio of one firefighter injured, staying calm while calling for help and providing ongoing updates.
Chiapperini: Was past chief, awarded "Firefighter of the Year" just two weeks ago, local news report. Kaczowka had been with FD for about a year.
West Webster FD: "We are very saddened with the loss of our two beloved firefighters, your thoughts, prayers and condolences are greatly appreciated. Please continue to keep us in your prayers."

Gunz wrote:
Police Chief reports it does look like a trap was set for responders.

I sure want to know WHY.

Bob wrote:

Gunz wrote:
Police Chief reports it does look like a trap was set for responders.

I sure want to know WHY.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering says 62-year-old William Spengler was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot to the head. He had served 17 years for manslaughter in the death of his grandmother. Police say he set fire to a car and house to lure firefighters to his house. When firefighters arrived, he opened fire, probably with a rifle.

I'm Amending my letter to Santa to include a bullet proof bunker coat.

Gunz wrote:

Bob wrote:

Gunz wrote:
Police Chief reports it does look like a trap was set for responders.

I sure want to know WHY.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering says 62-year-old William Spengler was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot to the head. He had served 17 years for manslaughter in the death of his grandmother. Police say he set fire to a car and house to lure firefighters to his house. When firefighters arrived, he opened fire, probably with a rifle.

He beat her to death with a hammer. How in God's name is that manslaughter?

If you don't think we have a problem with our legal system...this is a prime example. He should have been serving a life sentence or should have been on death row.

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

Been nice if he would have done it BEFORE taking out two guys that were volunteering to help their community.

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

He set it up so that first responders would try to save him and it was an ambush. Much like the AHOLE at the Moors a few years back.

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

He set it up so that first responders would try to save him and it was an ambush. Much like the AHOLE at the Moors a few years back.

But he shot himself, suicide by cop is when you force the cops to shoot you. He took the cowardly way out by offing himself. As far as I know the cops in this instance never even fired a shot.

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

He set it up so that first responders would try to save him and it was an ambush. Much like the AHOLE at the Moors a few years back.

But he shot himself, suicide by cop is when you force the cops to shoot you. He took the cowardly way out by offing himself. As far as I know the cops in this instance never even fired a shot.

He shot the first responders and then wussed out taking his own life. That was obvuously the plan here,

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

He set it up so that first responders would try to save him and it was an ambush. Much like the AHOLE at the Moors a few years back.

But he shot himself, suicide by cop is when you force the cops to shoot you. He took the cowardly way out by offing himself. As far as I know the cops in this instance never even fired a shot.

He shot the first responders and then wussed out taking his own life. That was obvuously the plan here,

But in your very first post, you stated "another example of suicide by cop". I am not arguing the point that it was all a set up, I am arguing that it was not suicide by cop.

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Ghost_Rider1 wrote:

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Sal wrote:At least two Webster firefighters are dead, and three houses on Lake Road continue to burn after one or more shooters opened fire on firefighters who responded to an early morning blaze, officials said.

Two other firefighters are in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital with gunshot wounds, according to a hospital spokeswoman.

There are no active shooters at the scene and firefighters have resumed battling the blazes, according to a news conference held at 9:40 a.m. by Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn.

The fire broke out at 5:45 a.m. at 191 Lake Road on the Irondequoit Bay side of the street.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said shots were fired at West Webster firefighters when they arrived on the scene. Four firefighters were hit, two fatally.

[url=http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20121224/NEWS01/312240026/webster-shooting?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|Home&nclick_check=1[/quote[/url]]



Another example of suicide by cop...preferred when people are at the end of their rope of their lives and want to make it look like someone else's fault.

How is this suicide by cop?

He set it up so that first responders would try to save him and it was an ambush. Much like the AHOLE at the Moors a few years back.

But he shot himself, suicide by cop is when you force the cops to shoot you. He took the cowardly way out by offing himself. As far as I know the cops in this instance never even fired a shot.

He shot the first responders and then wussed out taking his own life. That was obvuously the plan here,

But in your very first post, you stated "another example of suicide by cop". I am not arguing the point that it was all a set up, I am arguing that it was not suicide by cop.

The guy obviously didn't want to die by someone else's hand...he did it by himself to avoid that at the last minute.

More evidence our mental health system is a failure.

How does our prison system release a man who has killed his grandmother with a hammer and spent 17 years in prison without any sort of mental evaluation?

Markle wrote:More evidence our mental health system is a failure.

How does our prison system release a man who has killed his mother-in-law with a hammer and spent 17 years in prison without any sort of mental evaluation?

Totally agree

TEOTWAWKI wrote:
yeah i got a chuckle out of my date when Tom walked into a crowded bar... I whispered to her, look at that, a whole bar full of short people.....she thought it was funny.

I had a good line to type in here but then I got all political correct on myself and thought it best not to do a short joke because some short people might be reading it.
Damnit the old age is finally making me soft. And in my book soft is worthless.

