Sickening......

Citgo flew the flag at half staff yesterday at their corporate headquarters out of "respect" for Hugo Chavez....

newswatcher wrote: Citgo flew the flag at half staff yesterday at their corporate headquarters out of "respect" for Hugo Chavez....

Uh, it's a nationalized oil company. He was their boss.

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

newswatcher wrote: Citgo flew the flag at half staff yesterday at their corporate headquarters out of "respect" for Hugo Chavez....

Uh, it's a nationalized oil company. He was their boss.

He was a dictator and that's worth any sign of respect here?...

CITGO gas is sold at our local Navy Exchange.

So much for russ limbaugh's worship of the oil companies.

I am not going to apologize for the man or vindicate him.....but missionary friends who have spent a great deal of time in the country did not have this great negative feeling about the man, and believed he was working for reforms which helped the average citizen. I studied Venezuela as part of my master's thesis in 1974, and the Oligarchy, and the corruption regarding oil production in that country was notorious. The truth is that slowly Brazil, Argentina, Chile, and Peru have all made great advances in attacking corrupt oligarchies and building middle classes with trade alignments which gave a big FU to traditional banking and trade policies which discouraged economic development and rendered most of these countries as simply sources of natural resources to be exploited, by propping up corrupt governments which guaranteed the game remained rigged.

With all due respect, seaoat, I think you may be a little too enamored with celebrity.

With all due respect, seaoat, I think you may be a little too enamored with celebrity.

Perhaps. However, in the entire time he was in office, I simply ignored him. After spending thousands of hours researching trade and economic polices of exploitation in six South American countries in my thesis, I learned that celebrity has little to do with the entrenched Oligarchies exploitation of the people of these countries. The modernity and economic success of those same six nations almost 40 years after I wrote my thesis completely comport with those systematic economic changes which were required in Latin America for the people of those countries to see real median income advancements.

Trade policy which encourages economic independence necessarily required emulation of the EU model which involved tariffs and nations cooperating to create tariff free zones and coordinated policy as to economy of scales in manufacturing. The results have been amazing in Brazil and Argentina, and the transition in Venezuela despite what we hear in our media will also contribute to greater economic gain for the people of that country. I think some of his policies of nationalization went too far, but as I have said a great deal tonight.......history will be the judge.......so if I have confused you with concern of celebrity....I hope I have clarified.

2seaoat wrote:With all due respect, seaoat, I think you may be a little too enamored with celebrity.

Perhaps. However, in the entire time he was in office, I simply ignored him. After spending thousands of hours researching trade and economic polices of exploitation in six South American countries in my thesis, I learned that celebrity has little to do with the entrenched Oligarchies exploitation of the people of these countries. The modernity and economic success of those same six nations almost 40 years after I wrote my thesis completely comport with those systematic economic changes which were required in Latin America for the people of those countries to see real median income advancements.

Trade policy which encourages economic independence necessarily required emulation of the EU model which involved tariffs and nations cooperating to create tariff free zones and coordinated policy as to economy of scales in manufacturing. The results have been amazing in Brazil and Argentina, and the transition in Venezuela despite what we hear in our media will also contribute to greater economic gain for the people of that country. I think some of his policies of nationalization went too far, but as I have said a great deal tonight.......history will be the judge.......so if I have confused you with concern of celebrity....I hope I have clarified.

His country is pitty potty poor and obviously he took more for himself than he gave to his people.

This article says you are clueless:

http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/139014/michael-shifter/so-long-chavez?page=2&cid=nlc-this_week_on_foreignaffairs_co-030713-so_long_chavez_4-030713

The problem, however, is that Chávez’s approach to his country’s acute social problems ultimately proved ineffective and unsustainable. His programs were patronage-driven and did virtually nothing to create enduring institutions for broad-based, long-term economic and social development. (SOUND FAMILIAR WITH OBAMA?)Although his aggressive attacks against traditional elite groups (“rancid oligarchy” was a favorite characterization), had some popular resonance, the virulence of his discourse made his social programs more controversial and divisive than necessary, which ultimately undermined their success.

Whatever Chávez’s intentions, his insatiable craving for control crippled his government. For all of his effort and bravado, Chávez failed to build a coherent model that could be adopted elsewhere. His legacy in the region can be illustrated by comparing his administration with that of other countries, especially other leftist governments that are also independent of the United States and committed to a social agenda. The 2002–10 administration of Brazilian President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva of the Workers’ Party is a good example. Lula managed to combine the give-and-take of democratic politics with fiscal discipline and well-designed social policies that lifted millions out of poverty. Venezuela’s debt-ridden economy, marked by chronic shortages and high inflation, is hardly an appealing alternative. The Latin American recipients of Chávez’s beneficence were understandably grateful, but it is telling that no other government in the region has sought to replicate his example. Most of the region’s leaders proclaim stronger support for Lula’s approach than for Chávez’s. With more effective governance models, marked by pragmatism and moderation, the prospects for sustained prosperity are better in countries such as Colombia and Peru than in Venezuela

Floridatexan wrote:
CITGO gas is sold at our local Navy Exchange.

Citgo was taken out of there several years ago.....

PACEDOG#1 wrote:

newswatcher wrote: Citgo flew the flag at half staff yesterday at their corporate headquarters out of "respect" for Hugo Chavez....

Uh, it's a nationalized oil company. He was their boss.

Uh....it was the American Flag at half staff for a freakin dictator!....

it is telling that no other government in the region has sought to replicate his example.

Probably true because Brazil, Argentina, and Chile went through this process 30-40 years ago with inflation almost reaching 100% and economic disruption. The process is an evolution as those Oligarchies who corruptly control governments never give up control willingly, and the economic transitions take decades. I am clueless.........you really do make me smile. You cut and paste an article and think you understand Latin American history, economics, and social change. Maybe you do. However, if you did you would understand the judgment is still out on his economic reforms. It may take years like it did in Chile, Peru, Brazil, and Argentina.........the economic growth and rise in median incomes in these countries has been stellar, and Venezuela has vast oil reserves and a very good future if the people of that country can have a true democracy, and they can be free of the yoke of the Oligarchy and the corrupt governments which have choked their economic growth historically.

The irony is the United States each year is evolving into the third world latin american oligarchy of the 19th century where unfettered wealth can buy politicians which allow a continued rigged game.......Hugo is dead.....I was no fan, but his very existence was a reaction to the corrupt history and exploitation in the nation, and we can only hope for their people that they can have a true democracy evolve without the vultures stealing their country.