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Pensacola Discussion Forum » Politics » Why do we need 10 Nimitz carriers when NOBODY has anything close to one of them

Why do we need 10 Nimitz carriers when NOBODY has anything close to one of them

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2seaoat



http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/who%e2%80%99s-got-a-carrier-to-rival-the-us-navy-hint-not-russia/ar-BBvqBSL?li=BBnb7Kz


Colonialism and war profiteering. Nothing more has to be said. When did America quit defending itself and began exporting wars as a source of income for MIC?

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

The globalist thugs trying to establish a one-world government need a world enforcer. We are that power now, just as Great Britain (now little England, trying as it might to keep itself together) was during the 19th Century.  When they are done fleecing America (you thought that $20-trillion debt was an accident?) and we have served their purposes, we will find ourselves in no better shape than 'little England."

It does not matter who gets elected in November, as the establishment always finds a way to keep us under its control. If the globalists felt we were getting out of hand too much, they would have Janet Yellen cause a financial crisis of some sort. All presidents, Republican or Democrat are beholden to the chairman of the Fed.

Why do we need 10 Nimitz carriers when NOBODY has anything close to one of them D621e332e7ac62fe7e10a454da683cf2

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Guest


Guest

Exactly, Z. Exactly.

2seaoat



I do not see your conspiracy. I see a much more common thread of greed which Ike warned us about the Military Industrial Complex. You see if the people of this country simply voted for representatives who scaled back our offensive military and made our Defense Department a defensive configuration, the idea of some conspiracy would be crushed. These companies have bought Congress. Tell me when a house of representative candidate in Pensacola Florida will talk about reducing our Nimitz carriers in half? Not a chance because most of the panhandle depends on the military for spillover economic development. Are they part of this conspiracy? I do not think so. It will take massive primary opponents talking about cutting our over wrought offensive capabilities. Our Carrier configurations are vulnerable and bankrupting this nation where we have people talking about increasing the defense budget. We need common sense.

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

2seaoat wrote:I do not see your conspiracy.  I see a much more common thread of greed which Ike warned us about the Military Industrial Complex.  You see if the people of this country simply voted for representatives who scaled back our offensive military and made our Defense Department a defensive configuration, the idea of some conspiracy would be crushed.   These companies have bought Congress.  Tell me when a house of representative candidate in Pensacola Florida will talk about reducing our Nimitz carriers in half?  Not a chance because most of the panhandle depends on the military for spillover economic development.   Are they part of this conspiracy?   I do not think so.   It will take massive primary opponents talking about cutting our over wrought offensive capabilities.   Our Carrier configurations are vulnerable and bankrupting this nation where we have people talking about increasing the defense budget.   We need common sense.

But Seaoat, the MIC and the blood-sucking defense companies all belong to the globalists. Warfare is the most profitable enterprise on Earth when you are the banker lending trillions to the warring powers. This is how the Rothschild banking empire was created. They finance the MICs of each side and control the outcomes of conflicts this way.

Did you know that the 2010 NATO attack on Libya occurred at the same time the 2010 Bilderberg Meeting was being held, and then SECDEF David Gates jetted over to the meeting to give the globalists there a first hand account of the hostilities? And why did Ghadaffi need to be deposed? First, he resisted the establishment of a central bank in Libya with ties to the Western banking interests, and, he committed the cardinal sin of declaring he wanted to make the gold Dinar the currency of northern Africa to build the region's economic future. Anathema! He had to go! The controlled media would give the Establishment answer as to why he suddenly found himself out of power (and dead, too).

James Warburg was not kidding when he addressed that Senate committee in 1960.

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2seaoat



Sorry Z, I just do not think in this modern economy where half the worlds GDP production is coming from Asian economies who were not even part of the old European banking model. A conspiracy would require an intergenerational nexus and most of these companies are public traded corporations. Most of that is simple 18th century anti semitism which in today's global economy becomes comical that Jews are controlling the Chinese and Japanese economies to form a one world government.

The truth is that economic integration and trade increase productivity and wealth. It is the very success of America and the elimination of tariffs between states as a baker in KY can sell his doughnuts in Florida and compete. The idea that the United States economy was controlled by a banking conspiracy is absurd. It is the oldest conspiracy in history. Those who have wealth, try to hold onto that wealth. The problem of our carrier force is that it is not a defensive force when we have ten fold of any other nation. Defense contractors do not have to be connected to a world conspiracy, to want to sell another carrier. I agree that there are forces who are pushing with propaganda to create fear in America, but it has less to do with some global conspiracy than it does with simple greed of the wealthy.....something which does not require a conspiracy.

