HomeAnd how is it that you know this?
It is the only logical choice. There is no other choice. Test it yourself.
It is the only logical choice. There is no other choice. Test it yourself.
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If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance?
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Floridatexan
TEOTWAWKI
boards of FL
Markle
Hospital Bob
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52 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/29/2015, 11:14 pm
Hospital Bob
2seaoat wrote:And how is it that you know this?
It is the only logical choice. There is no other choice. Test it yourself.
Huh? Test it how?
I've been telling you about an alternative "logical" choice with most every post I've written in this thread. Go back and read it again.
But I can use the words of Socrates if that will help...
"I know that I do not know"
Socrates was applying that line to something else. But it very well articulates what I believe.
53 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/29/2015, 11:39 pm
Hospital Bob
Maybe you and I have essentially the same belief, seaoat.
And the only difference between us is that you've chosen to have a label for it.
And that label is "God".
Is that possible?
And the only difference between us is that you've chosen to have a label for it.
And that label is "God".
Is that possible?
54 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/29/2015, 11:51 pm
Hospital Bob
Actually I'd forgotten, I have a label for my beliefs too, seaoat. Or rather I used to.
I call it "Sultanism".
I call it that because, years ago, my belief was fleshed out in an internet thread which lasted over a year on another internet message board.
That thread was mostly a debate between me and two others. One a working physicist. The other a physics buff.
And the debate centered around their claim that "we (humanity) have now learned about 85% of all the fundamental knowledge there is to know".
Over the course of that year, I developed my personal religion/philosophy and eventually I gave it the label "Sultanism". That was because on that board my handle was "The Sultan of Cheap". lol
Unfortunately, it was eventually pointed out to me that the name "Sultanism" had already been taken...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultanism
But I kept using it anyway. lol
I call it "Sultanism".
I call it that because, years ago, my belief was fleshed out in an internet thread which lasted over a year on another internet message board.
That thread was mostly a debate between me and two others. One a working physicist. The other a physics buff.
And the debate centered around their claim that "we (humanity) have now learned about 85% of all the fundamental knowledge there is to know".
Over the course of that year, I developed my personal religion/philosophy and eventually I gave it the label "Sultanism". That was because on that board my handle was "The Sultan of Cheap". lol
Unfortunately, it was eventually pointed out to me that the name "Sultanism" had already been taken...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultanism
But I kept using it anyway. lol
55 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/29/2015, 11:53 pm
2seaoat
Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science is at the apex God. To suggest all that is was created makes no sense. To suggest that would suggest some type of precursor. That is logically impossible, and like looking at a room of multiple mirror images it never ends. The other logical argument is that there is no God, truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math and science, and that we can occupy the same in the human mind, and it is only a matter of time that cumulative knowledge with fill the gaps as Boards has correctly outlined, but that is a logical fallacy because it assumes man has that perception, and I have posted on other threads why the philosophers have argued the fallacy of this position. Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science has always been and God has always been the apex.....nothing came before, and nothing came after because it is, and as such there can be no other logical answer, and as I pointed out that this concept is the concept of infinity both in temporal and spatial sense.
56 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/30/2015, 1:17 am
Hospital Bob
2seaoat wrote: there can be no other logical answer
How do we know that the god in the bible, or any ancient god for that matter, is actually who or what he's claiming to be?
We've all encountered many imposters claiming to be something they aren't, seaoat.
If an advanced race of beings visited Earth long ago, who's to say they didn't claim to be what you've been made to believe is "God"?
Maybe they observed the really horrendous human behaviour at the time, and decided to intervene.
They would have been fully aware that humans had adopted the concept of having "gods", so maybe they posed as God in attempt to alter that human behaviour.
It's certainly plausible that a very advanced race of creatures could have easily performed what would have been perceived to be "miracles" at the time. Maybe Jesus was one of them.
57 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/30/2015, 3:58 am
Wordslinger
2seaoat wrote:Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science is at the apex God. To suggest all that is was created makes no sense. To suggest that would suggest some type of precursor. That is logically impossible, and like looking at a room of multiple mirror images it never ends. The other logical argument is that there is no God, truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math and science, and that we can occupy the same in the human mind, and it is only a matter of time that cumulative knowledge with fill the gaps as Boards has correctly outlined, but that is a logical fallacy because it assumes man has that perception, and I have posted on other threads why the philosophers have argued the fallacy of this position. Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science has always been and God has always been the apex.....nothing came before, and nothing came after because it is, and as such there can be no other logical answer, and as I pointed out that this concept is the concept of infinity both in temporal and spatial sense.
There -- that's what's wrong with your argument. God is because there is no other logical answer. Yet. Arguing that a God or gods exist because you don't have all the answers isn't logical. It's all wish-wish-wish. Enjoy it. But it's still bullshit.
58 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/30/2015, 10:57 am
2seaoat
There -- that's what's wrong with your argument. God is because there is no other logical answer. Yet. Arguing that a God or gods exist because you don't have all the answers isn't logical. It's all wish-wish-wish. Enjoy it. But it's still bullshit.
