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Pensacola Discussion Forum » General Discussion » German wings Airbus plane down in France

German wings Airbus plane down in France

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Floridatexan
Sal
2seaoat
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2seaoat



150 people aboard.  Pilot radioed distress call.......crashes in Southern France
No survivors

2seaoat



Talking heads are idiots. After an air crash they start just spewing unadulterated chit to out do the other so called expert who is speculating without any information. On morning Joe one expert starts talking about the code which was sent to indicate distress and then began to talk about how this was not a terrorist distress call because..........and the other so called expert barks out......do not give out the code on the air......do not give out the code on the air......and the other expert who actually was making an excellent point just gave a stunned look into the camera.

So I decided to become an expert. I went to google and got this information:

To communicate to air traffic control that an aircraft is being hijacked, a pilot under duress should squawk 7500 or vocally, by radio communication, transmit "(Aircraft callsign); Transponder seven five zero zero."

What fricking idiots and this drivel of speculation and air of knowledge about a particular air disaster is borderline insane.

2seaoat



One expert just said something which made the most sense I have heard in years.........most of these planes which are lost recently are completely computer controlled. There is not manual override. His point which he says is bothering him is that NOBODY is talking about a simple computer hack of these planes.

A person has an app on their phone which has discovered a weakness in the plane computer system........if that app can get on the plane network, why would anybody hijack a plane with boxcutters? They suddenly took this expert off and all the traditional talking heads completely ignored what he just raised.........a trillion dollar air fleet is in the air with computer controlled air planes, and we are certain there are no vulnerabilities to somebody unauthorized accessing that network.......people hacking a network......impossible and change the subject.

2seaoat



Going on three hours of talking heads spewing absolutely NOTHING.....I do not dare turn on CNN because they will spew nothing for weeks, building an airplane cockpit set, and having someone sit in the same.......over and over saying nothing....no facts would make most real news shows switch to news where there are facts and analysis. Hard work journalism is fricking gone.......fill the air with balloon head analyst who say nothing has taken the place of gathering facts, and reporting real news. Did everything in the world just stop, and no news is out there, or is it so much easier to call this breaking news and fill the screen with nothing waiting for real facts and news.

Sal

Sal

I'm so sick of you eggheads with your need for "facts" and "evidence" before spewing out a "theory".

It had to be Putin.

That guy's a dick.

2seaoat



I think one of the talking heads talked about Putin early on, but being it is winter and horses ridden by shirtless men in the rugged Alps terrain is unlikely, it appears the baby ruth theory that a peanut from a baby ruth may have locked up the auto pilot was immediately the frontrunner on unabashed pure speculation. One talking head was enraged that it was known generally that pilots do not eat peanuts on planes for fear of an allergic reaction which could cause a crash........light bulbs appeared above all the talking heads simultaneously......providing more wattage than has been generated in the last three hours.

2seaoat



Tom Costello of NBC is an obnoxious idiot.....he is non stop spewing of nothing all morning, and now some actual facts are being reported and he just cannot stay on task.....stay with the facts without just spewing speculation.

Floridatexan

Floridatexan

Google:  problem with airbus computer controls...try this:

http://www.fastcodesign.com/1669720/how-lousy-cockpit-design-crashed-an-airbus-killing-228-people

Markle

Markle

2seaoat wrote:150 people aboard.  Pilot radioed distress call.......crashes in Southern France
No survivors

No distress call. Early information about such events are notoriously inaccurate.

It is now thought that a "distress" call may have been put out by an air traffic controller when they observed the flight path and were unable to contact the plane.

Hard to conceive the horror of the people on board as it descended at a sharp decline for eight minutes.

2seaoat



Hard to conceive the horror of the people on board as it descended at a sharp decline for eight minutes.


Agree, unless it was a Payne Stewart type failure where there was massive loss of pressure and they ALL lost consciousness. Air travel is still very safe compared to other options, but accidents seldom turn out as well as Sully landing on the Hudson.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

What we now know about this mystery.

The Captain exited the cockpit.  When he attempted to re-enter the cockpit,  he found the cockpit door was locked from the inside.  He desperately tried to get the First Officer to unlock the cockpit door but was unable to.

