This is a forum based out of Pensacola Florida.


You are not connected. Please login or register

Repeal and Replace Obamacare vote fails for the 61st Time ... Trump attacks NBL Players

View previous topic View next topic Go down  Message [Page 1 of 1]

Go figure. Our republican nuts once again has failed to pass legislation that would repeal or replace Obamacare. Somebody once said that if you do the same thing and get the same result each time, stop doing it or you'll look insane.

Thank you all you republican ilterati for proving it's true.

And you guys won the White House and the House and the Senate? LOL!

View user profile
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-obamacare-fail-health-care-insurance-medicine-0911-jm-20160909-story.html

Come November, the grim trudge across the increasingly barren Obamacare landscape begins anew. Illinois consumers likely face staggering price hikes for individual insurance policies. Some types of plans could cost an average of 43 percent to 55 percent more. Ditto across the country: A first tranche of states approved 2017 rates with similarly cardiac-arrest-inducing premium increases.

Many Illinois consumers will find fewer choices because major carriers fled this market. UnitedHealthcare bolted. So did Aetna. Land of Lincoln Health collapsed mid-year, leaving policy holders to scramble for coverage that could cost them plenty. In many places across Illinois and the nation, people will find drastically fewer choices of plans than they did last year.

Those insurers fled because they didn't want to lose more money on a government-run market that is so far out of whack — a market they think likely will never be profitable for them. That isn't surprising, as we enumerate below.

But by diagnosing Obamacare, all of us can see the mistakes that any repair or replacement can avoid. So let's look at the failings and how they can drive solutions:

Obamacare failed because it flunked Economics 101 and Human Nature 101. It straitjacketed insurers into providing overly expensive, soup-to-nuts policies. It wasn't flexible enough so that people could buy as much coverage as they wanted and could afford — not what the government dictated. Many healthy people primarily want catastrophic coverage. Obamacare couldn't lure them in, couldn't persuade them to buy on the chance they'd get sick.

Obamacare failed because the penalties for going uncovered are too low when stacked against its skyrocketing premium costs. Next year, the penalty for staying uninsured is $695 per adult, or perhaps 2.5 percent of a family's taxable household income. That's far less than many Americans would pay for coverage. Financial incentive: Skip Obamacare.

Obamacare failed because insurance is based on risk pools — that is, the lucky subsidize the unlucky. The unlucky who have big health problems (and big medical bills) reap much greater benefits than those who remain healthy and out of the doctors' office. But Obamacare's rules hamstring insurers. They can't exclude people for pre-existing conditions, and can't charge older customers more than three times as much as the young. Those are good goals, but they skew the market in ways Obamacare didn't figure out how to offset. Result: Young and healthy consumers pay far more in premiums than their claims (probably) would justify in order to subsidize the unexpectedly large influx of older, sicker customers who require expensive care. Too many unlucky people, too few lucky people: That will collapse any insurance scheme.

Obamacare failed because it allowed Americans to sign up after they got sick and needed help paying all those medical bills. Insurance should be structured so that, although you don't know if you'll need it, you pay for it anyway, just in case; your alternative is financial doom. But if you can game the system and, for example, buy auto coverage after you crash into your garage, then you have no incentive to buy insurance beforehand.

Obamacare failed because it hasn't tamed U.S. medical costs. Health care is about supply and demand: People who get coverage use it, especially if the law mandates free preventive care. Iron law of economics: Nothing is free; someone pays. To pretend otherwise was folly. Those forces combined to spike the costs of care, and thus insurance costs.

Obamacare failed because too many carriers simply can't cover expenses, let alone turn a profit, in this rigidly controlled system. Take Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Illinois, the state's dominant Obamacare insurer. Last year, for every dollar the carrier collected, it spent $1.32 buying care and providing services for customers, according to BCBS President Maurice Smith. No wonder BCBS is proposing rate increases from 23 percent to 45 percent for its individual plans.

A question looms: Is Obamacare plunging in a so-called insurance death spiral? Is the market so unstable that plans are doomed to get more and more expensive, driving more Americans and more insurers out of the market until ... Obamacare thuds to the pavement?

