This gardening thing is such a complete mystery to me

I have a little piece of lawn out back. And it had gaps in it. So I bought this expensive little bottle of grass seed which has fertilizer and other stuff already mixed into it.
I put down that grass seed and I've watered it every day. And after about three
weeks, grass has started to grow in about 25% of the area I put it down on.

But day before yesterday I walked out back, and for the first time I noticed a patch of what looks like grass growing in a spot in total shade near the base of the magnolia tree. And by this morning it's almost an inch tall. And I never have added any water to this area.

I just couldn't figure out how in the world this stuff could have popped up and is growing so well.
And then it hit me. That's the exact spot I threw down some birdseed.

I paid $15 for a few ounces of what is sold as grass seed which has barely grown.

I paid $10 for a huge 10 lb bag of what is sold as birdseed.
And the birdseed is making a lot more grass than the grass seed.

I've now thrown down a bunch more birdseed and I'm now going to water it.
That birdseed should give me a whole lawn under the magnolia and they said nothing would grow under the magnolia.
You just can't make this shit up. lol

Have no clue about birdseed sprouting grass, but your grass seed could have floated over there with heavy watering or rain. Also most of your actual grass seed may have been eaten by the birds, they like it.

ppaca wrote:Have no clue about birdseed sprouting grass, but your grass seed could have floated over there with heavy watering or rain. Also most of your actual grass seed may have been eaten by the birds, they like it.

No it's actually the birdseed that started growing.  And it's mainly because the birds were too stupid to eat it.  A bird feeder is hanging right above it and I've watched the birds struggling to get food out of the feeder completely oblivious to the seed all over the ground under it.  lol

But at the same time I posted this thread,  I emailed it out to friends.  And one friend has already told me what's up.  He has a balcony pretty high up in the air.  And he is always piling birdseed onto the railing to attract the birds so he can see em outside a big window looking out on the balcony.
He says the birdseed falls down to the yard below and this stuff is growing three feet tall where the birdseed has landed.
He says the only question is whether or not mowing it will kill it off.  We'll see.

But as I think about it,  it may not be bird stupidity that's keeping the birds from eating the seed on the ground.
I spray this stuff all around my garden/patio to keep mosquitoes away.
Including the spot where the birdseed was thrown.
This may be keeping the birds from eating off the ground.  Dunno.

By the way,  if you have an outdoor patio or other outdoor space where you don't want mosquitoes,  this crap works like a charm.  
I spray it and the mosquitoes vanish for about two days (it says 8 weeks on the label but that's just bullshit).  But I get about 5 sprayings out of the $10 bottle so it's not expensive.

There are different grasses that grow best in shade/sun... I would imagine you had run off. You don't want to over water... just keep it from drying out during germination.

Geez Bob.....take that van to Carters about four blocks west of Avalon in MIlton and get some sod. Take about 10 rolls and water it and get some grass on that yard.

It's from the birdseed.

Get a Black Flag fogger.....it is propane operated. Fog the area for mosquitoes....it will keep them away for about 5 hours. As for the Magnolia tree you get great shade but...when the large leaves fall they hold water and breed mosquitoes. You have a real catch-22.

He needs to put some sod down and dress that balding back yard.

Have you considered gravel and cactus?

Joanimaroni wrote:It's from the birdseed.  

Get a Black Flag fogger.....it is propane operated. Fog the area for mosquitoes....it will keep them away for about 5 hours. As for the Magnolia tree you get great shade but...when the large leaves fall they hold water and breed mosquitoes.  You have a real catch-22.

I have a lot of standing water and this will be hard to explain unless you visted the property but under the circumstances it's just almost impossible to prevent it.  So I've tried every method and product known to man.  Including fog.  
The ONLY thing so far that keeps them ALL out for any length of time is whatever this hook to the garden hose spray is.  And it comes in a half dozen different brands,  the one pictured before is just one of them.

