Muhammad Ali dead at 74

Another piece of an ending era.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/dedb61d1ce6d4aac972f8e479992723c/muhammad-ali-who-riveted-world-greatest-dies

I have so many stories.   I adored this man at so many levels.  The best story starts with my wife right after we were married was trying to get into teaching and had taught a year as aide, and then she had a great opportunity in a high paying district, and I was working with the Borg Warner company, but then she got laid off the next year, but she got an opportunity to teach english at a great catholic junior high where she took a huge pay cut, but she was with a great group of young teachers.  We formed a dinner group where we rotated dinners monthly among eight couples.   One of the couples had a guy who delivered beer, but he also was a writer.

Jack had been a boxer and we hit it off because in grad school my roomate was a golden glove boxer and instructor at the university in boxing, and we would box in this old church.  Well Jack just decided that he was going to hop in the car and travel to Michigan where Ali was living along the lake in SouthWest Michigan because he was writing a book on Ali.  Ali was beginning to have the effects of his Parkinson, and was living with his daughters at the house.  Jack goes to the front door without calling and knocks on the door.   The daughter answers and Jack tells the daughter that I love your father and I am a big fan who wants to write a book on your dad.  Jack and his wife went to college in New Orleans, and right after school opened a bar and ran the same for about a decade.   He was a diminutive man who looked a lot like Paul Neuman except he was Irish and had wire blonde hair.  So this spunky crazy irishman was on Ali's doorstep unannounced where you would expect they would have politely told him to go to hell.  Nope.....she invited him in.

Ali was sitting on a couch and was beginning to have problems with his speech.   Jack made his introduction, and told him he was driving a beer truck, but he wanted to write a book about ali, and the man sat with his daughters and talked to Jack for three hours.   Jack and his wife Kathy had adopted three black kids and kathy took a lot of flack in 1980 when she would be shopping with the black kids as Bob would tell you that America was over racism, but it was bad the comments toward Kathy.   In any regard, Jack shared his photos of his kids, his New Orleans stories, and Ali with all the health problems just pulled Jack's leg, told stories, and had a twinkle in his eye.  Jack did one of those self publishing books and traveled to see him one more time, but Ali's gracious hosting of this crazy irishman was the core of the man.  A person who loved people, who was highly intelligent even though Parkinson had decimated his verbal skills, his mind was sharp.  He was more than the greatest fighter........he was a great man.

Ali originally was rejected for the draft because he failed the IQ test. Later, they lowered the IQ acceptance score and he was drafted. His intelligence was never a problem and the whole draft thing was an attack on what Ali represented. He was against war. He was all for a clean fight, but he wanted nothing to do with war where"kill kill kill" was the goal. Ali taking this stand was so important to this country, and his convictions were sincere. The hate toward this man and the way the media attacked this man's religion and beliefs makes you completely understand why a Donald Trump is where he is. Few people in your lifetime are real heroes, but in my lifetime Ali was that man.....float like a butterfly and sting like a bee.

RIP... One of my childhood through adulthood heros too. I lived and died over his fights.

RIP...

He wanted nothing to do with an organization which was killing people who had done nothing to him or America. It was not a matter of combat, it was a matter of principle. My brother pretty much failed in school and was hyperactive. When he was given the Iowa basic skills test he scored the highest in his third grade class, but he could not read, and he was out of control. Intelligence and the measuring of the same is not as easy as putting people in culturally biased boxes. He was an intelligent man.

2seaoat wrote:He wanted nothing to do with an organization which was killing people who had done nothing to him or America.  It was not a matter of combat, it was a matter of principle.  My brother pretty much failed in school and was hyperactive.  When he was given the Iowa basic skills test he scored the highest in his third grade class, but he could not read, and he was out of control.  Intelligence and the measuring of the same is not as easy as putting people in culturally biased boxes.   He was an intelligent man.

Bull Shit...Just another poser that chose not to serve....Like some others....

