Healthcare Perspective

After all this time of listening to the supposedly enlightened progressive liberal arguments about how people need health care and we should FORCE them to buy it from a private company if necessary. Then driving around and noting all the Obama campaign signs in the front yards of the doctors and nurses in the town/city that I live in. Then to top it off the day after the new messiah is re-elected, for all his magnificent effort in providing health care for all, I start recieving phone from arrogant health care insurance companies demanding that I call them back and have my health care insurance information available. I'VE HAD ENOUGH!!!!!

Therefore I am more firmly grounded in my assessment that health care should be nationalized. All the health care workers be placed on a government/military pay scale. Nurses starting pay at E-4 and while doctors start at O-1 and up. Sorry you'll have to live in a three bedroom ranch house and not be able to afford that lakefront second home with the jet skies for all your children as you pay off your college loans. Take comfort in the fact that you'll be working in a air conditioned enviorment and have a job. Just remember...

"Ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country."
John Fitzgerald Kennedy

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLAr-WlxMZY

Don't worry... It'll be nationalized soon enough... along with energy and insurance and food and universities and housing...

PkrBum wrote:Don't worry... It'll be nationalized soon enough... along with energy and insurance and food and universities and housing...

It's the only logical thing to do since the supposedly enlightened progressive liberals use the "Promote the general welfare" in the Constitutions Preamble to mean that the government should control things for our own good.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOFRR1PY0XE

I heard one on npr that said the first sentence when it says "to form" is carte blanche.

I had a better idea today.

We could just have the gov provide everything for everyone. here would be no money. everyone would get a food card, a house, a card for cloths etc annually.

The gov would pick what jobs we did.

Oh what a wonderful world it would be...

TEOTWAWKI wrote:

PkrBum wrote:I heard one on npr that said the first sentence when it says "to form" is carte blanche.

Well naturally we'll have to give a blank one to everyone. It's the American way...

*****CHUCKLE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pm4fQRl72k



"'It is scarcely possible that the eyes of contemporaries should discover in the public felicity the latent causes of decay and corruption. This long peace, and the uniform government of the Romans, introduced a slow and secret poison into the vitals of the empire. The minds of men were gradually reduced to the same level, the fire of genius was extinguished, and even the military spirit evaporated.' Now that no one buys our votes, the public has long since cast off its cares; the people that once bestowed commands, consulships, legions and all else, now meddles no more and longs eagerly for just two things----Bread and Games!"
Juvenal

BigBustedStripper wrote:I had a better idea today.

We could just have the gov provide everything for everyone. here would be no money. everyone would get a food card, a house, a card for cloths etc annually.

The gov would pick what jobs we did.

Oh what a wonderful world it would be...

I've already suggested a compromise similar to that.

We give everyone over 18 a thousand dollars a month. If they choose to work then they lose 10% of that for every $10,000 a year that they make. If they're making $100,000 or more a year obviously they won't be getting anything.

After all it only seems fair to compensate those who choose to work.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVG80vqVfSA



Of course the supposedly enlightened progressive liberals don't want to touch this compromise with a ten foot pole.

The current Affordable Health Care Act is not the final answer. It was the brain child of the Heritage Foundation, and it has some merits and some obvious shortcomings, but the truth be told there are far more efficient methods to provide health care in this country. It would take political will to institute the most efficient systems, and it would involve sacrifice and limits. The most efficient system would be medicare for all. I of course will die with medicare for all....because medicare right now will not cover my second shot....but sadly, even I recognize that limits must be set if we have the political courage. If I want more coverage than the basic medicare coverage....then there will be a vibrant supplemental insurance market which will cover procedures which will not be covered by Medicare.

It really is that simple. A national sales tax of a penny or two.......on the dollar, and expanded contributions on payroll deduction based on our political courage to understand that medicare should not be paying 22k a month to keep someone alive....11k a month.....well I guess that is ok, because Medicare approves one 30mg shot....but the second shot....nope....and simply said......we need the courage to set limits. This is a very relevant topic for me because I have seen the crushing costs which will simply overburden our system whether it is the Affordable Care Act, a repealed Affordable Care Act and return to what was before, or the evolution to medicare for all.....it simply requires courage to say no and set limits.

