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Just so you do not get confused this is one of the candidate's positions and his party's platform

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Floridatexan
2seaoat
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2seaoat



Extend the 2001 and 2003 tax relief packages-commonly known as the Bush tax cuts-pending reform of the tax code, to keep tax rates from rising on income, interest, dividends, and capital gains;

Reform the tax code by reducing marginal tax rates by 20 percent across-the-board in a revenue-neutral manner;
Eliminate the taxes on interest, dividends, and capital gains altogether for lower and middle-income taxpayers;
End the Death Tax; and
Repeal the Alternative Minimum Tax.

I can bore you with the detail......but do you think a guy working an assembly line at Jackson Ms at the Nissan plant cares about the Alternative minimum tax......I have been crushed by it in some years, and I can tell you this only applies to the wealthy.

End the death tax.....do you realize in the early 80s the exemption was 125k and now it is a couple million up to four million for a couple.........do you think the lady who checks you out at your grocery store is worried that she is not going to be able to protect her children's estate with a four million dollar exemption.

Mitten the Kitten manipulated his tax return by not claiming deductions and paid 14.1% when it should have been 10%.....with this capital gains treatment he would be paying 2%......that check out lady....with the 20% reduction.....probably 10% or five times what mitten will pay.

Now Neko wants to tell us Romney never said he would reduce revenue by 5 trillion.....well I know she is much brighter than that, but it requires thinking and not buying into propoganda. He is going to raise our deficit by 5 trillion which to be revenue neutral.....it has to be made up somewhere, and I can tell you it cannot be made up in deductions unless it guts the middle class. Now compound this with elimination of the minimum alternative tax, capital gains taxes, and the estate tax......and we have firmly landed in tinfoil land.

We will now find out who on these forums have integrity. Some want to argue that Obama won the debate....they have no integrity.....some want to argue that Romney is not going to raise the middle class taxes.....they have no integrity.....the fact is simple.....Romney won the debate, and the American Middle class will be destroyed with this platform......and anybody who wants to discuss this intelligently and with integrity....I am all in....but if you want to tell me the president won the debate, or that five trillion lost revenue will not impact the deficit or the middle class well......I will lose respect.

Guest


Guest

well, what about this? I showed it to you already.

Mitt Romney this week offered some more insight into his tax reform plan, but not enough to fully understand how his agenda may impact voters' payments to the IRS or the federal deficit.


In an interview with Denver TV station KDVR on Monday, Romney suggested capping federal income tax deductions at $17,000. "And you could use your charitable deduction, your home mortgage deduction, or others -- your health care deduction, and you can fill that bucket, if you will, that $17,000 bucket that way," he said. "And higher income people might have a lower number."


The idea was merely a suggestion and doesn't represent a formal policy proposal from the Republican candidate. It does, however, give some insight into how Romney might pay for the revenue losses that would come from his proposed tax cuts -- which could reach as high as $456 billion in 2015 if current policies are kept in place.


"It is at least a down payment on the revenue lost to the rate cuts," Robertson Williams, an analyst at the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, told CBSNews.com


and also we dont have all the details yet. your making a lot of assumptions based on incomplete information. and your refusing to acknowldge the cuts he has offered as sugestions.

I dont claim to know all about this, but im learning and trying. seems to me from what I do gather he intends to close loopsholes which is where the wealthy get off with a lot and then give a low tax rate. that to me is almost as close to a flat tax as I understand.

Guest


Guest

Hey nice lady,

You can't confuse Seaoat with FACTS ya know! His boy Newt would have had this election in the bag by now. LOL.

2seaoat



In the early 80s I did people's taxes.....I do not do them now. I could teach a tax course if I wanted to.....but I have a different career now, so do not be confused....I am not. First, I have said that Romney's idea of a cafeteria type bag of deductions which has a dollar limit is a very good idea. If the Bush tax cuts are extended for the middle class, I think his ideas on a limit of total schedule B deductions is a sound idea, and congress can hammer the details out, but what I like about it is that special interests will get to keep their perks....so the real estate lobby who pushed the mortgage deduction will get all their perks....but....the charitable deductions.....the union dues.....the educational expenses, child care credits, and dependent deductions all will keep their perks....but the taxpayer will be limited in total on the amount......This will simplify the preparation of taxes because folks who have a mortgage will not even bother to look for union dues, educational expenses, mileage, and charitable deductions.

Now who will get hurt. Churches, real estate professionals, charities, home improvement stores, educational institutions......but the tax code is a set of priorities and what I like is that setting a limit on the bundle can be accomplished where when you just go after the mortgage deduction.....you will be hammered.