We need to cut our carrier groups in half.

Markle

Markle

One of the man-made islands in the contested China Sea built by China.

Why do we need 10 Nimitz carriers when NOBODY has anything close to one of them Hangars-south-china-sea-reuters-640x480_zpsgxjavows

2seaoat



So it is in American interest to have carriers in the South China Sea which can be neutralized by tactical nuclear weapons leaving us toothless. The chinese could take out our carrier groups in a day. They warned us not to continue going North in the Korean War, and our arrogance kicked us in the asz. Do you really think we are going to have a land war with China who poses NO threat to our national interests and is a key trading partner. I feel like a french man going to the town meeting in 1935.....you know the Germans have vehicles with wheels on them which can go around the end of defensive emplacements.........when we fight the next war with old technology and WWII strategy which bankrupts the nation it is not a real smart move.....you might say who cares about China making islands if we are toothless.......or are you suggesting a landing of troops in South Korea and a land war with China.......geez diplomacy, reductions in our offensive threats to other nations, and diversification of a military from a few very profitable technical platforms to a more basic defensive posture with fall back positions without all our eggs in 10 baskets.

othershoe1030

othershoe1030

Part of this military spending comes back to a good old fashioned welfare program for various localities as has been pointed out pretty well describes a good part of the panhandle economy.

It is a pathetic display of laziness on the part of industry and congress that they can't figure out some training programs and a transition to, say, solar panels, battery technology, prefab affordable housing, water processing improvement technology, the list is nearly endless.

I can see the pressure to continue with the employment but it is a shame on so many levels that we take the easy way out and pump our weapons for here and abroad that only serve to cause more turmoil. Of course I guess that's the point, to keep the killing machine going. Despicable.  Just one example:

The new defense spending bill includes $120 million for tanks that the Army has repeatedly said it doesn't want.

For three years, the Army in numerous Congressional hearings has pushed a plan that essentially would have suspended tank building and upgrades in the U.S. for the first time since World War II. The Army suggested that production lines could be kept open through foreign sales.

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2014/12/18/congress-again-buys-abrams-tanks-the-army-doesnt-want.html

2seaoat



It has all become so evil and wasteful. You tell me what a tank produces.....you tell me the government employees who man it what they produce? However, if you took that money and gave 100% tax credits on capital equipment using the money wasted on excessive military spending we would add millions of jobs and increase our GDP and productivity. A military is only as strong as the host nations economy and after fifty years of building too much wasteful military equipment and hiring more unproductive government employees we have a 17 trillion dollar debt. Cut military spending. Increase infrastructure and capital equipment spending, and throw in some generous job tax credits which expands the revenue to the government while reducing deficits. Sure there will be some economic dislocation in the panhandle to further consolidate and close bases where necessary(we may be a net winner) but shrink our military footprint to a defensive strategy.....not a promoter of war and profits for MIC

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

2seaoat wrote:So it is in American interest to have carriers in the South China Sea which can be neutralized by tactical nuclear weapons leaving us toothless.    The chinese could take out our carrier groups in a day.  They warned us not to continue going North in the Korean War, and our arrogance kicked us in the asz.   Do you really think we are going to have a land war with China who poses NO threat to our national interests and is a key trading partner.  I feel like a french man going to the town meeting in 1935.....you know the Germans have vehicles with wheels on them which can go around the end of defensive emplacements.........when we fight the next war with old technology and WWII strategy which bankrupts the nation it is not a real smart move.....you might say who cares about China making islands if we are toothless.......or are you suggesting a landing of troops in South Korea and a land war with China.......geez diplomacy, reductions in our offensive threats to other nations, and diversification of a military from a few very profitable technical platforms to a more basic defensive posture with fall back positions without all our eggs in 10 baskets.  

How about we stop trying to be the world's badass policeman? We do need to recapitalize our very old nuclear forces (within existing treaty limits) to stay a relevant power, and the savings from closing several of the bases we have in 140 countries could be used to pay for that. Countries mess with nuclear powers at their own risk.

