The best health care system in the world.....yeah, right.

Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

Hmmmm.....no comment from those who think the United States health care provision system is the "best in the world?"

Yep. That's as I expected. Crickets...... 

Well PB I must say that I am not surprised at all at the findings in this study. It is nothing novel that money greases the skids for corporate interests whether it be public or private enterprise. For me, the number of negative effects caused by misuse of RX generally are alarming. My view of the American healthcare system remains positive despite these revelations when compared to many others although I would be reluctant to declare it 'the best' . . . . . . . . good post/thank you!

The further corruption of medical knowledge through company-funded teams that craft the published literature to overstate benefits and understate harms, unmonitored by the FDA, leaves good physicians with corrupted knowledge.5 6 Patients are the innocent victims.


Drug companies, years ago did away with reps that had a background in pharmacy, and enlisted marketing reps. Once a drug becomes generic....profits are lost.

knothead wrote:Well PB I must say that I am not surprised at all at the findings in this study.  It is nothing novel that money greases the skids for corporate interests whether it be public or private enterprise.  For me, the number of negative effects caused by misuse of RX generally are alarming.  My view of the American healthcare system remains positive despite these revelations when compared to many others although I would be reluctant to declare it 'the best' . . . . . . . . good post/thank you!

I agree out health care system is good, Knot, for those who can access it. I just think it would be better if the profit factor were removed.

I know, a radical view.  

Joanimaroni wrote: The further corruption of medical knowledge through company-funded teams that craft the published literature to overstate benefits and understate harms, unmonitored by the FDA, leaves good physicians with corrupted knowledge.5 6 Patients are the innocent victims.


Drug companies, years ago did away with reps that had a background in pharmacy, and enlisted marketing reps. Once a drug becomes generic....profits are lost.

If health care continues on its current course, I expect bedside care will be provided by marketing reps in the next few years.  

ZVUGKTUBM wrote:See the thread I just started over in the General Section "How to save $104,802 on heart surgery"

https://pensacoladiscussion.forumotion.com/t8767-how-to-save-104802-on-heart-surgery

Great article, Z. Can you imagine having heart surgery in the US for $800.00?

If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

PBulldog2 wrote:

ZVUGKTUBM wrote:See the thread I just started over in the General Section "How to save $104,802 on heart surgery"

https://pensacoladiscussion.forumotion.com/t8767-how-to-save-104802-on-heart-surgery

Great article, Z. Can you imagine having heart surgery in the US for $800.00?

I would do yours for $750.00!

PBulldog2 wrote:

knothead wrote:Well PB I must say that I am not surprised at all at the findings in this study.  It is nothing novel that money greases the skids for corporate interests whether it be public or private enterprise.  For me, the number of negative effects caused by misuse of RX generally are alarming.  My view of the American healthcare system remains positive despite these revelations when compared to many others although I would be reluctant to declare it 'the best' . . . . . . . . good post/thank you!

I agree out health care system is good, Knot, for those who can access it. I just think it would be better if the profit factor were removed.

I know, a radical view.   

Most hospitals are non-profit.

How many new life saving and live improving drugs, new procedures and advanced technology would be developed if there was no profit potential for the company spending billions to develop the item? All those advances, are they withheld from the rest of the world or do they improve health around the world?

Markle wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:

knothead wrote:Well PB I must say that I am not surprised at all at the findings in this study.  It is nothing novel that money greases the skids for corporate interests whether it be public or private enterprise.  For me, the number of negative effects caused by misuse of RX generally are alarming.  My view of the American healthcare system remains positive despite these revelations when compared to many others although I would be reluctant to declare it 'the best' . . . . . . . . good post/thank you!

I agree out health care system is good, Knot, for those who can access it. I just think it would be better if the profit factor were removed.

I know, a radical view.   

Most hospitals are non-profit.

How many new life saving and live improving drugs, new procedures and advanced technology would be developed if there was no profit potential for the company spending billions to develop the item?  All those advances, are they withheld from the rest of the world or do they improve health around the world?

Did you read the article I provided, Markle?

And yes, if I ever need heart surgery, I will contact you.  

PkrBum wrote:If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic  predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

Edit: But seriously, PKR, you are right. My last employer had this big health thing going on last year. We had to go for lab tests, be weighed and have a breath check for nicotine or our insurance rates would double. And it was all for our benefit.....right.  We knew better.

How stupid did they think we were?

PkrBum wrote:If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic  predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

You're being completely ridiculous. There's a difference between a suggestion, or even an attempt at assistance, and a mandate. A mandate is something like the current trend of drug testing as a condition of employment, or the "War on Drugs"...and those things aren't "progressive". You crack me up.

Meanwhile, you might enjoy this. I did.