2seaoat wrote:The current Affordable Health Care Act is not the final answer. It was the brain child of the Heritage Foundation, and it has some merits and some obvious shortcomings, but the truth be told there are far more efficient methods to provide health care in this country. It would take political will to institute the most efficient systems, and it would involve sacrifice and limits. The most efficient system would be medicare for all. I of course will die with medicare for all....because medicare right now will not cover my second shot....but sadly, even I recognize that limits must be set if we have the political courage. If I want more coverage than the basic medicare coverage....then there will be a vibrant supplemental insurance market which will cover procedures which will not be covered by Medicare.

It really is that simple. A national sales tax of a penny or two.......on the dollar, and expanded contributions on payroll deduction based on our political courage to understand that medicare should not be paying 22k a month to keep someone alive....11k a month.....well I guess that is ok, because Medicare approves one 30mg shot....but the second shot....nope....and simply said......we need the courage to set limits. This is a very relevant topic for me because I have seen the crushing costs which will simply overburden our system whether it is the Affordable Care Act, a repealed Affordable Care Act and return to what was before, or the evolution to medicare for all.....it simply requires courage to say no and set limits.

I see..... So now you're saying that the Republicans and Tea Party were telling the truth when the Democrats passed your fabulous Obamacare.

The final goal in all of this, that the supposedly enlightened progressive liberals want, is death panels and more taxes.

If you want to die you don't need a death panel to pull the plug just refuse the treatment.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LByiVlc6czA

BigBustedStripper wrote:I had a better idea today.

We could just have the gov provide everything for everyone. here would be no money. everyone would get a food card, a house, a card for cloths etc annually.

The gov would pick what jobs we did.

Oh what a wonderful world it would be...

That's the voter base of President Barack Hussein Obama except leave out the jobs part.

2seaoat wrote:The current Affordable Health Care Act is not the final answer. It was the brain child of the Heritage Foundation, and it has some merits and some obvious shortcomings, but the truth be told there are far more efficient methods to provide health care in this country. It would take political will to institute the most efficient systems, and it would involve sacrifice and limits. The most efficient system would be medicare for all. I of course will die with medicare for all....because medicare right now will not cover my second shot....but sadly, even I recognize that limits must be set if we have the political courage. If I want more coverage than the basic medicare coverage....then there will be a vibrant supplemental insurance market which will cover procedures which will not be covered by Medicare.

It really is that simple. A national sales tax of a penny or two.......on the dollar, and expanded contributions on payroll deduction based on our political courage to understand that medicare should not be paying 22k a month to keep someone alive....11k a month.....well I guess that is ok, because Medicare approves one 30mg shot....but the second shot....nope....and simply said......we need the courage to set limits. This is a very relevant topic for me because I have seen the crushing costs which will simply overburden our system whether it is the Affordable Care Act, a repealed Affordable Care Act and return to what was before, or the evolution to medicare for all.....it simply requires courage to say no and set limits.

The crushing of the system is the goal of the Cloward-Piven Strategy. Now that the tipping point has been reached, there is no saying "NO". Just like with Greece, Italy, Portugal and Spain.

Markle wrote:The crushing of the system is the goal of the Cloward-Piven Strategy. Now that the tipping point has been reached, there is no saying "NO". Just like with Greece, Italy, Portugal and Spain.

Some friends and I have been discussing this since these election campaigns started. Our conclusions were...

If the Republican candidate won there would be rioting in the streets the day after the election probably instigated by the Occupy America crowd.

If the Democratic candidate won, the lame duck would sign executive orders that would insite the Tea Party and conservatives into vocal but peaceful protests and uncooperative behavior against the government. Then due to the government attempting to enforce those orders things would then get out of hand because somewhere along the line someone would get hurt by a over anxious government official. This will probably happen a couple years down the line.

Either way we're all on the...

