Pregnant nurse fired after refusing flu shot due to miscarriage fears

A pregnant Pennsylvania nurse has been fired from her job with a health care company after she refused to get a flu shot because she was afraid of miscarrying.

Dreonna Breton was terminated from her job at Horizons Healthcare Services Dec. 17 after she did not comply with a company mandate that requires all employees to receive the influenza vaccine.

The 29-year-old tells WGAL she has suffered two miscarriages this year, and was worried the vaccine may not be safe for pregnant women.

Breton, who also has a toddler son, says she offered to wear a mask at work as a possible alternative solution

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/29/pregnant-nurse-fired-after-refusing-flu-shot-due-to-miscarriage-fears/

Do you think she should have been fired?

Chrissy wrote:A pregnant Pennsylvania nurse has been fired from her job with a health care company after she refused to get a flu shot because she was afraid of miscarrying.

Dreonna Breton was terminated from her job at Horizons Healthcare Services Dec. 17 after she did not comply with a company mandate that requires all employees to receive the influenza vaccine.

The 29-year-old tells WGAL she has suffered two miscarriages this year, and was worried the vaccine may not be safe for pregnant women.

Breton, who also has a toddler son, says she offered to wear a mask at work as a possible alternative solution

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/29/pregnant-nurse-fired-after-refusing-flu-shot-due-to-miscarriage-fears/

Do you think she should have been fired?

Well, I don't know. If they want everyone to be vaccinated so the patients don't get sick, then she either needs to get the shot or not work there anymore. I think the decision belonged to her: take a chance on harming the baby or quit. The choices aren't always easy, but that's just how life goes.

So yes, she should have been fired.

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

It has been proven, and of course it does not cover all variants. It just gives people a much higher probability of survival. Do your procedures in the lab use the methods which prove the lowest probability of results, or do you try to achieve the highest probability of results?

All across this nation health care providers have been requiring flu shots because the most knowledgeable folks who have to be healthy on a pandemic are protecting their patients. On the 21st floor of Northwestern where the most vulnerable folks gather every day, the health care workers often are wearing masks because they have the sniffles, and any probability improvement which lowers the risk to patients is a good thing. A person in the employ of a healthcare provider who does not want to do a good thing because of personal beliefs has a choice. Quit or get the shot.

2seaoat wrote:the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

It has been proven, and of course it does not cover all variants.  It just gives people a much higher probability of survival.  Do your procedures in the lab use the methods which prove the lowest probability of results, or do you try to achieve the highest probability of results?

All across this nation health care providers have been requiring flu shots because the most knowledgeable folks who have to be healthy on a pandemic are protecting their patients.  On the 21st floor of Northwestern where the most vulnerable folks gather every day, the health care workers often are wearing masks because they have the sniffles, and any probability improvement which lowers the risk to patients is a good thing.   A person in the employ of a healthcare provider who does not want to do a good thing because of personal beliefs has a choice.  Quit or get the shot.

Agree completely . . . . a no-brainer to me!

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law). One can follow the rules or work somewhere else. I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

Of course they are okay with it . They are obedient little sheeple.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/02/04/zinc-garlic-vitamin-d.aspx

I wonder if she could have taken the nasal variety instead of the shot...seems safer. I've only had one flu shot in my life...got sick from it, but the symptoms were mild. I've had the flu twice that I can remember...once when I was 12...made the doctor & my mother chase me around the examining room to give me a shot of penicillin...then I passed out cold. A few years ago, I had it again, along with my daughter and her boyfriend...gave everyone a dose of apple cider vinegar in water because it was persisting and everyone was so miserable. Literally within hours everyone was significantly better.

Handwashing can go a long way toward prevention...that and a strong immune system. Dr. Mercola recommends garlic, zinc, Vitamin D, and chicken soup.

Flu vaccines, which are intended to help the body fight off the respiratory illness caused by the influenza virus, generally are made by injecting the virus into hen eggs. After being incubated for about three days to allow the virus to grow, the virus is removed from the egg white and processed to kill the majority of the virus and extract only the virus’s outer proteins, known as antigens. When these antigens are injected into the human body, the body's immune system develops antibodies — proteins that fight off the influenza virus. In 2013, the first flu vaccine harvested from insect cells was approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Rather than being harvested from hen eggs, insect viruses are re-engineered to create the same influenza antigens that cause the body to develop antibodies.

  

Chrissy wrote:Flu vaccines, which are intended to help the body fight off the respiratory illness caused by the influenza virus, generally are made by injecting the virus into hen eggs. After being incubated for about three days to allow the virus to grow, the virus is removed from the egg white and processed to kill the majority of the virus and extract only the virus’s outer proteins, known as antigens. When these antigens are injected into the human body, the body's immune system develops antibodies — proteins that fight off the influenza virus. In 2013, the first flu vaccine harvested from insect cells was approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Rather than being harvested from hen eggs, insect viruses are re-engineered to create the same influenza antigens that cause the body to develop antibodies.

  

Can folks that are allergic to eggs be administered the flu shot?