We won't predict that, but neither do we see a mathematical alternative. What's clear is that the solutions to Obamacare are implicit in its failures. A repaired or replaced system has to be more flexible, letting insurers offer a wider range of plans so that consumers, not lawmakers or bureaucrats, dictate what's best for them. That system should protect those who carry continuous coverage, not coddle those who duck in and out of plans when their health needs change.

A new system also should scrap the job-killing Obamacare mandates that discourage companies from hiring and discourage workers from adding hours. Instead of gearing subsidies to incomes, let Americans not covered via an employer reap tax credits to help finance their insurance purchases on the open market. And tell us again: Why can't insurers sell policies across state lines? Imagine the pricing competition that would unleash.

We can deny the current system's failings, or we can parlay our evolving knowledge into something much better.

Put another way: The next president and Congress either reckon with Obamacare's failures or ... wait for the thud.

View user profile
Nobody here says Obamacare doesn't need improvement. But your bumbling right wing whackos want to fuck the poor so the rich can get tax breaks.

Of course by doing so, quite a number of republicans at congress understand that the victims will express their rage by voting. No wonder the Repeal and Replace attempts have failed to pass even when its only republicans who do the voting!

Your response, filled with talking points about what's wrong with Obama care is as irrelevant as all your comments.

Why can't your side do anything right?


Reality.

View user profile
What depresses me is the fact that this is not the last straw. Once January rolls around, the normal rules of order will be changed again in the Senate and they'll start trying the repeal all over again under budget reconciliation rules. What happens when McCain's cancer gets the better of him? Will Rand Paul, Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski be strong enough to hold off for yet another year? This doesn't affect me personally, but I have a sister who is 61 years old. She's not old enough for Medicare and Obamacare is her only option right now. She has pre-existing conditions and couldn't afford the higher premiums even if insurance companies were still forced to cover her. She voted for Donald Trump because of the abortion issue. I should say she may just get what she deserves, but there are actually SOME good people out there who voted for Trump , and she's one of them. I dread January coming. It'll all start all over again. That party just doesn't have any sense of caring about other people at all.

View user profile
bigdog wrote:What depresses me is the fact that this is not the last straw. Once January rolls around, the normal rules of order will be changed again in the Senate and they'll start trying the repeal all over again under budget reconciliation rules. What happens when McCain's cancer gets the better of him? Will Rand Paul, Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski be strong enough to hold off for yet another year? This doesn't affect me personally, but I have a sister who is 61 years old. She's not old enough for Medicare and Obamacare is her only option right now. She has pre-existing conditions and couldn't afford the higher premiums even if insurance companies were still forced to cover her. She voted for Donald Trump because of the abortion issue. I should say she may just get what she deserves, but there are actually SOME good people out there who voted for Trump , and she's one of them. I dread January coming. It'll all start all over again. That party just doesn't have any sense of caring about other people at all.

Keep your spirits up. What may come next is a bi-partisan approach to solving Obamacare's problems. And then there's Uncle Bernie's Single Payer program, which has my vote and may indeed solve the problem of healthcare for all Americans. Virtually every developed country in the world has free healthcare. I realize this will put 20 or 30 Insurance company CEOs out of business, but I don't care about them ... do you?

View user profile
Wordslinger wrote:Nobody here says Obamacare doesn't need improvement. But your bumbling right wing whackos want to fuck the poor so the rich can get tax breaks.

Of course by doing so, quite a number of republicans at congress understand that the victims will express their rage by voting.  No wonder the Repeal and Replace attempts have failed to pass even when its only republicans who do the voting!

Your response, filled with talking points about what's wrong with Obama care is as irrelevant as all your comments.

Why can't your side do anything right?


Reality.

Lol... so spun up you can't even organize your thoughts. Knowing what's wrong is exactly relevant if you want it fixed. Take a few deep breaths... maybe a little walk too. Now... nothing has happened... zip zero nada. Obamacaid is still the nazi law of the land. Individuals are still mandated to buy it... corps are still dictated the terms... pharma is still raking it in... and the young are still getting screwed. There... feel better now?