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/behind-the-sierra-blanca-border-checkpoint-drug-busts?fullpage=1&src=longreads

Floridatexan wrote:

PkrBum wrote:If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic  predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

You're being completely ridiculous.  There's a difference between a suggestion, or even an attempt at assistance, and a mandate.  A mandate is something like the current trend of drug testing as a condition of employment, or the "War on Drugs"...and those things aren't "progressive".  You crack me up.  

Meanwhile, you might enjoy this.  I did.

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/behind-the-sierra-blanca-border-checkpoint-drug-busts?fullpage=1&src=longreads

How about a mandate to BUY insurance or pay a fine?

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Floridatexan wrote:

PkrBum wrote:If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic  predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

You're being completely ridiculous. There's a difference between a suggestion, or even an attempt at assistance, and a mandate. A mandate is something like the current trend of drug testing as a condition of employment, or the "War on Drugs"...and those things aren't "progressive". You crack me up.

Meanwhile, you might enjoy this. I did.

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/behind-the-sierra-blanca-border-checkpoint-drug-busts?fullpage=1&src=longreads

I enjoyed the article... thank you. You know I hate all govt overreach... and drug prohibition ranks pretty high. It's not just big biz for govt... it also limits the citizens caught up in it for the rest of their productive life. A heavy price to pay indeed.

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

Floridatexan wrote:

PkrBum wrote:If you really want to control costs... and since the mandate establishes the latitude that the govt has granted itself... then social controls will do the job. Nutritional requirements, exercise monitors, bad habit prohibitions, risk aversion laws, genetic  predisposition penalties... etc.

see... I could make a good progressive.

You're being completely ridiculous.  There's a difference between a suggestion, or even an attempt at assistance, and a mandate.  A mandate is something like the current trend of drug testing as a condition of employment, or the "War on Drugs"...and those things aren't "progressive".  You crack me up.  

Meanwhile, you might enjoy this.  I did.

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/behind-the-sierra-blanca-border-checkpoint-drug-busts?fullpage=1&src=longreads

How about a mandate to BUY insurance or pay a fine?

How about allowing health insurance companies to sell across state lines with the customer choosing the type coverage they want?

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing: a huge profit.

PBulldog2 wrote:

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing:  a huge profit.

PB. Heres my issue with your post.

If you want to attack the FDA, you should have just made your title that. Because the FDA is GOV and I would have supported you.

But you made your title an attack on US, yes that's right YOU and ME, because we are health care professionals. All these people who attack the health care in this country, you know what they say? They say oh those people make too much money, etc etc etc. They complain also because we are all suppose to be GODS and perfect like robots. Do you think they understand what it is like to put your life in danger everyday handling diseased patients and samples? Do you think they care about the long work days and high work volume per person ratio? Do you think they understand how hard it is to be so dedicated to serving your patients you skip lunches for years and become unhealthy yourself? Oh I could go on and on and you know it. I really don't ant to pick a fight with you but when I hear a nurse sarcastically demeaning our health system here in the USA it royally pisses me off.

I would expect that us healthcare professionals need to stick together because we are UNDER ATTACK! These bad mouthing anti usa healthcare system people are devaluing us. They think any mc Ds worker can come in and do our jobs. And that goes for the asshole we have as a president who created this fucking ACA that is killing us off.

So yes, I took the title of this thread personally. Because as a healthcare professional out here Im tired of people coming along and bashing us when we are out here struggling to do our jobs with even less than what we had before now with all the cuts. Theres ANOTHER cut coming btw.

So if you want to bitch about the GOV FDA, go ahead. But don't come along and then tell me you think the GOV can run healthcare better than us. Because this whole ACA thing isn't about healthcare at all. Its about GOV power and they don't give a shit what it does to healthcare.

PBulldog2 wrote:

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing:  a huge profit.

If you spent billions of dollars developing a new drug...and it was one of then you were developing but 9 were not successful, without making a profit on the sale of the drug, how could you afford developing the new drug?

Same for new technology and procedures. We have the greatest health care in the world precisely because we have a for profit health care system.

Does the rest of the World NOT benefit from all the developments in our country? Why do you want that to stop?

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing:  a huge profit.

PB. Heres my issue with your post.

If you want to attack the FDA, you should have just made your title that. Because the FDA is GOV and I would have supported you.

But you made your title an attack on US, yes that's right YOU and ME, because we are health care professionals. All these people who attack the health care in this country, you know what they say? They say oh those people make too much money, etc etc etc. They complain also because we are all suppose to be GODS and perfect like robots. Do you think they understand what it is like to put your life in danger everyday handling diseased patients and samples? Do you think they care about the long work days and high work volume per person ratio? Do you think they understand how hard it is to be so dedicated to serving your patients you skip lunches for years and become unhealthy yourself? Oh I could go on and on and you know it. I really don't ant to pick a fight with you but when I hear a nurse sarcastically demeaning our health system here in the USA it royally pisses me off.

