God Has Nothing to Do With Trump Being President

John Pavlovitz June 8, 2018










If I hear one more Evangelical claim that God chose Donald Trump, I’m swear I’m gonna rapture myself.

Christian Trumpers really need to stop spiritualizing the man, his campaign, and his Presidency.

It’s sinful.
It’s blasphemous.
It’s lousy evangelism.
It’s also just plain asinine.

The hypocrisy on display is historic: after spending the past 8 years straining to find infinitesimal specks in Barack Obama’s eye that they could condemn as dealbreakers—Evangelicals are now perfectly fine with Trump’s rotted forest of Redwoods.

In fact, in the most dizzying display of theological spin doctoring, it is now precisely his ever-growing trail of personal toxic discharge that supposedly proves evidence of God’s hand in it all.

So Trump’s multiple marriages, his porn star affairs, his mountain of sexual assault claims, his verbal obscenities, his disregard for rule of law, his compulsive lying, his clear racism, his unrelenting attacks on marginalized communities (things these Christians would have figuratively and almost literally crucified Obama for) are now unmistakable signs that God is using this President.

This is nonsense of Biblical proportions; to try and draw some line between Jesus of Nazareth and Don of New York, is about as farcical as you can get without actually spontaneously combusting from the cognitive dissonance.

Dying to justify their own allegiances to Trump, Evangelicals have lumped him in with other famously flawed heroes of Scripture, suggesting he is actually God’s anointed, imperfect tool of salvation—in the tradition of the Old Testament.(Well, God did apparently use the jawbone of an ass, so I guess there is precedent).

Seriously, this sanctified retrofitting of this godless President to any kind of Providential momentum is the height of absurdity. By that measurement, let’s find all the most reprehensible human beings we can, give them carte blanche in our seats of power—and see just what God can do!

No, Donald Trump wasn’t anointed by God.
He isn’t an instrument of Divine will.
He isn’t Biblically hastening Armageddon or Jesus’ return.

He’s just a hateful, indecent, predatory fraud who is destroying the environment, stripping people of their human rights, and making America a global laughing-stock.

His ascension is not prophetic but pathetic, the result of:

Russian interference,
fake news,
gerrymandering,
voter suppression,
Hillary hatred,
Obama resentment,
Fox News brainwashing,
Democratic stumbles,
the votes of bigoted Evangelicals, whites terrified of losing market share, and third-party voters—and the inaction of 100 million Americans who couldn’t be bothered to participate in one of the greatest responsibilities of living here.

That’s it.

No Providence.
No Divine messages.
No Biblical prophecies.
No spiritual movements.

Just ordinary human beings who chose really, really poorly when they should have known better.

This isn’t a mystery or a miracle—and it sure as hell isn’t God.
Christians need to stop passing the buck to God, and just own the compromises and sick bedfellows they’ve been willing to make for Supreme Court seats, anti-LGBTQ legislation, weapon stockpiling, and a rapidly assembling white Christian theocracy.

Stop namedropping God.

God wasn’t generating fake news or showing up at his campaign rallies or stumping for him at nationwide crusades or using him as an expression of their misogyny.
God didn’t vote for the guy who said he could grab women by the genitalia.
God didn’t choose the guy who said protestors should be beaten.
God didn’t go with the guy endorsed by the KKK.
God didn’t excuse the bankruptcies and overlook the affairs and laugh off the racist remarks.

I’m pretty sure people did that—lots of supposedly Christian folks.

And God isn’t now taunting teenage shooting victims on social media,
or ignoring thousands of lost immigrant children,
or turning a blind eye to Constitutional crises,
or celebrating LGBTQ discrimination,
or laughing off collusion, treason, and human rights atrocities.

Again, Christians.

We really should stop pretending God is responsible for this fast food dumpster fire, when it’s clear whose hand is in it all.

This reality is the rotten fruit of misogyny,
racism,
Nationalism,
fear,
xenophobia,
and bigotry—all released by people who want God to consent to it all so they don’t have to deal with their own culpability or face their own repentance.

God does not consent.

Pray on that.




https://johnpavlovitz.com/2018/06/08/god-has-nothing-to-do-with-trump-being-president/

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Romans 13:1-7

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

"The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it" as some Christians, er I mean "Paulists"  I have known like to say.