View user profile
PkrBum wrote:http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-obamacare-fail-health-care-insurance-medicine-0911-jm-20160909-story.html

Come November, the grim trudge across the increasingly barren Obamacare landscape begins anew. Illinois consumers likely face staggering price hikes for individual insurance policies. Some types of plans could cost an average of 43 percent to 55 percent more. Ditto across the country: A first tranche of states approved 2017 rates with similarly cardiac-arrest-inducing premium increases.

Many Illinois consumers will find fewer choices because major carriers fled this market. UnitedHealthcare bolted. So did Aetna. Land of Lincoln Health collapsed mid-year, leaving policy holders to scramble for coverage that could cost them plenty. In many places across Illinois and the nation, people will find drastically fewer choices of plans than they did last year.

Those insurers fled because they didn't want to lose more money on a government-run market that is so far out of whack — a market they think likely will never be profitable for them. That isn't surprising, as we enumerate below.

But by diagnosing Obamacare, all of us can see the mistakes that any repair or replacement can avoid. So let's look at the failings and how they can drive solutions:

Obamacare failed because it flunked Economics 101 and Human Nature 101. It straitjacketed insurers into providing overly expensive, soup-to-nuts policies. It wasn't flexible enough so that people could buy as much coverage as they wanted and could afford — not what the government dictated. Many healthy people primarily want catastrophic coverage. Obamacare couldn't lure them in, couldn't persuade them to buy on the chance they'd get sick.

Obamacare failed because the penalties for going uncovered are too low when stacked against its skyrocketing premium costs. Next year, the penalty for staying uninsured is $695 per adult, or perhaps 2.5 percent of a family's taxable household income. That's far less than many Americans would pay for coverage. Financial incentive: Skip Obamacare.

Obamacare failed because insurance is based on risk pools — that is, the lucky subsidize the unlucky. The unlucky who have big health problems (and big medical bills) reap much greater benefits than those who remain healthy and out of the doctors' office. But Obamacare's rules hamstring insurers. They can't exclude people for pre-existing conditions, and can't charge older customers more than three times as much as the young. Those are good goals, but they skew the market in ways Obamacare didn't figure out how to offset. Result: Young and healthy consumers pay far more in premiums than their claims (probably) would justify in order to subsidize the unexpectedly large influx of older, sicker customers who require expensive care. Too many unlucky people, too few lucky people: That will collapse any insurance scheme.

Obamacare failed because it allowed Americans to sign up after they got sick and needed help paying all those medical bills. Insurance should be structured so that, although you don't know if you'll need it, you pay for it anyway, just in case; your alternative is financial doom. But if you can game the system and, for example, buy auto coverage after you crash into your garage, then you have no incentive to buy insurance beforehand.

Obamacare failed because it hasn't tamed U.S. medical costs. Health care is about supply and demand: People who get coverage use it, especially if the law mandates free preventive care. Iron law of economics: Nothing is free; someone pays. To pretend otherwise was folly. Those forces combined to spike the costs of care, and thus insurance costs.

Obamacare failed because too many carriers simply can't cover expenses, let alone turn a profit, in this rigidly controlled system. Take Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Illinois, the state's dominant Obamacare insurer. Last year, for every dollar the carrier collected, it spent $1.32 buying care and providing services for customers, according to BCBS President Maurice Smith. No wonder BCBS is proposing rate increases from 23 percent to 45 percent for its individual plans.

A question looms: Is Obamacare plunging in a so-called insurance death spiral? Is the market so unstable that plans are doomed to get more and more expensive, driving more Americans and more insurers out of the market until ... Obamacare thuds to the pavement?

We won't predict that, but neither do we see a mathematical alternative. What's clear is that the solutions to Obamacare are implicit in its failures. A repaired or replaced system has to be more flexible, letting insurers offer a wider range of plans so that consumers, not lawmakers or bureaucrats, dictate what's best for them. That system should protect those who carry continuous coverage, not coddle those who duck in and out of plans when their health needs change.

A new system also should scrap the job-killing Obamacare mandates that discourage companies from hiring and discourage workers from adding hours. Instead of gearing subsidies to incomes, let Americans not covered via an employer reap tax credits to help finance their insurance purchases on the open market. And tell us again: Why can't insurers sell policies across state lines? Imagine the pricing competition that would unleash.