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othershoe1030

othershoe1030

2seaoat wrote:It has all become so evil and wasteful.   You tell me what a tank produces.....you tell me the government employees who man it what they produce?   However, if you took that money and gave 100% tax credits on capital equipment using the money wasted on excessive military spending we would add millions of jobs and increase our GDP and productivity.   A military is only as strong as the host nations economy and after fifty years of building too much wasteful military equipment and hiring more unproductive government employees we have a 17  trillion dollar debt.    Cut military spending.  Increase infrastructure and capital equipment spending, and throw in some generous job tax credits which expands the revenue to the government while reducing deficits.  Sure there will be some economic dislocation in the panhandle to further consolidate and close bases where necessary(we may be a net winner) but shrink our military footprint to a defensive strategy.....not a promoter of war and profits for MIC

Works for me.

Guest


Guest

2seaoat wrote:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/who%e2%80%99s-got-a-carrier-to-rival-the-us-navy-hint-not-russia/ar-BBvqBSL?li=BBnb7Kz


Colonialism and war profiteering.   Nothing more has to be said.  When did America quit defending itself and began exporting wars as a source of income for MIC?

Ten on paper with two in retrofit at all times. That means eight and sometimes only seven operational. We also live in a more dangerous world where we can't always access a fixed AF base. A carrier eliminates that need. Use your head for a change.

2seaoat



You know better than me the changing platforms for non manned drone deployment as entirely new technology is allowing the launch of the same from much smaller platforms than carriers. I would rather have five carrier groups a thirty smaller platforms with smaller profiles which can be manned with far fewer personnel than five thousand. They are sitting ducks with drone delivered tactical nuclear warheads and you can bet if the chinese defend the China Sea from what they believe is our aggression, they will take out our carriers.

http://johntreed.com/blogs/john-t-reed-s-blog-about-military-matters/65448643-are-u-s-navy-surface-ships-sitting-ducks-to-enemies-with-modern-weapons

It is time to realize that smaller nations can neutralize the American advantage since WWII.......Russia, China, and even Pakistan could take out our carrier groups easier than a bunch of people with box cutters took out the twin towers. This is about too much money being put in sitting ducks which are basically offensive weapons and not defensive weapons. America is more vulnerable than ever because MIC is selling us top heavy technology systems which in a longer term war of attrition lower tech and quantity will win the day.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Why don't they take the money they piss away on one of those fucking carriers and use it to help cure the goddamn cancer me and seaoat and millions of others have been cursed with. And while they're at it, why don't they take the money they piss away on another one and clean up the polluted air we breathe, the polluted water we drink, and the polluted food we eat which is probably what is creating this cancer epidemic to start with.

I have nothing but praise for Obama and Biden for trying to promote this.
And nothing but hatred for merkel's goddamn repulsicons for not doing so.


Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Markle talks about China.  China aint going to war with the us.  They sell us $500 billion worth of crap every year.  To go to war with us would be the costliest thing they could ever do.  And why would they want us to freeze the untold amount of investments they've made here.  
Not to mention,  how in fuck could they ever expect to win a war with a country which has nukes on ICBM's that could turn their cities into sheets of glass.  

About the only scenario which would eventually lead to that is if that orange haired psycho was to do what he wants and we start building tv's here with the price of them becoming about $20 grand apiece because of the labor costs.
And how in hell would those barely educated Trump lovers be able to watch their idol on Fox News when they couldn't even afford to own a tv?
Then they'd have to settle for owning one of his overpriced neckties. I guess he could have his face printed on those but I don't think the wingnuts would settle for that. They wouldn't even be able to hear his horribly irritating voice anymore.



Last edited by Bob on 8/11/2016, 12:46 am; edited 1 time in total

2seaoat



Bob, we all die. My cancer will not be cured. I find out in the next week if this is the last episode of the book. However, my grandkids deserve to live in a safe world which our military has dominated since WWII, but we are at risk chasing ideas and bombing civilians with top heavy weapon systems which are vulnerable if war breaks out. I just think it is time to have qualitative discussions of defense strategies as the NEOCONS and MIC have dominated the conversation for sixty years. We need a new discussion.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Even if the cancer research does get into high gear it's too late for me, seaoat. So it wasn't a selfish comment.
If I was selfish like Sal keeps saying, there wouldn't be any reason for me to make a comment like that. I'm thinking about your children and grandchildren and everybody else's children and grandchildren.