*****SAD SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntLsElbW9Xo

I wish I had the insular ignorance of those who suggest that it takes a bill like the affordable care Act to have death panels. I hope none of the folks who believe that have to face the choices and limits of our current system. You see I have been brought to tears far too many times the last five years seeing people who do not have insurance and have exhausted their resources just trying to keep pain free as they face end of life issues. No the flippant attitude that somehow President Obama with an Act of Congress will create death panels fails to understand that we have death panels today which are alive and well. If you think that every person in America is somehow getting all the care they need, and that insurance companies are not rejecting procedures which condemn people to death......well you are simply wrong.

Medicare for all will eventually have to be the model because the penalties under the Affordable Care Act are simply too low, and as young healthy people figure out that with know preexisting condition limitation that they can simply not pay for health insurance for their young families, and then when disease or illness knocks on their door.....they will simply sign up and get coverage. This skewed system will take young healthy people out of the pool, increase the number of sick and elderly, and finally push health care premiums even higher. It has been amusing to hear the stellar complaints about the tax burden of the Affordable Care Act, because in my opinion and many experts the IRS penalty for not being insured is in fact not high enough to force young people to sign up for health insurance.

This thread is really something. seaoat is trying to tell you what it's actually like to be in a situation like he's been in. And the rest of you are replying to him with this childish sarah palin "death panel" horseshit. And now markle is back harping about that fucking cloward piven stuff again.
Markle, please get this through your noggin. Nobody but glen beck or lyndon larouche or whoever you're getting it from knows or cares who cloward piven is. lol

The American People in the end simply lacked the trust to turn this country over to the Ambassador of Evil. I think that had the Republican Party simply changed the rules of the primaries which I believe have forced America to be more divided than we have been since the Civil War, we could begin to find consensus around issues which really matter. However, Piven and death panels are the fuel of the extreme, and in fact Mr. Markle is right to the extent that the far left does want anarchy and destruction of the stability of this nation and that the other bookend of corporate special interests have dominated the conversation. America will never be the same after this election. The diversity of the Post election celebration in Chicago is far more reflective of America than the dismal and pessimistic portrayal which many folks who want racial dog whistle issues to divide and conquer this nation.....well simply put they lost as the all white and elderly folks waited for election results in the Romney headquarters in Boston, but this idea that in losing we will suddenly have death panels is ignorance.....they are already here. I sadly see it every day.

2seaoat wrote:I wish I had the insular ignorance of those who suggest that it takes a bill like the affordable care Act to have death panels. I hope none of the folks who believe that have to face the choices and limits of our current system. You see I have been brought to tears far too many times the last five years seeing people who do not have insurance and have exhausted their resources just trying to keep pain free as they face end of life issues. No the flippant attitude that somehow President Obama with an Act of Congress will create death panels fails to understand that we have death panels today which are alive and well. If you think that every person in America is somehow getting all the care they need, and that insurance companies are not rejecting procedures which condemn people to death......well you are simply wrong.

Medicare for all will eventually have to be the model because the penalties under the Affordable Care Act are simply too low, and as young healthy people figure out that with know preexisting condition limitation that they can simply not pay for health insurance for their young families, and then when disease or illness knocks on their door.....they will simply sign up and get coverage. This skewed system will take young healthy people out of the pool, increase the number of sick and elderly, and finally push health care premiums even higher. It has been amusing to hear the stellar complaints about the tax burden of the Affordable Care Act, because in my opinion and many experts the IRS penalty for not being insured is in fact not high enough to force young people to sign up for health insurance.

Ill give you the same reply to death panles and this law as I did on another forum.
----

My profession is in Healthcare btw

I'll try to make this short.

There are lots of cuts coming starting Jan 1st 2013. Some of the biggest are in cardiology, radiology and pathology. ( specialist )

Here's a couple of links
http://www.healthimaging.com/topics/oncology-imaging/astro-pushes-cms-stop-300m-cuts-cancer-care

http://www.modernmedicine.com/modernmedicine/Enews/Urologists-face-2-cut-under-proposed-2013-CMS-fee-/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/781533



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This is to medicare ^^^, medicaid patients. There are some other cuts that will be happening as well to people with gov insurance.

What is currently happening is healthcare professionals are doing more with less already. Its been a tuff few years.