Now the math. All the deductions for the most part only impact middle income people. A rich person can make incredible charitable donations, but on the mortgage deductions which limits a mortgage to a million dollars and with a tax rate of 35%......even on a million dollar mortgage you are looking at real dollar savings of about 17k vs 140k savings on a tax rate cut.....it gets no simpler than this example.....you cannot balance this as revenue neutral unless you gut the middle class. Now when you throw in the alternative minimum tax, no capital gains, and no estate tax, the very good idea Romney has on the deduction cafeteria plan is proportionally completely out of whack. It would be like me telling you I am the new coach of the Dallas Cowboys, and that I can take five lineman and their salaries and replace them with five cheerleaders, and then give all the savings to Tony Romo......and now the best part.....tell you we are going to win.......how stupid.....really folks are far too bright on these forums to fall for this stuff. Some very good ideas, but honesty is in short supply.

2seaoat



Gee....nobody wants to discuss the platform which Mitten is running on and what he said at the debate. Does anybody want to talk facts, and what those tax policies really mean. When somebody thinks we are going to solve our problems by cutting taxes an additional 20%, getting rid of the estate tax, the alternative minimum tax, and capital gains......are you kidding me that the budget will balance. If all these were passed, over the next decade we will go 10 trillion more in debt.

Again this is revenue for a family. Mom and Dad both need to work to support the family. Under President Bush we went out and bought a new home, and a second home, and then decided Mom would only work part time. Now the family takes a line of credit on both homes and starts using credit cards, and the solution after four years is for Dad to go part time, and to buy a new car.......are you kidding me?

The answer is simple. Let the Bush tax cuts expire for the top earners. Gradually revoke the tax cuts for everybody else over the next 10 years. Immediately implement a cap on deductions which Romney has recommended. Give 100% tax credits for the first two years for every manufacturing job returned to America. Make steady reductions to government of at least 5% over the next decade. Quit the charade that the affordable health care bill did enough. Medicare for all, and implement a 3% national sales tax which shores up Medicare. Increase the retirement age to 67 implemented over 10 years so older Americans will have a planning horizon, and increase the cap to 250k a year from the 109k. This is a bipartisan solution which will have a generation of benefit to America, and both these candidates need to be willing to get mom and dad back working, sell the new car and get a beater....get rid of the second house.......and maybe short term work a little overtime.

Floridatexan

Floridatexan


I agree with some, but not all of your suggestions, Seaoat. My takeaway from the debate is that Obama didn't want to get snared into a defensive posture by Romney's attacks, but I still don't understand why the President didn't go more on the offensive, because Romney was clearly lying throughout the debate and repeating those lies many times over. For instance, he knows damn well he can't preserve tax breaks for the wealthy and the middle class both.

boards of FL

boards of FL

What I still want to see explained is who is going to pay extra taxes in order to make this tax plan neutral? If the middle class are really going to pay less in taxes, as he says they will, who is going to pay more? 20% across the board cuts amount to $5 trillion in lost revenue over 10 years, per Tax Policy Center. We know mathematically that this cannot be made up by simply capping deductions at 17%. Lets assume that on day one of this tax plan's passage, 10 million new jobs miraculously appear. This still will not close the $5 trillion gap.

Could it be that Romney is completely full of shit? Has neither he nor Ryan really not explained this to everyone yet because they simply don't have the time required in interviews or debates? Is it not possible to simply post the math on their campaign website or, if not the math, simply list - specifically - how the $5 trillion gap will be closed so we can then do the math ourselves?

Do people ever keep secret ideas that are so great as we are told this Romney tax plan is?


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Guest


Guest

boards of FL wrote:What I still want to see explained is who is going to pay extra taxes in order to make this tax plan neutral? If the middle class are really going to pay less in taxes, as he says they will, who is going to pay more? 20% across the board cuts amount to $5 trillion in lost revenue over 10 years, per Tax Policy Center. We know mathematically that this cannot be made up by simply capping deductions at 17%. Lets assume that on day one of this tax plan's passage, 10 million new jobs miraculously appear. This still will not close the $5 trillion gap.

Could it be that Romney is completely full of shit? Has neither he nor Ryan really not explained this to everyone yet because they simply don't have the time required in interviews or debates? Is it not possible to simply post the math on their campaign website or, if not the math, simply list - specifically - how the $5 trillion gap will be closed so we can then do the math ourselves? Just so you do not get confused this is one of the candidate's positions and his party's platform 527674_3586685158613_428311116_n

Do people ever keep secret ideas that are so great as we are told this Romney tax plan is?

knothead

knothead

boards of FL wrote:What I still want to see explained is who is going to pay extra taxes in order to make this tax plan neutral? If the middle class are really going to pay less in taxes, as he says they will, who is going to pay more? 20% across the board cuts amount to $5 trillion in lost revenue over 10 years, per Tax Policy Center. We know mathematically that this cannot be made up by simply capping deductions at 17%. Lets assume that on day one of this tax plan's passage, 10 million new jobs miraculously appear. This still will not close the $5 trillion gap.