Trump might want to be a little cautious about getting too big of a head from the religious adulation being showered upon him by those nutty evangelicals ....  and keep in mind the fate of the last leader of a great country who asserted the Divine Right of Kings":

Hell, God has nothing to do with evangelicals at this point. Or most of the people who call themselves "Christians." It's increasingly rare that I run into any who believe anything remotely "Christ-like" anymore. They're far more followers of Ayn Rand than they are Jesus.

And Ayn Rand is the basis for Satanism...

zsomething wrote:Hell, God has nothing to do with evangelicals at this point.  Or most of the people who call themselves "Christians."  It's increasingly rare that I run into any who believe anything remotely "Christ-like" anymore.   They're far more followers of Ayn Rand than they are Jesus.

And Ayn Rand is the basis for Satanism...  

Hey, hey now! Ayn Rand wasn't so bad. She had her flaws, both ideological and personal, but who doesn't? Atlas Shrugged is still worth the time to if one has never read it.

(you are aware, are you not, the vast majority of people who proclaim themselves "satanists" do not really believe in a supernatural "Satan" being?)

The saying holds that the world is supported by a chain of increasingly large turtles. Beneath each turtle is yet another: it is "turtles all the way down".

Take that flat earthers




Every time I take a look inside inside that old and fabled book
I'm blinded and reminded of the pain caused by some old man in the sky
Marijuana, LSD, Psilocybin, and DMT
They all changed the way I see
But love's the only thing that ever saved my life

So don't waste your mind on nursery rhymes
Or fairy tales of blood and wine
It's turtles all the way down the line
So to each their own til' we go home
To other realms our souls must roam
To and through the myth that we all call space and time

The AntiChrist works in our White House. Proceed accordingly.

EmeraldGhost wrote:

Hey, hey now!   Ayn Rand wasn't so bad.   She had her flaws, both ideological and personal, but who doesn't?   Atlas Shrugged is still worth the time to if one has never read it.

(you are aware, are you not, the vast majority of people who proclaim themselves "satanists" do not really believe in a supernatural "Satan" being?)

I've read Atlas Shrugged -- or at least a big chunk of it before I decided I didn't want to waste that much time on the written equivalent of dung-liquor. It's some of the most toddler-level philosophy combined with some of the most incompetent prose anyone ever wrote. It's not writing, it's typing. She's awful.

And, yeah, I know about Satanists. You don't listen to as much black metal as I do without learning all about that.

EmeraldGhost wrote:  Ayn Rand wasn't so bad.  

AH-HA-HA-HA!  Ayn Rand was a TERRIBLE human being. Her selfish Objectivist bullshit has done incalculable damage to society. "Rational self-interest" my bleedin' ass! It's nothing but an excuse for horrible human behavior.

Ironically enough, she ended up on Social Security and Medicare and one of her prime acolytes, Alan Greenspan, drove the world economy into a ditch following her idiotic, antisocial bullshit--for which he later repented, I might add.

It's also worthwhile to point out that almost every recipient of the Congressional Medal of Honor received it for courageous actions defending or rescuing another soldier. In other words they put their life at risk to save SOMEONE ELSE--the antithesis of Objectivism.

She was a piece of shit of a human being, as is anyone who thinks she "wasn't so bad".

She has to be better than Margaret Sanger... right? Unless she ate babies or sumthin.

Btw.... I couldn't stand rands book. Terrible writing. But clear objective truths.

PkrBum wrote:She has to be better than Margaret Sanger... right? Unless she ate babies or sumthin.

Btw.... I couldn't stand rands book. Terrible writing. But clear objective truths.

Thanks for saying that better for me, 'P-Bum.'  

Not every one of her ideas, of course ... but there's quite a few of 'em in there.

In case anyone's wants to try & pigeonhole me ... I'm not a big-L Libertarian ... but I am "libertarian-ish" on certain topics. It's not a right or a left thing.

And on a related note .....

EmeraldGhost wrote:Thanks for saying that better for me...

There's no trick to that, you sound like a dimwitted child.

Deus X wrote:

EmeraldGhost wrote:Thanks for saying that better for me...

There's no trick to that, you sound like a dimwitted child.

“You don't have to disrespect and insult others simply to hold your own ground. If you do, that shows how shaky your own position is.” ― Red Haircrow

EmeraldGhost wrote:

Deus X wrote:

EmeraldGhost wrote:Thanks for saying that better for me...

There's no trick to that, you sound like a dimwitted child.