Shortly after the aircraft reached cruising altitude,  the plane then began a steady ten minute long descent until it hit the ground.

The First Officer has not yet been identified,  but we do now know that he had less than 700 hours total flight time since his training.

As of a few minutes ago,  the German prosecutor's office has confirmed that only one of the two pilots (presumably the First Officer) was in the cockpit when the plane hit the ground.

Anything more than that is speculation as of now.  
The speculation at this point leads to three possible scenarios...

1.  The First Officer intentionally locked out the Captain and flew the plane into the ground.

2.  Some combination of bizarre mechanical failures explain both the door locked from the inside and the unintentional descent to the ground.

3.  After the Captain exited the cockpit,  the First Officer became ill and imobilized and was unable to unlock the door or control the plane.

The speed of the impact made the crash be so violent that it damaged the cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder (the other black box) has not yet been found.  However,  some voice data has been salvaged from the voice recorder and that's why we know the pilot was banging on the door in attempt to re-enter.



Last edited by Bob on 3/26/2015, 8:10 am; edited 2 times in total

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

An interesting issue has been raised by all this.

After 9/11, the decision was made by the authorities and airline officials to secure the cockpit door in a way that it could only be unlocked from the inside.
At the time, some proposed that a preferable method would be to have one member of the cabin crew be given capacity to unlock the cockpit door in an emergency.
But, that plan was not implemented for fear that it may not prevent a hijacking because even that one cabin attendant could be compromised by attempted hijackers.

So that decision now comes into question. If in this case a cabin attendant had the capacity to unlock the door, the pilot would have been able to re-enter the cockpit and maybe have prevented the crash from happening.

Sal

Sal

Seems like the protocol should be that there should be at least two people in the cockpit at all times.

That'a way if one keels over, someone else would be there to unlock the door.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Sal wrote:Seems like the protocol should be that there should be at least two people in the cockpit at all times.

That'a way if one keels over, someone else would be there to unlock the door.

I've been watching CNN since I woke up. CNN is now the AIRLINER CRASH CHANNEL for these things.
I do recall during one of this morning's discussions that one aviation expert mentioned that it is protocol (maybe only in the U.S. not sure) that whenever only one pilot is in the cockpit that a flight attendant be in there at the same time. But exactly what this entails was not clear to me because my attention deficit disorder wasn't paying full attention to that.

Sal

Sal

They're now saying the copilot "intentionally" crashed the plane, whatever that means.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Sal wrote:They're now saying the copilot "intentionally" crashed the plane, whatever that means.

That's because the French (not German as I stated before) prosecutor involved is now implying that is the case. He has seen the evidence available to him now and he seems confident that the co-pilot "pushed a button" to intentionally put the aircraft into the descent.

But it's still early and not enough is known, especially about the co-pilot, to be able to come to this conclusion yet. Right now it remains a mystery.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

By the way,  Sal,  moments ago on CNN an aviation expert stated it is the policy for U.S. carriers to have a another crew member in the cockpit whenever a pilot is absent.  But it's not the routine for overseas carriers.  And he added that he believes as a result of what has happened,  the overseas carriers will now adopt this policy too.  In fact he said he expects that policy change to be made "in the next few days".

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

I should add that the reason I watch CNN for this sort of thing is because I know if I switch to Fox News they'll be blaming Obama and the democrats for the plane crash and if I switch to MSNBC they'll be blaming Bush and republicans for it. And I just really don't want to hear that bullshit any longer.

ZVUGKTUBM

ZVUGKTUBM

A 28 year old German National with a German sounding name (i.e., not Muslim or eastern European). He had about 100 hours in A320s. Not much experience at all, really. I guess that is enough to know how to override the flight control system and enter an intentional fatal crash dive.

I am sure they will eventually dig up the dirt on this nut. We just need to allow the investigation to unfold and not jump to conclusions.

http://www.best-electric-barbecue-grills.com

Joanimaroni

Joanimaroni

ZVUGKTUBM wrote:A 28 year old German National with a German sounding name (i.e., not Muslim or eastern European). He had about 100 hours in A320s. Not much experience at all, really. I guess that is enough to know how to override the flight control system and enter an intentional fatal crash dive.i

I am sure they will eventually dig up the dirt on this nut. We just need to allow the investigation to unfold and not jump to conclusions.