Could it be that Romney is completely full of shit? Has neither he nor Ryan really not explained this to everyone yet because they simply don't have the time required in interviews or debates? Is it not possible to simply post the math on their campaign website or, if not the math, simply list - specifically - how the $5 trillion gap will be closed so we can then do the math ourselves?

Do people ever keep secret ideas that are so great as we are told this Romney tax plan is?

It is an insult to American citizens to have the Romney/Ryan ticket continue their campaign of dishonesty and secrecy . . . . please share what your specifics are? From any rational person they would or could do the math and see the problems with a plan that is so great it will not be shared with the voters! So I agree that Romney is, without a doubt, full of shit!

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

Here is what their plan is: Bring back the Bush Neocons into government, and continue that agenda. Their tax plan will not lower the deficit one cent, which can be damned, as they can just blame that on Obama. Besides, their cheerleaders here and elsewhere will just go along. They are going to need a lof of extra government money for their plan to ramp-up military spending so they can continue the Neocon agenda of conquest--Iran will be the first target. They might also have China in their sites to pre-emptively whittle down a growing super-power. They can blame their failure to reduce the deficit and growing of government on the new wars/crises and the on the Obama-policies they were forced to 'clean-up.'

It is really that simple. They don't need to focus on any truth from their end--just focus on defeating President Obama, and afterward craft the lies that will allow them to proceed without any issues.



Last edited by ZVUGKTUBM on 10/5/2012, 3:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Guest


Guest

ZVUGKTUBM wrote:Here is what their plan is: Bring back the Bush Neocons into government, and continue that agenda. Their tax plan will not lower the deficit one cent, which can be damned, as they can just blame that on Obama. Besides, their cheerleaders here and elsewhere will just go along. They are going to need a lof of extra government money for their plan to ramp-up military spending so they can continue the Neocon agenda of conquest--Iran will be the first target. They might also have China in their sites to pre-emptively whittle down a growing super-power. They can blame their failure to reduce the deficit and growing of government on the new wars/crises and the on the Obama-policies they were forced to 'clean-up.'

It is really that simple. They don't need to focus on any truth from their end--just focus on defeating President Obama, and afterward craft the lies that will allow them to, proceed without any issues.

http://www.policymic.com/articles/11219/mitt-romney-foreign-policy-team-17-of-24-advisors-are-bush-neocons

Guest


Guest

They are going to cut social programs to achieve some of their agenda. As Obama said during the debate they will cut 30% of medicaid money if given to the states. If you reduce taxes for everybody you are not going to have the money coming in.Depending on more jobs to supplement, it is way too long down the road. Social programs like food stamps and welfare and medicaid will be cut to pay for the taxes.Again the poor will pay.Nice.



Last edited by Dreamsglore on 10/5/2012, 10:56 pm; edited 1 time in total

Floridatexan

Floridatexan


I think at the very bottom of this discussion is a very real issue...that of trust. And I think Romney's going for the title of lyingest presidential candidate ever. It's not enough that he shamelessly keeps his fortune offshore or pays the lowest taxes of just about anybody...it's some very questionable business practices and the sources of his operating capital that really make me want to know more. But we're not getting more; we're only getting 2010 and 2011 taxes and "summaries" of 20 years, which could be and probably are, completely bogus. People, this man is a sack of voodoo doodoo.

2seaoat



Nobody on this forum wants to defend the platform position on taxes? I think we really do have some people who are beginning to pay attention. Normally somebody.....at least one or two people would try to argue this plan to cut taxes and what Mitten said during the debate can happen......I think even the diehard Obama haters realize voodoo when they see it.

TEOTWAWKI

TEOTWAWKI

Oh come on let's elect Romney and then we can find out his plan is for America. It's what the dumbasses did with Obamacare. Let's pass this and then we can worry about what's in it.......there is just NO cure for stupid..none.

Just so you do not get confused this is one of the candidate's positions and his party's platform Snrmaajt

2seaoat



Romney renounces the republican platform in the debate, and then his campaign announces that they are not going to extend pre existing conditions......The man is a sociopath. He can lie seamlessly. He does not respect boundaries and rules....as long as he gets his. The early voting is going to hit a record. The turn out will be a record. I hope that America will see the truth, but our challenges are so deep and at times hopeless that it may be too late. I see the Johnson ads are on showing these Frankenstein doctors standing over this animal which is half elephant and half donkey........we need Americans to vote for Johnson. It will start slow, but a platform which is fantasy that you can cut the taxes for the wealthy......and somehow this country will grow stronger has been debunked.....as some want us to fall into the abyss.....we can send Romney packing, and start making a difference.....if we start by getting rid of the drug war.....even if Obama wins.....every vote for Johnson will make it easier for Obama to do the right thing.

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