My whole garden patio sits slap under a huge magnolia tree.  And every person I have ever talked to has told me "I would never in a million years have a magnolia tree" because of the leaves and such.
As you know,  about the only ground cover that grows under a magnolia tree is dirt.  My solution to that is once a week rake the magnolia leaves under the tree into a pile.  And then use a lawnmower to mulch the pile. Whole thing takes about 15 minutes and it's the only exercise I ever get (lol).
But the ground under the tree is now covered with a layer of mulched leaves.  And believe it or not that's not a bad ground cover by itself.
I keep the layer of mulch thin. But even still I imagine it helps breed the darn mosquitoes. BUT the spray makes the mosquitoes disappear in my outdoor space whenever I need it to, so problem solved.

have a Magnolia Tree. We have tried to plant many types of flowers around the tree only to have them die. Is there a particular type of plant that we should be planting?

ANSWER:

You have discovered for yourself that magnolias are allelopathic to other plants.  This means that the magnolia produces chemicals that inhibit the germination of seeds and growth of plants that are potential competitors for its resources.  The roots and fallen debris (leaves, flowers, etc.) from the magnolia tree contain substances that limit the growth of other competing species that grow underneath it. In the case of magnolias, the substances are sesquiterpene lactones—costunolide and parthenolide—(see Abdelgalel, A. M. and F. Hasinaga.  2007. "Allelopathic potential of two sesquiterpene lactones from Magnolia grandiflora L." Biochemical Systematics and Ecology Vol. 35, no. 11, pp. 737-742.)  A complicating factor is that many plants won't grow in the dense shade created by the magnolia tree—or any other tree, for that matter.



Like walnut trees......your magnolia deters growth of other plants chemically.  However, I regularly get grass to grow under walnut trees, and if you sod every couple of years you will get a lawn at very little cost or work.....just water the heck out of the sod.

I first learned about that amazing phenomenon only a few months ago. About the Magnolia giving off magnolia cooties to suppress the growth of other plants so it can hog all the nutrients for itself, I mean.

My Magnolia tree is by far my most precious possession. Although I don't really really possess it, more like it possesses me.
And learning how clever it is was just icing on the cake to me because now I respect it even more.
For me this beautiful tree will always be enough all by itself, regardless of what's on the ground beneath it. I value it's life as much as I value the life of that lion who was murdered. Actually even more so because I didn't know the lion personally.

But having said that, If with all the Magnolia's cleverness, those lousy birdseeds can grow whatever these plants are and they can thrive underneath the magnolia, then I value whatever that stuff is too.
It's called survival of the fittest. Regardless if someone wants to call it a weed.
I'm a weird newbie gardener. I don't really understand the difference between weeds and plants. I just marvel at all of it.

Seriously Bob, get five or six rolls of sod at Carters in Milton.  It will last a couple of year and probably do pretty well if these are wet spots.  It is inexpensive and easy to install.  Get a large plastic heavy duty garbage bag and use the Prius and get only about six rolls of sod and soak it and see if it takes in about five months.

I completely believe everything you're telling me about the sod, seaoat, because I can sense that this is something you really do know about.
And I do sincerely appreciate your sharing this with me because I know you really are trying to help.
And I could end up using the sod. But right now there are two things about my garden experience that will make that have to wait.

One is that now I'm really fascinated by what's happened with this birdseed. I have to see what develops from that. Even if I plow the whole thing under after I do.

But there is one thing that trumps everything else with my garden and patio that everybody knows me will tell you.
The whole thing has been done "on the cheap". And by that I mean bought from yard sales. The patio itself, the patio tables and chairs, the patio umbrellas, the lawn ornaments, the chiminea, and last but not lest, ALL the plants.
And when I go to yard sales, I never like to pay more than what me and my partner call "the tax amount". And that means whatever the amount of the Florida sales tax was on the original retail purchase. In other words we like to by at no more than 7.5% of what the original buyer paid for it new.
So far I've been able to do that with everything in my patio/garden.
Part of the fun of it for me is not to spend any real money.
I know that doesn't go down well with everybody. But that's just how I do it. Been doing it too long to change now. lol

Hey Bob you don't have to apologize to anyone for the way you do it. I wish I could have been the one to scoop up that $500-$600 patio set you had for $25.00 damn nice. But only come and observe at my garage sale in a couple of months lol.

ppaca wrote:Hey Bob you don't have to apologize to anyone for the way you do it. I wish I could have been the one to scoop up that $500-$600 patio set you had for $25.00 damn nice. But only come and observe at my garage sale in a couple of months lol.