Ghost Rider wrote:

Chrissy wrote:Flu vaccines, which are intended to help the body fight off the respiratory illness caused by the influenza virus, generally are made by injecting the virus into hen eggs. After being incubated for about three days to allow the virus to grow, the virus is removed from the egg white and processed to kill the majority of the virus and extract only the virus’s outer proteins, known as antigens. When these antigens are injected into the human body, the body's immune system develops antibodies — proteins that fight off the influenza virus. In 2013, the first flu vaccine harvested from insect cells was approved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Rather than being harvested from hen eggs, insect viruses are re-engineered to create the same influenza antigens that cause the body to develop antibodies.

  

Can folks that are allergic to eggs be administered the flu shot?

It is my understanding that this year they introduced a flu shot that is not egg based. In the past I could not take it, due to my egg allergy.

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere. The employer cannot force anyone to do anything. However, they can make compliance a condition of employment. The choice is the employee's. Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law). If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere.  The employer cannot force anyone to do anything.  However, they can make compliance a condition of employment.  The choice is the employee's.  Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law).  If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.  

I think that's the real question here. Can private businesses make you put something in your body that could possibly kill you or harm you and if you don't discriminate against you for employment, or in this case fire you.

You are aware that some people have DIED taking these things and many others are messed up for life?

The science isnt very good on these.

Ill be the first to tell you I do not have a problem with ALL vaccines, you need to know that. I have taken the hep b vaccine to work in hospitals. and of course im up to date on all my other vaccines.

but I don't ever take the flu shot. fortunately in my position we were always given the option to opt out because we don't have direct patient contact or I would have been facing this scenario.

does a company have the right to ask you to take a chance with your life or your unborn child's life in order to stay employed? I personally think its a violation of her civil liberties.

Medical service engineering and maintenance is going to various kiosk systems where you have to have a clearance code to be allowed in to work on the systems. Because patients are brought in and out constantly in the adjoining rooms they were starting to require numerous shots along with background checks and all other manner of invasion to receive your code. I had intended to work until I was 70 but I refuse to be forced to take a vaccine just to be allowed employment...so being of sound mind I retired and the rest is me having fun....

 

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere.  The employer cannot force anyone to do anything.  However, they can make compliance a condition of employment.  The choice is the employee's.  Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law).  If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.  

I think that's the real question here. Can private businesses make you put something in your body that could possibly kill you or harm you and if you don't discriminate against you for employment, or in this case fire you.

You are aware that some people have DIED taking these things and many others are messed up for life?

The science isnt very good on these.

Ill be the first to tell you I do not have a problem with ALL vaccines, you need to know that. I have taken the hep b vaccine to work in hospitals. and of course im up to date on all my other vaccines.

but I don't ever take the flu shot. fortunately in my position we were always given the option to opt out because we don't have direct patient contact or I would have been facing this scenario.

does a company have the right to ask you to take a chance with your life or your unborn child's life in order to stay employed? I personally think its a violation of her civil liberties.

I am not for or against all vaccines either. I would not get the flu vaccine unless I was in a high risk group. I would not take any shot against my will. If I was this nurse, I would not have taken the shot to keep my job. The situation is not a good one, but it is just my personal opinion that a private employer can make their own rules. I don't think a business has a duty to anyone, other than its shareholders.

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere.  The employer cannot force anyone to do anything.  However, they can make compliance a condition of employment.  The choice is the employee's.  Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law).  If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.  

I think that's the real question here. Can private businesses make you put something in your body that could possibly kill you or harm you and if you don't discriminate against you for employment, or in this case fire you.

You are aware that some people have DIED taking these things and many others are messed up for life?

The science isnt very good on these.

Ill be the first to tell you I do not have a problem with ALL vaccines, you need to know that. I have taken the hep b vaccine to work in hospitals. and of course im up to date on all my other vaccines.

but I don't ever take the flu shot. fortunately in my position we were always given the option to opt out because we don't have direct patient contact or I would have been facing this scenario.

does a company have the right to ask you to take a chance with your life or your unborn child's life in order to stay employed? I personally think its a violation of her civil liberties.

I am not for or against all vaccines either.  I would not get the flu vaccine unless I was in a high risk group.  I would not take any shot against my will.  If I was this nurse, I would not have taken the shot to keep my job.  The situation is not a good one, but it is just my personal opinion that a private employer can make their own rules.  I don't think a business has a duty to anyone, other than its shareholders.  

I kind of gathered early on in our conversation that you were leaning towards the idea of a business should be able to make any decisions they want in regards to their business. and I agree with you on a level, which is why I framed my debate around that.

If I may engage you further. Isnt or shouldn't there be a limit as to what a business should be allowed to ask of their employees? I mean there are already many laws on the books such as cant ask your employees to work over time without pay, you cant require them to have sex with you or else your fired. I could go on. But basically Im putting forth the argument that asking someone to put something in their body that has the potential to kill them is just as serious as any of the situations above and deserves protection?

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere.  The employer cannot force anyone to do anything.  However, they can make compliance a condition of employment.  The choice is the employee's.  Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law).  If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.  

I think that's the real question here. Can private businesses make you put something in your body that could possibly kill you or harm you and if you don't discriminate against you for employment, or in this case fire you.