Some, maybe many doctors will stop offering certain test. And some of these test because of thier cost to perform will be hard to get a appointment to.

and eventually the standard of care will be reduced in order to keep up with the additional people on the rolls, people doing too much work with few less people never is a good thing, its a known cause of medical errors.

Then theres the problem that many doctors just may drop taking medicare or mediaid completly. Many have already here.

So in a enviroment like that. people are going to die. Thier diagnosis will take longer giving what ever cancer they may have had time to metastisize.

So when you hear people saying oh the gov is telling the doctors what to do and its death panels. This is what they really are tlaking about. Because a lot of these specialized test the gov wont pay for unless there is a very very hard working doctor on the other end fighting with the gov insurance to get you a referal for a specialist because it cost a lot.

2seaoat wrote:I wish I had the insular ignorance of those who suggest that it takes a bill like the affordable care Act to have death panels. I hope none of the folks who believe that have to face the choices and limits of our current system. You see I have been brought to tears far too many times the last five years seeing people who do not have insurance and have exhausted their resources just trying to keep pain free as they face end of life issues. No the flippant attitude that somehow President Obama with an Act of Congress will create death panels fails to understand that we have death panels today which are alive and well. If you think that every person in America is somehow getting all the care they need, and that insurance companies are not rejecting procedures which condemn people to death......well you are simply wrong.

Medicare for all will eventually have to be the model because the penalties under the Affordable Care Act are simply too low, and as young healthy people figure out that with know preexisting condition limitation that they can simply not pay for health insurance for their young families, and then when disease or illness knocks on their door.....they will simply sign up and get coverage. This skewed system will take young healthy people out of the pool, increase the number of sick and elderly, and finally push health care premiums even higher. It has been amusing to hear the stellar complaints about the tax burden of the Affordable Care Act, because in my opinion and many experts the IRS penalty for not being insured is in fact not high enough to force young people to sign up for health insurance.

I'm not so naive as to believe that Obamacare or even your Medicare for all solution will provide the same care and treatment for all. If you believe that it will you're living in a dream world and I suggest you check what types of hallucinigenic medications you're taking.

Forcing people to buy something from a private company just because they happen to be breathing is wrong.

If you, Obama, and the government feel so strongly about the issue then grow some balls and nationalize the damn industry.

Even if you do though there will still be the privileged and the disenfranchised. It's currently built into the governmental system and the mentality of our leaders and those who think they're more deserving. Like those who have a sheepskin from some college or university...

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU7H--USv6Y&feature=fvst

Bob wrote:This thread is really something. seaoat is trying to tell you what it's actually like to be in a situation like he's been in. And the rest of you are replying to him with this childish sarah palin "death panel" horseshit.

He stated that the limits had to be set. So go frak yourself Bob.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQzUCO7rG0M

2seaoat wrote:The American People in the end simply lacked the trust to turn this country over to the Ambassador of Evil. I think that had the Republican Party simply changed the rules of the primaries which I believe have forced America to be more divided than we have been since the Civil War, we could begin to find consensus around issues which really matter. However, Piven and death panels are the fuel of the extreme, and in fact Mr. Markle is right to the extent that the far left does want anarchy and destruction of the stability of this nation and that the other bookend of corporate special interests have dominated the conversation. America will never be the same after this election. The diversity of the Post election celebration in Chicago is far more reflective of America than the dismal and pessimistic portrayal which many folks who want racial dog whistle issues to divide and conquer this nation.....well simply put they lost as the all white and elderly folks waited for election results in the Romney headquarters in Boston, but this idea that in losing we will suddenly have death panels is ignorance.....they are already here. I sadly see it every day.

The only racial dog whistle issues to divide and conquer this nation being pulled out of the sleeve here are by the Democratic party and people such as yourself looking for a scapegoat for all your troubles as exemplified by your current post.

Making promises to specific minority groups and granting special privileges to gain their support like your supposedly enlightened progressive liberal agenda does only divides this country further.

The biggest bigots are the ones like yourself who cry wolf at the drop of a hat.

*****SMILE*****

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sR4sm66SfsA