Now of course you know what the yard sale protocol is,  ppaca.
Whenever someone has a yard sale,  he always let's his friends have first shot at the offerings.  lol
But you're thinking smart to wait a couple months.  Summer for yard sales is like the off-season for a professional sport.  People do other things on Saturday mornings in the summer.  The only customers a yard sale gets now are what we in the biz call the "hounds".   Those are the dozen or so regular folk who buy at yard sales on friday and saturday morning and then flip it at the flea market on Saturday afternoon and Sunday.  And they pay even less than I do.  lol

I have never gone to a yard sale.....my daughter is addicted and is a hoarder.  I do not get it.  She has bought beautiful outfits for the girls, but I would rather go to the store and get something.....which is not common.  I just do not shop.  I will wear a pair of jeans until they wear out and shoes the same.  I have not bought a suit in five years and at one time was buying them two or three a year.......just do not care to go shopping, and probably need a new suit....don't care about bargains, but the wife is all happy about shopping at Kohls looking for a king size bed skirt.  They had one for forty bucks, but then she found a 90% off skirt, comforter, and coverings for pillows for forty bucks when it was $375.....she was like a puppy who had found a bone, now I get the wife, but the daughter will go to garage sales and get things which are a bargain and she has no need.....it piles up and she has a garage sale.....seems insane to me.

I don't want to mislead you or anyone on this.
That patio set purchase was what we call a grand slam homerun.
And grand slam homeruns for us are about as frequent as grand slam homeruns for Babe Ruth.  

I see lots and lots of patio furniture in sales all the time.  But most of it is either worn out or too expensive.
I don't want anyone to think that you can go out on any given saturday morning and buy everything you want for pennies on the dollar.  We go to many more sales where we buy nothing than the ones where we buy something.  And most every friend who has decided he/she wants to ride along with me to see what it's like has  burned out after the first time doing it because he and she has not come home with a treasure load of goodies they he and she was expecting.
It requires a whole lots of patience.  It aint like being able to go to the store any time you desire and pick it off the retail shelf.  More like going to the supermarket and finding all the shelves are empty,  going to the next supermarket and finding the same,  and going to even one more supermarket and experiencing that again.  And all the while having this feeling that you're wasting your time.
BUT,  then at the fourth supermarket, you find a couple of shelves with merchandise on them.  You might buy a few trinkets,  maybe not.
But ALWAYS after that sale,  you're asking yourself "what in the fuck am I doing out here riding around and burning gas when I coulda slept until 9 oclock".

And then maybe at the tenth sale (and we've actually kept records on this and that's an accurate ratio),  we hit a home run.  And that's when you find something you really want and you can buy it for 10c on the dollar.  Either to keep for yourself or for resale.

So that's a pretty good synopsis of how it works.  But my partner and I aren't just in it for that.  For us it's a sociology field trip.  We get to get up in the faces of just about every known personality type you can imagine.
And we get right inside their personal spaces.  It's when we get to poke around inside the homes is the best part of it.

This yard sale thing is now my hobby in retirement. Some men play golf on saturday morning, this is what I do.

But if you would like to get a glimpse into what I did for a living, an exact re-enactment of it was on television last night. It was an episode of American Pickers. They were at a place in Georgia to buy from an old amusement operator (those were the colorful old boys who operated the jukeboxes, pinballs and slot machines).