I would expect that us healthcare professionals need to stick together because we are UNDER ATTACK! These bad mouthing anti usa healthcare system people are devaluing us. They think any mc Ds worker can come   in and do our jobs. And that goes for the asshole we have as a president who created this fucking ACA that is killing us off.

So yes, I took the title of this thread personally. Because as a healthcare professional out here Im tired of people coming along and bashing us when we are out here struggling to do our jobs with even less than what we had before now with all the cuts. Theres ANOTHER cut coming btw.

So if you want to bitch about the GOV FDA, go ahead. But don't come along and then tell me you think the GOV can run healthcare better than us. Because this whole ACA thing isn't about healthcare at all. Its about GOV power and they don't give a shit what it does to healthcare.

If you skipped lunches for years you must have made it up w/ triple dinners,fatass. You are so ridiculous! LOL!

PBulldog2 wrote:

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing:  a huge profit.

When are you gonna learn,PB? Chrissy is nobody's friend. You are foolish to let her know any personal information.

ObamaCare will make the Post Office look like a smooth running machine! Slow, outdated and billions in debt.

Dreamsglore wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:

. wrote:

PBulldog2 wrote:Harvard University
The Lab @ Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics
Risky Drugs: Why The FDA Cannot Be Trusted
By Donald W. Light

A forthcoming article for the special issue of the Journal of Law, Medicine and Ethics (JLME), edited by Marc Rodwin and supported by the Edmond J. Safra Center for Ethics, presents evidence that about 90 percent of all new drugs approved by the FDA over the past 30 years are little or no more effective for patients than existing drugs.

All of them may be better than indirect measures or placebos, but most are no better for patients than previous drugs approved as better against these measures. The few superior drugs make important contributions to the growing medicine chest of effective drugs.

The bar for “safe” is equally low, and over the past 30 years, approved drugs have caused an epidemic of harmful side effects, even when properly prescribed. Every week, about 53,000 excess hospitalizations and about 2400 excess deaths occur in the United States among people taking properly prescribed drugs to be healthier. One in every five drugs approved ends up causing serious harm, while one in ten provide substantial benefit compared to existing, established drugs. This is the opposite of what people want or expect from the FDA.

Prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death. Deaths and hospitalizations from over-dosing, errors, or recreational drug use would increase this total. American patients also suffer from about 80 million mild side effects a year, such as aches and pains, digestive discomforts, sleepiness or mild dizziness.

The forthcoming article in JLME also presents systematic, quantitative evidence that since the industry started making large contributions to the FDA for reviewing its drugs, as it makes large contributions to Congressmen who have promoted this substitution for publicly funded regulation, the FDA has sped up the review process with the result that drugs approved are significantly more likely to cause serious harm, hospitalizations, and deaths. New FDA policies are likely to increase the epidemic of harms.

http://www.ethics.harvard.edu/lab/blog/312-risky-drugs

The title of this thread and the content do not go together.

FDA is part of the GOV by the way.

Who ya wanna pick a fight with, the FDA or physicians?

We do have the best healthcare in the world. Kings, queens and all other important very wealthy persons do not travel here to be treated for no reason.

Whats even more sad is you claim to be a nurse and feel that our services are inferior. Youre complaint is with access, or I thought it was. But now I guess you just want to pick a fight.

Now before you go off your rocking chair, dont try and toss that WHO shit at me again. We have been down that old and wore out infant mortality rate a million times. And weve hashed out the cancer survival rate many times which showed us superior for the two main cancers, prostate and breast.

We have some of the best hospitals and researches right here in this country.

Matter of a fact most doctors from OTHER countries come here to get a education to even be a doctor.

Oh I could go on, but I figured this was enough to get your granny panties wet.

PS: Please retire

Wow, Chrissy, that was a pretty nasty post. You know my name; you can easily check and make sure I'm a nurse, so please stop the "you claim to be a nurse" crap. Post my name here if you wish. I have nothing to hide. And what's with the "please retire" comment? If want you want is a good fight, you know I'm up to it, but I thought we were past that.

And yes, my chief complaint is with access, although I posted this article to show how corrupt the FDA is. Corrupted by outside money provided by Big Pharma and congressmen, I might add.

Some people go on and on about how wonderful our health care system is in this country. My post shows how even a government agency, the FDA, can be corrupted by outside commercial interests who only want one thing:  a huge profit.

When are you gonna learn,PB? Chrissy is nobody's friend. You are foolish to let her know any personal information.

Dreams, I really don't care who knows my name. It's no big deal to me. If it were, I darned sure wouldn't post on this forum.  

If I had something to hide, it might be different, but I don't.