We can deny the current system's failings, or we can parlay our evolving knowledge into something much better.

Put another way: The next president and Congress either reckon with Obamacare's failures or ... wait for the thud.

Not once in this fucked up article you copied and pasted did it mention that rates in some areas of the country were to stabilize or go down for 2018. Seems the writer didn't bother to check companies would not be pulling out and raising rates because your fucked up leader teeters every month on whether or not to renew cost share reductions. Seems he never mentioned this fucked up administration is doing everything they can to destroy it and they will. Latest is they will shut down the marketplace every Sunday during open enrollment for 12 hours and shut it down November 1st for sometime supposedly for maintenance. The rates would have only have gone up about 8% for the company I represent, most companies filed two sets of rates solely because of your fueher would not commit to the cost share reductions. Well, the decision has been made for the higher set of rates, therefore, making plans completely unaffordable to anyone not receiving a tax credit and then some of them won't be able to afford. Yep, then your fuck head President can say I told you no one would sign up. All this just in spite.

It needed to be fixed not completely destroyed.



Last edited by dumpcare on 9/27/2017, 8:34 am; edited 1 time in total

View user profile
It needed many fixes that Obama achieved via executive overreach... why no objectivity? I'll tell you what tho... if you want to speak to me like that then let's do it in person. I'll call you when I get to town.

View user profile
dumpcare wrote:
PkrBum wrote:http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-obamacare-fail-health-care-insurance-medicine-0911-jm-20160909-story.html

Come November, the grim trudge across the increasingly barren Obamacare landscape begins anew. Illinois consumers likely face staggering price hikes for individual insurance policies. Some types of plans could cost an average of 43 percent to 55 percent more. Ditto across the country: A first tranche of states approved 2017 rates with similarly cardiac-arrest-inducing premium increases.

Many Illinois consumers will find fewer choices because major carriers fled this market. UnitedHealthcare bolted. So did Aetna. Land of Lincoln Health collapsed mid-year, leaving policy holders to scramble for coverage that could cost them plenty. In many places across Illinois and the nation, people will find drastically fewer choices of plans than they did last year.

Those insurers fled because they didn't want to lose more money on a government-run market that is so far out of whack — a market they think likely will never be profitable for them. That isn't surprising, as we enumerate below.

But by diagnosing Obamacare, all of us can see the mistakes that any repair or replacement can avoid. So let's look at the failings and how they can drive solutions:

Obamacare failed because it flunked Economics 101 and Human Nature 101. It straitjacketed insurers into providing overly expensive, soup-to-nuts policies. It wasn't flexible enough so that people could buy as much coverage as they wanted and could afford — not what the government dictated. Many healthy people primarily want catastrophic coverage. Obamacare couldn't lure them in, couldn't persuade them to buy on the chance they'd get sick.

Obamacare failed because the penalties for going uncovered are too low when stacked against its skyrocketing premium costs. Next year, the penalty for staying uninsured is $695 per adult, or perhaps 2.5 percent of a family's taxable household income. That's far less than many Americans would pay for coverage. Financial incentive: Skip Obamacare.

Obamacare failed because insurance is based on risk pools — that is, the lucky subsidize the unlucky. The unlucky who have big health problems (and big medical bills) reap much greater benefits than those who remain healthy and out of the doctors' office. But Obamacare's rules hamstring insurers. They can't exclude people for pre-existing conditions, and can't charge older customers more than three times as much as the young. Those are good goals, but they skew the market in ways Obamacare didn't figure out how to offset. Result: Young and healthy consumers pay far more in premiums than their claims (probably) would justify in order to subsidize the unexpectedly large influx of older, sicker customers who require expensive care. Too many unlucky people, too few lucky people: That will collapse any insurance scheme.

Obamacare failed because it allowed Americans to sign up after they got sick and needed help paying all those medical bills. Insurance should be structured so that, although you don't know if you'll need it, you pay for it anyway, just in case; your alternative is financial doom. But if you can game the system and, for example, buy auto coverage after you crash into your garage, then you have no incentive to buy insurance beforehand.

