Rand Paul is supposed to be a doctor........he makes Christie look like a PHD in medical research

Paul is a certified idiot.......he is a paper tiger......without his father's name, he would be laughed off the national stage. He just announced some type of causal link between healthy children getting vaccinated and then being bumbling idiots........I saw the interview, and for all the good observations he can make, and positions which I could support, this guy would be ran out of local government in an election cycle because he has NO idea how to govern or does he understand how hard it is to govern. He is an Ivory Tower dogma driven petulant child.

I can't believe people take him seriously.

He is all over the place, and I must admit some of the things he says are very appealing, but you scratch the surface and this guy is as phoney as a three dollar bill.

The guy in Britain who started all this anti vaccine nonsense lost his medical license because of the fraud he perpetrated, and Paul is a medical doctor? After seeing his interview today.....he needs his license pulled......he alleged causal connections between vaccines and damaged kids.......no data, no study, nothing but a story he says he heard......does he understand the responsibility of the President?

The underlying problem, I believe, is that people don't trust the cops, local, state or federal governments anymore. We've simply been lied to too much. So, when a nutcase doctor suddenly claims that vaccines are harmful, too many moms don't want to take a chance.

Once again, who are we supposed to trust?

"However, the American Academy of Pediatrics affirmed today the importance of vaccines along with their relatively low risk of harm. In a statement, the group stressed that the MMR vaccine for measles, mumps and rubella is one of the safest and most effective vaccines given, and strongly urged parents to stick to the vaccine schedule recommended by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention." ~~ from ABC News Website

Low risk of harm implies there is known harm.

Explain it thoroughly and let the parents decide.

Explain it thoroughly and let the parents decide.


Parental choice.....nonsense. The only choice they have to make is do they want their kids to go to school or not. If they choose they do not want their children to go to school, that is their free choice. However, choice cannot be a factor in government policy when the common good of all citizens is at risk. Yes, any shot can result in infection and death.........probabilities......Michelle Bachman spewing nonsense about vaccines flushed her chit down the toilet. Parental choice......leave the fricking country because your right to protect your children condemns the lives of thousands because of superstition and ignorance. For politicians to spew this nonsense......they deserve the same treatment that Michelle Bachman got......ejection from the game.

My wife tells the story of what measles did to a pregnant mother in her town and the suffering from physical deformity that child suffered before that boy died at twelve. The problem with this fricking country today is that we have insulated ourselves from the horrors of this world by good science, only to have those flat world believers to simply say......leave it up to the parents to decide science......absolute Bull chit. I saw first hand kids in braces because of polio.....what fricking insanity.....pure fricking insanity.

Wordslinger wrote:The underlying problem, I believe, is that people don't trust the cops, local, state or federal governments anymore.  We've simply been lied to too much.  So, when a nutcase doctor suddenly claims that vaccines are harmful, too many moms don't want to take a chance.

Once again, who are we supposed to trust?

But they don't trust science anymore either. "Global Warming" is an example.

2seaoat wrote:Explain it thoroughly and let the parents decide.


Parental choice.....nonsense.  The only choice they have to make is do they want their kids to go to school or not.  If they choose they do not want their children to go to school, that is their free choice.   However, choice cannot be a factor in government policy when the common good of all citizens is at risk.  Yes, any shot can result in infection and death.........probabilities......Michelle Bachman spewing nonsense about vaccines flushed her chit down the toilet.   Parental choice......leave the fricking country because your right to protect your children condemns the lives of thousands because of superstition and ignorance.   For politicians to spew this nonsense......they deserve the same treatment that Michelle Bachman got......ejection from the game.

No, Seaoat, that is not what I said.     I am pointing out that there is risk (According to the American Academy of Pediatrics)  so have an open discussion about risks, which children would be at risk, and YES, let the parent decide.

It has nothing to do with being superstitious or an idiot.

Seagoat and his sensational anecdotal exaggerations... why do you do that? The mortality rate for measles is .015%.

To be objective however it is much better the more widespread and comprehensive the immunization.

Nonsense. It is the political doublethink of embedding the idea that government is evil and is working to hurt people. Less government is good. Therefore, vaccines are mandated by government . They may be bad, so we should have parental choice as to the same. Vaccines work when ALL are vaccinated. The more that avoid the same, bring risk to the immune compromised and newborns. You either stand on the side of science or you do not. If you have scientist who are peer reviewed who say do not vaccinate, then we have a discussion which you seem to think should go on now when NOBODY in the science community believes the same. You have the cart before the horse, and that is exactly the aim of the doublethink all government is bad. If the oligarchy can win the intellectual battle of science to convince people to avoid vaccines then they can control our lives in Orwellian splendor. Sometimes a government must be autocratic when it comes to public health, and national defense. Parental choice has nothing to do with the common good as determined by sound science. We need to hold our politicians accountable that they are using sound science and that they are making sound public policy......this is not the Oprah Winfrey show where our goal is to make everybody feel good.

Pro life folks seem to be the loudest critics of vaccinations......

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/pages/1105.aspx?categoryid=54&subcategoryid=137

PK......in your Ivory tower you see no need for autocracy for any reason......but the common good demands the same.....again this is not the Oprah Winfrey show and feel good doing our own thing. The debate should be among scientist and our elected representatives. You know the folks who represent us in a democracy

2seaoat wrote:Pro life folks seem to be the loudest critics of vaccinations......