And your logical fallacy is that the gap can be closed by man's knowledge based on man's limited perception and time. There is no gap. There is only truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science and God is the apex as you think you have within your perception seen the shadows of Plato's cave, or Kant's limitations of the human mind. Again, there is only one logical answer and that is the truth which is beyond our perception, yet truths revealed are indisputable and certain, at least for the moment, and that is your basis for denial of the logical.
And your logical fallacy is that the gap can be closed by man's knowledge based on man's limited perception and time. There is no gap. There is only truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science and God is the apex as you think you have within your perception seen the shadows of Plato's cave, or Kant's limitations of the human mind. Again, there is only one logical answer and that is the truth which is beyond our perception, yet truths revealed are indisputable and certain, at least for the moment, and that is your basis for denial of the logical.
59 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/30/2015, 12:50 pm
Hospital Bob
2seaoat wrote: Again, there is only one logical answer and that is the truth which is beyond our perception, yet truths revealed are indisputable and certain, at least for the moment, and that is your basis for denial of the logical.
The truth is beyond our perception. But it's indisputable and certain.
I'm trying to wrap my mind around that. The truth is "beyond our perception". So we don't know what the truth is because it's beyond our perception.
However, even though we can't know what the truth is, we know it's "indisputable and certain".
That's like if you showed me a closed cardboard box and asked me what's in it.
And my response would be, "I can't perceive what's in it, but I know it's big and hairy.
How do you come up with this stuff.
60 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 9/30/2015, 1:04 pm
Wordslinger
2seaoat wrote:There -- that's what's wrong with your argument. God is because there is no other logical answer. Yet. Arguing that a God or gods exist because you don't have all the answers isn't logical. It's all wish-wish-wish. Enjoy it. But it's still bullshit.
And your logical fallacy is that the gap can be closed by man's knowledge based on man's limited perception and time. There is no gap. There is only truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science and God is the apex as you think you have within your perception seen the shadows of Plato's cave, or Kant's limitations of the human mind. Again, there is only one logical answer and that is the truth which is beyond our perception, yet truths revealed are indisputable and certain, at least for the moment, and that is your basis for denial of the logical.
Your premise is flawed. All we have or can count on is man's knowledge. Everything else is pure speculation. Prove me wrong.
61 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 11:11 am
boards of FL
2seaoat wrote:Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science is at the apex God. To suggest all that is was created makes no sense. To suggest that would suggest some type of precursor. That is logically impossible, and like looking at a room of multiple mirror images it never ends. The other logical argument is that there is no God, truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math and science, and that we can occupy the same in the human mind, and it is only a matter of time that cumulative knowledge with fill the gaps as Boards has correctly outlined, but that is a logical fallacy because it assumes man has that perception, and I have posted on other threads why the philosophers have argued the fallacy of this position. Truth and perfection in the universe, nature, math, and science has always been and God has always been the apex.....nothing came before, and nothing came after because it is, and as such there can be no other logical answer, and as I pointed out that this concept is the concept of infinity both in temporal and spatial sense.
This is nothing more than meaningless, vague babbling. I mean seriously. Do you honestly think that you're making a cogent argument here for anything?
I want you to do something for me. Please stand in front of a mirror and read aloud this post of yours that I have quoted above. Say it out loud to yourself in front of the mirror and see if you can keep a straight face.
But to retort: Entropy. Black holes. Quantum erasers. There is truth in the fundamental world. Logic is reason and truth. The universe is vast and metaphysical reality is not preposterous entropy event horizon. Based upon this logic test, we can reject the god hypothesis.
Check mate, 2seaoat. Check mate.
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62 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 11:18 am
Hospital Bob
Don't take that from him lying down, seaoat. Reply to it so we can keep this thread going. I love these threads as much as the "9/11 truther" threads. They both have a lot in common. lol
63 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 11:26 am
Sal
Bob wrote:Don't take that from him lying down, seaoat. Reply to it so we can keep this thread going. I love these threads as much as the "9/11 truther" threads. They both have a lot in common. lol
Give him a minute to fire up the word salad generator.
He's been wearing that thing out.
64 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 11:31 am
Hospital Bob
True, Sal. But in seaoat's defense and to be fair, my word salad generator tends to be on steroids too. lol
65 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 11:36 am
Hospital Bob
But the really embarrasing thing about a thread like this is, that only a handful of us here give a shit about any of it. The rest are bored to tears with it. I'm guessing they all stopped reading it long ago.
66 Re: If the presence of flowing water on Mars eventually leads to the discovery of life on another planet, will that have any religious signficance? 10/1/2015, 2:05 pm
EmeraldGhost
Bob wrote:Here's one thing to ponder. The Bible teaches that humans have dominion over all other living creatures. Does that mean living creatures on other planets too?
Apparently, the Bible left out any reference to that.
All I know is I hope they don't find life anywhere else in the universe anytime soon ... because if they do no doubt Obama will feel compelled to send them money.
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