The jackass knew enough to lock the door.

Sal

Sal

Joanimaroni wrote:
ZVUGKTUBM wrote:A 28 year old German National with a German sounding name (i.e., not Muslim or eastern European). He had about 100 hours in A320s. Not much experience at all, really. I guess that is enough to know how to override the flight control system and enter an intentional fatal crash dive.i

I am sure they will eventually dig up the dirt on this nut. We just need to allow the investigation to unfold and not jump to conclusions.

The jackass knew enough to lock the door.

I believe the door locks automatically.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

Sal wrote:
I believe the door locks automatically.

It now looks like the cabin door lock is a little more sophisticated than that.

This page will explain every aspect of how it works in all situations.
Pay particular attention to this part...


Access to the pilots in emergency situations

If necessary, cabin crew can activate a special code to gain access to the cockpit.
In 2002 - one year after the terrorist hijackings - Airbus released a video explaining how the new cockpit doors work.

...there can be situations in which the door has to be opened by cabin personnel - for instance, if they have to administer first aid to a pilot. This could arise in the event of gas poisoning, rendering both pilots unconscious.

But there can be situations in which the door has to be opened by cabin personnel - for instance, if they have to administer first aid to a pilot. This could arise in the event of gas poisoning, rendering both pilots unconscious.

The cabin crew has an access code for such emergency situations.

Entering the code triggers an alarm in the cockpit and the word "open" appears in bright letters next to the door switch.

If the pilots don't react within 30 seconds, the door opens automatically, giving crew five seconds to get inside, and then administer first aid.

If the pilots suspect they are being hijacked and want to prevent anyone from getting inside the cockpit, they can still activate the "lock" position.

This would bolt the door irrevocably for five minutes, according to the 2002 Airbus video.

Aviation expert Tim van Beveren told DW this period has been extended to 20 minutes. The lockout scenario applies, for instance, if terrorists have forced cabin crew to give them the access code.

There is another scenario in which the door opens without the pilot's involvement: if a sensor in the cabin ceiling registers a loss of pressure in the cockpit.

But even then the same rule applies: if the door is switched to lock mode, it remains locked for twenty minutes.

http://www.dw.de/how-does-a-cockpit-door-work/a-18343317

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

So far no one has found anything in this co-pilot's background or personality to give any indication of a motive for murdering 150 people.  They can't even find any indication that he was a potential suicide.

If they don't find anything else,  then we now have the first mass murderer who did it without any indication of mental problems or motive.
That is pretty scary to me.  Because if that's the case,  then we're now living in a world that is so fucked up that people commit mass murder when there is no reason or other explanation for their doing so.  And that has to make us wonder how many others are capable of the same thing.

Sal

Sal

Bob wrote:So far no one has found anything in this co-pilot's background or personality to give any indication of a motive for murdering 150 people.  They can't even find any indication that he was a potential suicide.

If they don't find anything else,  then we now have the first mass murderer who did it without any indication of mental problems or motive.
That is pretty scary to me.  Because if that's the case,  then we're now living in a world that is so fucked up that people commit mass murder when there is no reason or other explanation for their doing so.  And that has to make us wonder how many others are capable of the same thing.

Despite this incident, it's probably still pretty statistically unlikely that you'll be on board a plane that is deliberately crashed in a mountain in the French Alps, Bob.

Better stay in Pcola just to play it safe tho.

Hospital Bob

Hospital Bob

"I'm just speechless. I don't have any explanation for this. Knowing Andreas, this is just inconceivable for me," said Peter Ruecker, a long-time member of the local flight club where Lubitz received his flying license years ago.

"He was a lot of fun, even though he was perhaps sometimes a bit quiet. He was just another boy like so many others here."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/26/us-france-crash-idUSKBN0MK2U020150326

It's just bizarre.

But right now the German cops are searching his home for clues. I really hope they find something to point to some explanation for this.

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