Ali a poser.......walking away from 2.5 million a fight in the seventies and having his ability to make a living striped away in 1867......he sounded like the real deal.....a man who stood his position despite the harm to himself. A poser takes the path of least resistance. What Ali did was courageous at so many levels because people hated him.....I heard when he made this decision that "Green Berets" was the number one hit in America. I doubt few here would have his courage and convictions.......I would have gone into the military....it would have been the path of least resistance, but I got the number 305 and nobody called me a poser. I remember the guy running for our ninth grade president got up and sang a variation of green berets......even at that age after being a total junkie as a kid on war movies I was beginning to have doubts as I was watching innocent folks being killed, by high school I had stuffed the gung ho kill people in other countries........and a large part of what made me change was the courage of Ali.......somebody who convictions and principles which started making people thing.....exactly what did a peasant farmer fighting french colonialism every do to me as a kid......nothing.....and it took ali to make kids start thinking.

If T was alive now he might disagree with you.....he argued too many listened to dip chit recruiters. I would agree. Exactly what did the fricking Vietnamese do to America? Poor kids sent into the meat grinder to kill other poor kids while those who were senator's sons had nobody calling them posers.

Do you think that Vietnam was the only game in town in 67? . If you think that a stooge managed by Don King and the Media that made the real money is some one you based your life decisions on, then I really dont have much to say

The path of least resistance......to spend five years in jail, or join the military......I would have joined the military.....it would have been an easy out. A felony, five years in jail, and not being able to do what I loved would have been too much for me......joining was an easy answer. If I was number 48 I would have gone because that would have been easier than taking a stand on my changing thoughts about Viet Nam. No the courageous ones stood their ground on their principles and most did not take the easy way......I did not have that courage......I would have gone or gotten a student deferment, but instead I got the number 305 and not a chance of being drafted.....so it was school and not war.

He was unable to work in the prime of his career while he was appealing the decision to put him in jail for five years......the Supreme Court agreed with him unanimously........courage is taking a stand despite the consequences......he probably would have served two years in boxing shorts going to bases for his service and then discharged as a hero, to pick up his career......no joining was the easy answer, and if more Americans had courage, perhaps this war machine we have created could have been dismantled fifty years ago......instead millions have died.

You made your choice. I made my choice. Ali made his choice. What is right for one many not fit all, but In 1966 I was winning NRA competition in scouting and wanted to be a sniper because I was good and wanted to kill the bad guys. My metalworking teacher in seventh grade was a reservist who had spent a year in Viet Nam and had all of us naive kids pumped up that the Vietnamese were monkey people who could live on a cup of rice a day and were threatening America.....I was young.....I had watched war movies.....I was gung ho......but by high school I was well read and watched the news. I realized shooting a target was different than shooting a man I had no conflict. You may think my remarks were snide, but I did not call you a poser, and I would defend your choice as I defended Ali. I just think his choice was courageous, and my wanting to go kill monkees siting in a tree being a sniper was a childish naive world view.....nothing more.....nothing less. Like I said if my number was 48, I would have done what you did.......it just would have been easier for me, and I could have gotten help on my schooling costs.

Hallmarkgard wrote:I never wanted to kill anyone and so far I haven’t.  I never thought it was cool to kill.  I dont hunt and sometimes have a hard time cleaning fish.  Big sissy, I guess.  

No sissy at all, but definitely my kind of guy.

http://danhornback.com/ultimatesacrificevietnam/ASAsite.htm

 Very proud of what I did. no regrets.  No Baby killers here

In seventh grade I was in fantasy land......I wanted to kill the bad guys.....I guess I just thought the vietnamese were like the Japanese and were hurting Americans.....I had teachers telling me they were monkees and a threat.....I swallowed the propaganda lock stock and barrel, and I was good with a rifle having been taken to gun clubs since I was five. In this childish fantasy, I was wanting to go out on my own and hunt humans......climb a tree and take out an officer from two hundred yards......childish fantasy......then I read, and realized I really had never killed anything with a gun that I did not eat afterwards.....so hunting people who never hurt me did not make sense......slowly I began to question, but sadly with my dad dying at 10, I had no guidance from my father and I was easily influenced by the surrogates who were in my life.....so my views matured, and I think I became a better man, but a silly ping pong ball never had me make a choice......so I have always been cautious when questioning others choice......because I was so wrong in my world view and I certainly lacked the courage to rock the boat and stand up against the tide at that point in my life, but by high school I began to take moral positions which were more thoughtful and courageous, but I made a lot of easy choices without the guidance of a father in my formative years......fortunately there were some good people who gave guidance, and scouting helped me understand duty and trying to do the right thing.....yet I was in scouts when I wanted to be a sniper......no right answer on this stuff, we just make our choices.