It was so spooky because the scene they were seeing (which as I look back on it now was pretty unbelievable both in real life and the tv show version) was an EXACT duplication of what me and my partner experienced 35 years ago. It was like the twilight zone because ALL the people they were dealing with AND everything those people were telling them was an EXACT duplicate of what we had experienced. It was uncanny. My partner saw it and called me and said the word "Lexington".
Before the phone rang I was just about to call him and say the word "Lexington".
It's pretty darn mindboggling to see an exact re-creation of something you did 35 years ago be shown on frigging television.

My wife and I used to have a table on Sat and Sun at Gulf Breeze Flea market back in 96 or 97 when it was still pretty nice. We joined SMC bought new stuff wholesale and resold some. We learned after a couple weeks this was only selling to tourist's, so we did start hitting all the garage sales weekly and selling those items at the flea market and made a little bit of money. We gave it up after a very hot summer and now that flea market has taken a dive. There is one chinese guy out there with 3 or 4 booths on one end and again at the other with all dollar products. Looks like he makes a killing last time I went out to look around. Also it looks like the ones with junk are doing well.

ppaca wrote: There is one chinese guy out there with 3 or 4 booths on one end and again at the other with all dollar products. Looks like he makes a killing

For quite a while there's been one Chinese guy at T&W who uses the space of about ten tables.  About a hundred feet of row after row of boxes of merchandise,  hundreds and hundreds of individual items.
And for at least the last year or so a SECOND Chinese seller is there with the same amount and type of merchandise.

There is a huge wholesale flea market in central florida at Webster (It's called the Webster Market).  This is the first stop for the stuff off the boats.   When I was there two years ago I had to rub my eyes.  It was acres of flea market sheds selling hundreds of thousands of cases of the stuff.
This is where ALL the peddlers (like those flea market sellers) and a whole lot of retailers get the stuff.

And President Bill Clinton told us "this (China Trade Deal) will create a one-way path of trade FROM the United States TO China".

But I've talked to many people who've been to the Port of Houston and seen something that looks like a scene out of a science fiction movie the way they tell it.  
It's the thousands of shipping containers coming in with the stuff.
But no one yet has seen any shipping containers destined for China.  lol

p.s.  but it wasn't a Clinton Trade Deal.  It was a Clinton And The Republicans Trade Deal.

Getting back to to the seeds Bob used allow me to chime in . . . . . . we have a place near LBL on Lake Barkley in western Ky and both my wife and I absolutely love the variety of birds there sooooooo we bought mucho bird seed . . . . . . . goodness gracious we had at least 15 varieties (species) but then . . . . . . . . . . . . . chipmunks showed up! These are the most destructive little rascals so I investigated exterminations methodology and discovered that the bird seed contains sunflower seeds . . . . . a chipmunk favorite. Now we have a growing population of chipmunks so I adopted a cat . . . . . problem solved . . . . . chipmunks will abandon an area where there are owls or cats!

This is the $95 garden patio.  In the photo you will see a line between the existing concrete (gray) patio,  and the white marbleized patio tiles of the new patio.  The $95 refers to everything you see in front of that line.

The patio stones:  $20
The patio table with six chairs and two matching recliners:  $25
The patio umbrella and stainless steel pole:  $5
The two patio chairs closest to the camera:  $10 for both
All the plants,  earthboxes,  plant stands and other stuff:  $35

Total:  $95



p.s.  here's the rye grass growing from bird seed.  The part circled in red was thrown down 2 weeks ago.  It didn't start to sprout for a week because I didn't water it (didn't know bird seed would make grass lol).
But the part circled in yellow was thrown down 3 days ago.  And since I've been watering it,  it's already a half inch tall.
So I went to Walmart this morning and bought a huge 20 lb sack of bird seed for ten bucks.  I'm just gonna cover all the dirt under the big Magnolia Tree with it.  It grows anywhere.
AND,  I've mowed one spot that got up to a couple inches tall already and the mowing has not hurt it a bit.