2seaoat



Bob I am very tired and hurt all the time now......I am tired of being poked, cut on, blood work, shots, and treated like a piece of meat, and mostly I am just tired. As soon as I start to feel sorry for the decline, I realize how much I can still do and how I am bearing the discomfort without pain pills for the most part.......the not getting out of chairs easily continues, and I find out if they can do one more debulking on the lung tumors.....if they cannot, I am afraid the tumor load will have me sleeping most of the time and fading away. I hope it is the liver and not the lung tumors which do me in because not breathing is not fun. I remember the PM between retired Leo and how difficult it was at the end.....he always kept a positive approach and never let us know how bad it was until his last post where he said he would continue to read, but he was too weak to post.....I remember after Neko came back from her fight for life how weak she was, and how her lungs just failed her.......so I am posting more for now because I am not getting out.......and I hope this nation can find peace and security without spending so much on war. I wish I had allocated more time to solve these problems, but I did my fair share....just not enough. If it starts getting worse, I will probably try to get two docs and get fingerprinted for medical pot and will give up driving.......I hope I am wrong......I hope the tumors are stable and the hormone levels are good, and they can operate on the lungs in the next three months, but I am so fricking tired, and there are other forum members who are facing so much pain, that I feel guilty even talking about this eight year battle......eight years of wonderful life, but as I said.....they all come to an end.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

This is my current status,  seaoat.  I have 6 pulmonary nodules located in both of my lungs.   One grew into a tumor and was cut out and biopsied and found to be melanoma.   It's pretty well a certainty that the other five nodules are the beginning of what will be additional melanoma tumors.
Right now,  immunotherapy drugs are preventing the remaining tumors from progressing.  But that is temporary.  The cancer will become resistant to the drugs and the tumors will start to grow again.  
But,  I'm also blessed with a second totally unrelated kind of cancer called Chronic Lymphocitic Leukemia which is a form of Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma cancer.  My last scan indicated a growth in my abdomen associated with that.  And that growth happened after I'd received the immunotherapy so it appears to have no effect on that cancer.

I described it to a friend the other day this way.  Right now I'm sitting on  Casino Beach.  It's a beautiful sunny day and the water is perfect and I'm thoroughly enjoying myself.
But off in the Atlantic are two tropical storms.  One is Tropical Storm Melanoma and the other Tropical Storm Lymphoma.  And the forecasters have thrown their darts at the donkey board and discovered that both will eventually make landfall at Pensacola Beach and both will be category 5 hurricanes when they do.
But here's the kicker for me.  As the hurricanes are approaching,  it will be impossible for me to evacuate from Casino Beach because my body is chained to the bedrock below.

I will have two choices.  One,  will I want to be sitting on the beach as the two hurricanes are approaching?  Or, two,  will I prefer to end my life before the hurricanes kill me?  
Kind of like a choice between democrats and republicans (see I even made this post be on topic).  lol

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

Bob wrote:This is my current status,  seaoat.  I have 6 pulmonary nodules located in both of my lungs.   One grew into a tumor and was cut out and biopsied and found to be melanoma.   It's pretty well a certainty that the other five nodules are the beginning of what will be additional melanoma tumors.
Right now,  immunotherapy drugs are preventing the remaining tumors from progressing.  But that is temporary.  The cancer will become resistant to the drugs and the tumors will start to grow again.  
But,  I'm also blessed with a second totally unrelated kind of cancer called Chronic Lymphocitic Leukemia which is a form of Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma cancer.  My last scan indicated a growth in my abdomen associated with that.  And that growth happened after I'd received the immunotherapy so it appears to have no effect on that cancer.

I described it to a friend the other day this way.  Right now I'm sitting on  Casino Beach.  It's a beautiful sunny day and the water is perfect and I'm thoroughly enjoying myself.
But off in the Atlantic are two tropical storms.  One is Tropical Storm Melanoma and the other Tropical Storm Lymphoma.  And the forecasters have thrown their darts at the donkey board and discovered that both will eventually make landfall at Pensacola Beach and both will be category 5 hurricanes when they do.
But here's the kicker for me.  As the hurricanes are approaching,  it will be impossible for me to evacuate from Casino Beach because my body is chained to the bedrock below.

I will have two choices.  One,  will I want to be sitting on the beach as the two hurricanes are approaching?  Or, two,  will I prefer to end my life before the hurricanes kill me?  
Kind of like a choice between democrats and republicans (see I even made this post be on topic).  lol

Bob, just make sure you book that cruise you wanted to take, and don't be so tight-fisted with that nest-egg you built for yourself. Live a little.

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