“You don't have to disrespect and insult others simply to hold your own ground. If you do, that shows how shaky your own position is.”    ― Red Haircrow

"Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity." -- Marshall McLuhan

Ayn Rand was a selfish, ridiculous person who led a cult. Her books are on a par with L Ron Hubbard, founder of Scientology...pure fantasy...maybe fun to read when you're in high school and still reading Heinlein, Asimov, and other science fiction. Her books constitute a glorification of ubercapitalism and class division, and of course she fancied herself one of the "elite". The Galt speech takes most of a chapter and is sickening. Her entire philosophy is based on selfish behavior and lack of empathy and has done massive damage to our country through her "disciples", especially Greenspan and Ryan.

Floridatexan wrote:
Ayn Rand was a selfish, ridiculous person who led a cult.  Her books are on a par with L Ron Hubbard, founder of Scientology...pure fantasy...maybe fun to read when you're in high school and still reading Heinlein, Asimov, and other science fiction.  Her books constitute a glorification of ubercapitalism and class division, and of course she fancied herself one of the "elite".  The Galt speech takes most of a chapter and is sickening.  Her entire philosophy is based on selfish behavior and lack of empathy and has done massive damage to our country through her "disciples", especially Greenspan and Ryan.

Rand would have been perfect to play Rosa Klebb, the killer with the poison tipped shoes that James Bond shot.

Floridatexan wrote:  ....
 Her entire philosophy  ....

Never said I bought into her "entire" philosophy.  Kernels of truth can be found in all kinds of places.  IMO .... right or wrong ... Ayn Rand was a semi-important author anyone with a keen interest in sociopoliticaleconomic ideas  should have some familiarity with.  

(yeah ... I said "sociopoliticaleconomic" ... what of it?     )

Anyways .... it's always beneficial to learn what place others might be coming from with their ideas and opinions.   To shut our eyes and ears to the ideas and opinions of others (and encourage others to do so) is no different than those who will only watch/read FoxNews .... or conversely who refuse to watch/read anything FoxNews.  

As to some other commenters on the subject of Ayn Rand and her personal life  ... well, it's fine to attack/argue the message, but it serves little purpose to attack the messenger.  Esp when they are long dead & gone.  It's really just pointless.

Where did I say I hadn't read her, or Hubbard, or any number of sci-fi books...many more than once. But I won't bother with ATLAS SHRUGGED a second time, because the first time was nauseating. And I don't watch FOX, unless it's a clip, because it's pure hogwash.

Floridatexan wrote:
Where did I say I never read her, or Hubbard, or any number of sci-fi books...many more than once.  But I won't bother with ATLAS SHRUGGED a second time, because the first time was nauseating.  And I don't watch FOX, unless it's a clip, because it's pure hogwash.  

Geez 'Flo' ... what's all this Ayn Rand stuff.  I'm not her appointed defender. You'll have to find somebody else to play that strawman for you.  Try 'P-Bum' maybe?   Sounds like you're just looking for someone to attack on here.  Is that what you come here for?

Where did I say you hadn't read Atlas Shrugged or ever suggested you read it a 2nd time?  I wouldn't read it a 2nd time myself.  Don't even have a copy of it anymore.  (I thinned the herd on my books about six years ago when I moved to Florida .... it was an uncluttering-my-life thing)   Might go back & pull something from it off the net that I might need for something I'm writing .... but that's about it.    

Ok ... I get it  ... you hate Ayn Rand.  I think it's worth a read if one never has.  It's an important book to be familiar with for those with an interest in such things ... even if they disagree.  Because it's relevant to what a lot of people believe today & you see elements of it's influence in our contemporary national discourse and politics.

 I don't agree with Karl Marx on a lot of things either but I've read Das Kapital and The Communist Manifesto.  I've also read Mein Kampf ... That doesn't make me a Nazi.  And I would recommend those books to people with a keen interest in things "sociopoliticaleconomihistorical" (how about that made up word!   )    

If you are wanting to "win" whatever this stupid off-topic argument about Ayn Rand is ,,,, okay, you win.   Happy?  Not sure what your prize is though?  Bragging rights?  Who ya gonna brag to?   'Deuce' maybe?  ... you guys can have yourselves a little victory party.  Don't overimbibe, though.  Posting drunk is never a good thing.    [i]

So, how 'bout we move on,then?  Or start yourself a dedicated thread on Ayn Rand if you want to belabor it further?  (I might suggest you tie it to current events and politics though, if you want to have a good discussion.)

zsomething wrote:

EmeraldGhost wrote:
.....      (you are aware, are you not, the vast majority of people who proclaim themselves "satanists" do not really believe in a supernatural "Satan" being?)