Okay so I'm trying to be a jokester just to take my mind off what was revealed in Gunz' last post. In the words if the younger generation, "man that's some fucked up shit".

The scariest thing of all about all this is the how the total innocence of the victims doesn't even compute with these psychos of today.
It doesn't matter if it's kindergarten age children or someone going to put out a fire. The psycho of today is so fucked up that he doesn't even understand the sanctity of what it is to be an innocent victim. Nothing and no one is innocent to him. We're all just props in his insanity.

Bob wrote:The scariest thing of all about all this is the how the total innocence of the victims doesn't even compute with these psychos of today.
It doesn't matter if it's kindergarten age children or someone going to put out a fire. The psycho of today is so fucked up that he doesn't even understand the sanctity of what it is to be an innocent victim. Nothing and no one is innocent to him. We're all just props in his insanity.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

It's de-evolution Bob.

Old Testament tribal warfare involving killing the other tribe....man, woman, child...en toto.

Too many little Hitlers in a land of confusion, inundated 24/7 with the tragedy du jour.


And on that note, Merry Christmas Bobby...!!!

I'm actually listening to C-Mas music...

Check it out or live to regret the moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCMjrI1asgQ

How would your solution have saved these firemen if this was a trap set by the gunman or gunmen with legally registered weapons and they just went off the deep end? There is no solution in the world that would have prevented a scenario such as this.


The killer is allegedly an ex felon. It is also alleged that he got the same weapon which was used at Sandy Hook. If we upgrade our foid cards to dynamic cards.....it is going to be a hundred times more difficult for a felon to purchase a weapon and transport the weapons. It will never eliminate every situation, but it will lower the death rate when biometric trigger locks have a database of convicted felons......sorry this person could not fire.

If this happened after 2025, the felon would need to have a method to buy the guns....which included a shot gun and hand gun. If every weapon was chipped, he would either have to steal the weapons, purchase them illegally from somewhere he could walk......or he would have had to have these weapons in his house and refused to comply with the law.

My solution calls for the merging of the foid card with state driver's licenses or for a non driver state IDs. Instead of waiting 10 years to keep the foid card valid, it would be tied into the time period for renewal of a license in each state, but in no case to exceed a four year period of time. Currently, I can buy a gun at a gun show and have no background check in 40% of the transactions. As I suggested in the Seaoat Solution thread, a simple use of an ad on to a smart phone will allow a gun show to transfer the chipped weapon to the foid card of the purchaser, check the database for felons, and mentally unstable individuals, and then updates the database from the gun show which allows a temporary pass to take the weapon home, but thereafter puts a 7 day freeze on transport of the weapon as a background check is completed, and when the biometric trigger lock is set by the dealer.....guess what......no sale.

In this incident, if all these loopholes had been closed, and he could not easily transport a purchased weapon to his home......and being a felon....he could have never purchased the gun in the first place......no he could have used a bow and arrow and killed two firefighters.....it would be easy, so the point is not zero deaths.....simply we cannot let perfect be the impediment to good.

Any safety can be bypassed unless it's very complicated then it's subject to failure.

2seaoat wrote:How would your solution have saved these firemen if this was a trap set by the gunman or gunmen with legally registered weapons and they just went off the deep end? There is no solution in the world that would have prevented a scenario such as this.


The killer is allegedly an ex felon. It is also alleged that he got the same weapon which was used at Sandy Hook. If we upgrade our foid cards to dynamic cards.....it is going to be a hundred times more difficult for a felon to purchase a weapon and transport the weapons. It will never eliminate every situation, but it will lower the death rate when biometric trigger locks have a database of convicted felons......sorry this person could not fire.

If this happened after 2025, the felon would need to have a method to buy the guns....which included a shot gun and hand gun. If every weapon was chipped, he would either have to steal the weapons, purchase them illegally from somewhere he could walk......or he would have had to have these weapons in his house and refused to comply with the law.

My solution calls for the merging of the foid card with state driver's licenses or for a non driver state IDs. Instead of waiting 10 years to keep the foid card valid, it would be tied into the time period for renewal of a license in each state, but in no case to exceed a four year period of time. Currently, I can buy a gun at a gun show and have no background check in 40% of the transactions. As I suggested in the Seaoat Solution thread, a simple use of an ad on to a smart phone will allow a gun show to transfer the chipped weapon to the foid card of the purchaser, check the database for felons, and mentally unstable individuals, and then updates the database from the gun show which allows a temporary pass to take the weapon home, but thereafter puts a 7 day freeze on transport of the weapon as a background check is completed, and when the biometric trigger lock is set by the dealer.....guess what......no sale.

In this incident, if all these loopholes had been closed, and he could not easily transport a purchased weapon to his home......and being a felon....he could have never purchased the gun in the first place......no he could have used a bow and arrow and killed two firefighters.....it would be easy, so the point is not zero deaths.....simply we cannot let perfect be the impediment to good.

My guess is that he did not purchase these weapons.