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/pages/1105.aspx?categoryid=54&subcategoryid=137

PK......in your Ivory tower you see no need for autocracy for any reason......but the common good demands the same.....again this is not the Oprah Winfrey show and feel good doing our own thing. The debate should be among scientist and our elected representatives. You know the folks who represent us in a democracy

Gawd you're dense... I'm the one that acknowledged that this actually was a case for common good.

You just don't need the demagoguery.

Demagoguery is an appeal to people that plays on their emotions and prejudices rather than on their rational side.

Wrong again. Doublethink splendor. Disease and what it does to people is not emotions and prejudices. The details are horrible and real. Talking about possible harms which are statistically insignificant, and then talking about the evil government making people vaccinate children before entry into school because..........some harm comes from vaccines is exactly the demagoguery which took Michelle Bachman out of the 2012 Presidential primary. Disease is not prejudice or emotion......it is real and tangible. You either support science and intellectual integrity or you do not. There is no middle ground. There is no parental choice to make the world flat. There is a right and wrong answer, and if a politician cannot get the answer right, I am going to have a very hard time supporting the same for President. At least Christie and his people are trying to back track....Paul is lost......a true demagogue and your hero.

2seaoat wrote:Demagoguery is an appeal to people that plays on their emotions and prejudices rather than on their rational side.

Wrong again. Doublethink splendor. Disease and what it does to people is not emotions and prejudices. The details are horrible and real. Talking about possible harms which are statistically insignificant, and then talking about the evil government making people vaccinate children before entry into school because..........some harm comes from vaccines is exactly the demagoguery which took Michelle Bachman out of the 2012 Presidential primary. Disease is not prejudice or emotion......it is real and tangible. You either support science and intellectual integrity or you do not. There is no middle ground. There is no parental choice to make the world flat. There is a right and wrong answer, and if a politician cannot get the answer right, I am going to have a very hard time supporting the same for President. At least Christie and his people are trying to back track....Paul is lost......a true demagogue and your hero.

How is he my hero? Another exaggeration huh?

How is he my hero? Another exaggeration huh?




Simple answer then.....of all 2016 candidates who is your lead candidate right now. I have been open and honest when I said Christie........if it is an exaggeration then please show me I am wrong.

A doctor tonight......libertarianism falls apart when it bumps into public health.......poor little Randy. At least Doctor Cartwright tonight showed he actually is a doctor. Rand Paul is PK's demagogue. Michelle Bachman....you now have competition.

I said the other day that rand didn't have the necessary experience... neither at the state level nor the federal level.

I prefer that candidates for potus have executive experience and lengthy voting record. Campaign promises are easy.

This must just sound like crazy talk to you though.

This must just sound like crazy talk to you though.


A simple question which you resisted with all your might......say nothing.....nihilism means that you do not have to face being wrong......I hope you were not one of those poor children who were forced into a sport and never could accept losing or being wrong. I have zero fear of being wrong, because you can never be right without recognition of what is wrong.

You think measles is incidental or insignificant......take a read

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/roald-dahls-heartbreaking-letter-about-measles-vaccine/

2seaoat wrote:My wife tells the story of what measles did to a pregnant mother in her town and the suffering from physical deformity that child suffered before that boy died at twelve.  The problem with this fricking country today is that we have insulated ourselves from the horrors of this world by good science, only to have those flat world believers to simply say......leave it up to the parents to decide science......absolute Bull chit.   I saw first hand kids in braces because of polio.....what fricking insanity.....pure fricking insanity.

This is the first reference I've seen or heard about the dangers of Rubella for pregnant women. It is quite serious and was a major concern before the disease was nearly wiped out.

While this is an accurate description of birth defects due to Rubella the rest of the article has not been updated since the Disney Land outbreak.

There are enough dangers in the world without adding needlessly to them by not having children vaccinated.

"Congenital rubella syndrome is one of the types of birth defects that we know how to prevent," write Scialli and colleagues.

They explain that "congenital rubella syndrome occurs when pregnant women are infected with the rubella (German measles) virus, and immunization with rubella vaccine in the prepregnancy years prevents it." Babies born with congenital rubella syndrome may have deafness, blindness, and congenital heart disease.

http://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20060407/rubellas-birth-defects-gone

This Oprah Winfrey everybody do their thing world ignores science and reality. We need to elect competent representatives. President Obama has shown that intelligence goes a long way to good governance, but good governance means collecting the revenues to cover expenses......so the Oligarchy who has convinced America with fear and innuendo that government is redistributing wealth, or policies of envy, rather than the reality that good government is objective and real........it is time for patriots to stand against this spreading epidemic from the Oprah Winfrey do your own thing to take control, to Pks nihilist views that all government is bad. We need to attack real problems and have our representatives working to solve real problems. If candidates cannot get science right, they sure as hell do not belong in elective office.

For the thousandth time... not all govt is bad. When it becomes bad is when it is not limited.

It's function to act as a fair and impartial arbiter is subverted and corrupted.

The ownership of children is a scary concept which gave a direct path into his perverse world. Was it a simple mistake of words.......I do not think it was, but rather it gives proof of what an empty suit Rand Paul really is. His knowledge can be summed up with one word.....sophistry.