I got to looking at this thread and noticed my OP was pretty lengthy/wordy.. So I edited it for brevity (just like my HS English teacher old Mrs Horton taught me) ...... and I think I improved it in the process).
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With his memo, House Intelligence Committee Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) botched for a second time (remember the unmasking scandal) an attempt to discredit the intelligence community to protect President Trump in the Russia investigation. For a second time he resorted to a specious and factually defective non-scandal, hoping to play to the Trump cultists and their state TV channel, Fox News. Nunes is exceedingly terrible at this game. For example:
He managed to prove the dossier was not the basis of the Russia investigation; George Papadopoulos was.
He underscored that one couldn’t possibly “spy” on the Trump campaign by getting a FISA warrant, which was kept secret during the campaign, on Carter Page — who already had left the campaign at the time the warrant was sought.
He did not attempt to tie the FISA warrant to special counsel Robert S. Mueller III or to explain how the FISA court approved the warrant and its three extensions (which required a showing of progress in the investigation).
He misstated former director James B. Comey’s remarks about the dossier.
According to The Post’s reporting, his suggestion that the political nature of the dossier was withheld from the court — the central allegation in the memo — was false. (“The court that approved surveillance of a former campaign adviser to President Trump was aware that some of the information underpinning the warrant request was paid for by a political entity, although the application did not specifically name the Democratic National Committee or the Hillary Clinton presidential campaign, according to two U.S. officials familiar with the matter. … [I]ts central allegation — that the government failed to disclose a source’s political bias — is baseless, the officials said.”)
He never tried to prove the dossier was false or that Christopher Steele knew Fusion GPS was paid by the DNC (after it was originally engaged by the conservative Washington Free Beacon).
He underscored that at four different points, the FISA court thought there was probable cause to conduct surveillance of Page, thereby establishing that a suspected Russian agent had in fact worked on the campaign
.
Nunes’s memo was so flimsy that even White House Chief of Staff John F. Kelly told Trump it was a bust. The Post reports that Kelly told Trump that “the document was not as compelling as some of its advocates had promised Trump.” Oops.
House Oversight Committee Chairman Trey Gowdy (R-S.C.) — who spent endless time on the Benghazi investigation — was the only one on the Intelligence Committee to see the underlying intelligence. He gave Nunes’s effort a failing grade. “As I have said repeatedly, I also remain 100 percent confident in Special Counsel Robert Mueller,” he tweeted. “The contents of this memo do not – in any way – discredit his investigation.” Oh.
zsomething wrote:It's been pretty funny watching the conservative propaganda units trying to pretend their damp firecracker was Hiroshima. They oversold a bunch of poorly-fabricated nothing and instead of it "making Watergate look like stealing a Snickers bar," it makes them all look like a bunch of hysterical loons who don't understand very basic things. Which, of course, is exactly what they are.
At some point they're going to figure out that Hannity is a dimwit who makes them look stupid, but so far they're resisting learning that as hard as they can. Trump is believing every damn thing FOX News tells him, because he's addicted to flattery.
What we're really seeing now is idiots who were raised on talk radio and FOX News propaganda reaching an age where they hold office now, so we have misinformed ideologues running the government... and it's not working out well. These are people who've fostered the belief that they can build bubbles where the only real facts are the ones that support them, and the truth that works against them is safe to dismiss as "fake." It's a cultish, faith-based mindset, but because there's plenty of propaganda outlets to help them support it, they've never had to challenge their own thinking. They're married to it now.
And because of his weakness for flattery, and because he's not very smart to begin with, Trump is getting all of his "intel" from FOX News, and disregarding his actual intelligence sources because they're not telling him what he wants to hear. So he's going to keep screwing up. It may fool his base, but his base were always fooled anyway. The rest of the country, and the world, aren't going to be nearly so accommodating.
PkrBum wrote:If any part of Hillary's opposition research from Russia was used in front of the fisa court with it's only verification being Steele's Yahoo interview as purported... the entire process was "wrong". No one would want that constituting adequate legal burden... unless suffering from trump derangement syndrome.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/probable_cause wrote:Although the Fourth Amendment states that "no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause", it does not specify what "probable cause" actually means. The Supreme Court has attempted to clarify the meaning of the term on several occasions, while recognizing that probable cause is a concept that is imprecise, fluid and very dependent on context. In Illinois v. Gates, the Court favored a flexible approach, viewing probable cause as a "practical, non-technical" standard that calls upon the "factual and practical considerations of everyday life on which reasonable and prudent men [...] act".1 Courts often adopt a broader, more flexible view of probable cause when the alleged offenses are serious.
EmeraldGhost wrote:zsomething wrote:It's been pretty funny watching the conservative propaganda units trying to pretend their damp firecracker was Hiroshima. They oversold a bunch of poorly-fabricated nothing and instead of it "making Watergate look like stealing a Snickers bar," it makes them all look like a bunch of hysterical loons who don't understand very basic things. Which, of course, is exactly what they are.
At some point they're going to figure out that Hannity is a dimwit who makes them look stupid, but so far they're resisting learning that as hard as they can. Trump is believing every damn thing FOX News tells him, because he's addicted to flattery.
What we're really seeing now is idiots who were raised on talk radio and FOX News propaganda reaching an age where they hold office now, so we have misinformed ideologues running the government... and it's not working out well. These are people who've fostered the belief that they can build bubbles where the only real facts are the ones that support them, and the truth that works against them is safe to dismiss as "fake." It's a cultish, faith-based mindset, but because there's plenty of propaganda outlets to help them support it, they've never had to challenge their own thinking. They're married to it now.
And because of his weakness for flattery, and because he's not very smart to begin with, Trump is getting all of his "intel" from FOX News, and disregarding his actual intelligence sources because they're not telling him what he wants to hear. So he's going to keep screwing up. It may fool his base, but his base were always fooled anyway. The rest of the country, and the world, aren't going to be nearly so accommodating.
Good post!
The only thing that I might add is the emotional investment many people who voted for Trump seem to have in him ... whatever he does is "right" because if they admitted he was "wrong" about anything at all, they feel as though they would be publicly admitting they themselves were "wrong" to have supported his candidacy. And nobody wants to be seen as having been "wrong", even Democrats! (this forum is a perfect example of that)
So they cling desperately to anything that comes along that might support the idea of them having been "right" in voting for Trump ... including this ridiculous "Nunes memo" ... and remain willfully blind to any information or events that upset their sense of having been "right." Left-leaning voters do the same thing ... it's just Trumpkins have taken it to a whole new level.
Last edited by EmeraldGhost on 2/5/2018, 8:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
polecat wrote:Last week’s bot message: #ReleaseTheNunesMemo
This week’s bot message
#SuppressTheSchiffMemo
David Frum
PkrBum wrote:What part do you disagree with? The woods procedure? Failsafes? Guidelines? Oversight?
Floridatexan wrote:PkrBum wrote:What part do you disagree with? The woods procedure? Failsafes? Guidelines? Oversight?
S P I N
PkrBum wrote:What part do you disagree with? The woods procedure? Failsafes? Guidelines? Oversight?
EmeraldGhost wrote:PkrBum wrote:What part do you disagree with? The woods procedure? Failsafes? Guidelines? Oversight?
Well, I, for one, disagree with your contention that all appropriate internal rules and guidelines were not followed ... and as far as I'm concerned the Nunes memo provides scant evidence to suspect any might not have been.
How's that!
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