You are aware that some people have DIED taking these things and many others are messed up for life?

The science isnt very good on these.

Ill be the first to tell you I do not have a problem with ALL vaccines, you need to know that. I have taken the hep b vaccine to work in hospitals. and of course im up to date on all my other vaccines.

but I don't ever take the flu shot. fortunately in my position we were always given the option to opt out because we don't have direct patient contact or I would have been facing this scenario.

does a company have the right to ask you to take a chance with your life or your unborn child's life in order to stay employed? I personally think its a violation of her civil liberties.

I am not for or against all vaccines either.  I would not get the flu vaccine unless I was in a high risk group.  I would not take any shot against my will.  If I was this nurse, I would not have taken the shot to keep my job.  The situation is not a good one, but it is just my personal opinion that a private employer can make their own rules.  I don't think a business has a duty to anyone, other than its shareholders.  

I kind of gathered early on in our conversation that you were leaning towards the idea of a business should be able to make any decisions they want in regards to their business. and I agree with you on a level, which is why I framed my debate around that.

If I may engage you further. Isnt or shouldn't there be a limit as to what a business should be allowed to ask of their employees? I mean there are already many laws on the books such as cant ask your employees to work over time without pay, you cant require them to have sex with you or else your fired. I could go on. But basically Im putting forth the argument that asking someone to put something in their body that has the potential to kill them is just as serious as any of the situations above and deserves protection?

I understand what you are saying. However, with something like the flu vaccine -- there is evidence for and against it. So who gets to decide, the employee or the employer? As much as the employee says it is unsafe, the employer says it is unsafe for the patients if the employee is not vaccinated. If it were something clear cut, I might agree with with you, but I tend to be on the side that the business owner should be able to do what it wants with its business.

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:

Chrissy wrote:

QueenOfHearts wrote:So yes, she should have been fired.

so your stance is that every healthcare professional should have a unproven and sometimes deadly vaccine pushed on them why?

Healthcare professionals have been protecting the patients from multitudes of things by using universal precautions. and before you say thats not perfect, guess what, the vaccine is not proven and NEVER protects against all the variants either.

No, my stance is that a private employer can set their own rules (within the law).  One can follow the rules or work somewhere else.  I do not believe that one has a "right" to a job.

So is it "legal" for convientant stores to make thier employees have the vaccine or they get fired? They come in contact with people. How about food servers who prepare your food?

Do you draw the line somehwere or is it ok for private companies to force you to inject something into your person in order to be employeed. something such as in this case is not proven effective no matter what seaoat says. he doesnt know what he is talking about, but yet likes to talk a lot.

Maybe next youre employer wants to inject you with a rfid or you get fired. Are you ok with that too?

No, I do not draw the line anywhere.  The employer cannot force anyone to do anything.  However, they can make compliance a condition of employment.  The choice is the employee's.  Private businesses can make their own rules (again, within the law).  If I was faced with a similar situation, I would know I either have to comply or resign.  

I think that's the real question here. Can private businesses make you put something in your body that could possibly kill you or harm you and if you don't discriminate against you for employment, or in this case fire you.

You are aware that some people have DIED taking these things and many others are messed up for life?

The science isnt very good on these.

Ill be the first to tell you I do not have a problem with ALL vaccines, you need to know that. I have taken the hep b vaccine to work in hospitals. and of course im up to date on all my other vaccines.

but I don't ever take the flu shot. fortunately in my position we were always given the option to opt out because we don't have direct patient contact or I would have been facing this scenario.

does a company have the right to ask you to take a chance with your life or your unborn child's life in order to stay employed? I personally think its a violation of her civil liberties.

I am not for or against all vaccines either.  I would not get the flu vaccine unless I was in a high risk group.  I would not take any shot against my will.  If I was this nurse, I would not have taken the shot to keep my job.  The situation is not a good one, but it is just my personal opinion that a private employer can make their own rules.  I don't think a business has a duty to anyone, other than its shareholders.  

I kind of gathered early on in our conversation that you were leaning towards the idea of a business should be able to make any decisions they want in regards to their business. and I agree with you on a level, which is why I framed my debate around that.

If I may engage you further. Isnt or shouldn't there be a limit as to what a business should be allowed to ask of their employees? I mean there are already many laws on the books such as cant ask your employees to work over time without pay, you cant require them to have sex with you or else your fired. I could go on. But basically Im putting forth the argument that asking someone to put something in their body that has the potential to kill them is just as serious as any of the situations above and deserves protection?

I understand what you are saying.  However, with something like the flu vaccine -- there is evidence for and against it.  So who gets to decide, the employee or the employer?  As much as the employee says it is unsafe, the employer says it is unsafe for the patients if the employee is not vaccinated.  If it were something clear cut, I might agree with with you, but I tend to be on the side that the business owner should be able to do what it wants with its business.

how clear cut is people have died or become paralyzed from taking it?

how about that your employer cant say it would help or not for a fact because no one knows the strain variants ahead of time to make the vaccine accurate.

and no, a business owner does not get cart blanch at what he can require folks to do to work for him/her or else sex for pay would be legal. or slavery for that matter. there are limits and rightly so as there should be.

Im off to work.

good day