....   And, yeah, I know about Satanists.  You don't listen to as much black metal as I do without learning all about that.

I was just checking.  You never know.  

As to "Black Metal" ... nah, I'm not really into it.  Some old-school Black Sabbath and the like is about as far as I ever go with metal.  (not interested in debating the finer points of it)

My daughter OTOH is a huge fan.  Last few years she's been into all this Scandinavian metal .... among other things musical.   (She's also currently in a top flight doctoral program  for her field .... so, suffice it to say I don't judge people on their choice of music ... listen to what "speaks to you" is what I always say.)    She still sends me links to various metal tunes on FB messenger once in a while to try & get me interested.   I sample them and try to say something nice ... then I send her back a link to some Metallica song ... she despises Metallica for some reason and I like to get her worked up about it. She's very serious about her music.   At least I don't have to listen to her metal around the house anymore!     Growling all your lyrics?  Nah ... I just don't get it.  Doesn't "speak" to me personally.

(hey, btw ... on the topic of music .. anybody want to buy a nice Dean bass with a big Peavey amp, speakers,  a little practice amp,  hard case, soft case, and other associated bass paraphernalia?   400 bucks and it's all yours.   (She left it here at  home when she moved out because she lost interest when she took up keyboards and it's cluttering up my man-cave.

EmeraldGhost wrote:

Floridatexan wrote:
Where did I say I never read her, or Hubbard, or any number of sci-fi books...many more than once.  But I won't bother with ATLAS SHRUGGED a second time, because the first time was nauseating.  And I don't watch FOX, unless it's a clip, because it's pure hogwash.  

Geez 'Flo' ... what's all this Ayn Rand stuff.  I'm not her appointed defender. You'll have to find somebody else to play that strawman for you.  Try 'P-Bum' maybe?   Sounds like you're just looking for someone to attack on here.  Is that what you come here for?

Where did I say you hadn't read Atlas Shrugged or ever suggested you read it a 2nd time?  I wouldn't read it a 2nd time myself.  Don't even have a copy of it anymore.  (I thinned the herd on my books about six years ago when I moved to Florida .... it was an uncluttering-my-life thing)   Might go back & pull something from it off the net that I might need for something I'm writing .... but that's about it.    

Ok ... I get it  ... you hate Ayn Rand.  I think it's worth a read if one never has.  It's an important book to be familiar with for those with an interest in such things ... even if they disagree.  Because it's relevant to what a lot of people believe today & you see elements of it's influence in our contemporary national discourse and politics.

 I don't agree with Karl Marx on a lot of things either but I've read Das Kapital and The Communist Manifesto.  I've also read Mein Kampf ... That doesn't make me a Nazi.  And I would recommend those books to people with a keen interest in things "sociopoliticaleconomihistorical" (how about that made up word!   )    

If you are wanting to "win" whatever this stupid off-topic argument about Ayn Rand is ,,,, okay, you win.   Happy?  Not sure what your prize is though?  Bragging rights?  Who ya gonna brag to?   'Deuce' maybe?  ... you guys can have yourselves a little victory party.  Don't overimbibe, though.  Posting drunk is never a good thing.    [i]

So, how 'bout we move on,then?  Or start yourself a dedicated thread on Ayn Rand if you want to belabor it further?  (I might suggest you tie it to current events and politics though,  if you want to have a good discussion.)

I just did "tie it to current events and politics". And you're the one who declared that she made some good points. Would you care to elaborate on those?

Sessions cites Bible in defense of breaking up families, blames migrant parents

The attorney general, in a speech to law enforcement officers in Indiana, called on his "church friends" not to blame him for the policy.

by Adam Edelman / Jun.14.2018 / 2:54 PM ET / Updated Jun.14.2018 / 3:22 PM ET

"...In his remarks, Sessions hit back at the "concerns raised by our church friends about separating families," calling the criticism "not fair or logical" and quoting Scripture in his defense of the administration's tough policies.

"Persons who violate the law of our nation are subject to prosecution. I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13 to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained them for the purpose of order," Sessions said. "Orderly and lawful processes are good in themselves and protect the weak and lawful."

He called on religious leaders to "speak up strongly to urge anyone who would come here to apply lawfully, to wait their turn and not violate the law."

Later Thursday, White House Press Secretary Sarah Sanders doubled down on Sessions' comments, saying it is "very biblical to enforce the law."..."

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/sessions-cites-bible-defense-breaking-families-blames-migrant-parents-n883296