Obamacare failed because it hasn't tamed U.S. medical costs. Health care is about supply and demand: People who get coverage use it, especially if the law mandates free preventive care. Iron law of economics: Nothing is free; someone pays. To pretend otherwise was folly. Those forces combined to spike the costs of care, and thus insurance costs.

Obamacare failed because too many carriers simply can't cover expenses, let alone turn a profit, in this rigidly controlled system. Take Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Illinois, the state's dominant Obamacare insurer. Last year, for every dollar the carrier collected, it spent $1.32 buying care and providing services for customers, according to BCBS President Maurice Smith. No wonder BCBS is proposing rate increases from 23 percent to 45 percent for its individual plans.

A question looms: Is Obamacare plunging in a so-called insurance death spiral? Is the market so unstable that plans are doomed to get more and more expensive, driving more Americans and more insurers out of the market until ... Obamacare thuds to the pavement?

We won't predict that, but neither do we see a mathematical alternative. What's clear is that the solutions to Obamacare are implicit in its failures. A repaired or replaced system has to be more flexible, letting insurers offer a wider range of plans so that consumers, not lawmakers or bureaucrats, dictate what's best for them. That system should protect those who carry continuous coverage, not coddle those who duck in and out of plans when their health needs change.

A new system also should scrap the job-killing Obamacare mandates that discourage companies from hiring and discourage workers from adding hours. Instead of gearing subsidies to incomes, let Americans not covered via an employer reap tax credits to help finance their insurance purchases on the open market. And tell us again: Why can't insurers sell policies across state lines? Imagine the pricing competition that would unleash.

We can deny the current system's failings, or we can parlay our evolving knowledge into something much better.

Put another way: The next president and Congress either reckon with Obamacare's failures or ... wait for the thud.

Not once in this fucked up article you copied and pasted did it mention that rates in some areas of the country were to stabilize or go down for 2018. Seems the writer didn't bother to check companies would not be pulling out and raising rates because your fucked up leader teeters every month on whether or not to renew cost share reductions. Seems he never mentioned this fucked up administration is doing everything then can to destroy it and they will. Latest is they will shut down the marketplace every Sunday during open enrollment for 12 hours and shut it down November 1st for sometime supposedly for maintenance. The rates would have only have gone up about 8% for the company I represent, most companies filed two sets of rates solely because of your fueher would not commit to the cost share reductions. Well the decision has been made for the higher set of rates therefore making plans completely unaffordable to anyone not receiving a tax credit and then some of them won't be able to afford. Yep, then your fuck head President can say I told you no one would sign up. All this just in spite. Now the rates in Florida will go up from 20% to around 50% plus.

The facts are there and again in most of Florida people will only have 1 insurer to choose from on or off exchange.

It needed to be fixed not completely destroyed by some goddman 5th grade son of a bitch.

Ouch!

That's gonna leave a mark.

View user profile
Adios, Graham-Cassidy. You were a $hit-covered, flea-infested bag of dicks and that's how you'll always be remembered.
The rude pundit

View user profile
polecat wrote:Adios, Graham-Cassidy. You were a $hit-covered, flea-infested bag of dicks and that's how you'll always be remembered.
The rude pundit


cheers cheers cheers

View user profile
PkrBum wrote:It needed many fixes that Obama achieved via executive overreach... why no objectivity? I'll tell you what tho... if you want to speak to me like that then let's do it in person. I'll call you when I get to town.

My objectivity went out the window when the damn Senate and Congress could not, even though controlled by Republicans, come up with another workable plan. Repeal is all we heard, did they ever think a fix here and a fix there may work?

Then you have the dems and Medicare for all. It may have had a chance if it was Medicare for anyone over 50 or 55, go back to underwritten health plans for ones below this age, if denied let them also buy into Medicare. The underwritten plans would naturally have lowered the premium's due to the fact only most healthy people would have been in that pool. There are also a lot of people between 50 and 55 there are healthy believe it or not and just maybe would have stabilized Medicare. No mandates. But the problem is everyone in Washington acts just in spite of the other and doesn't help the Republican party has become about 6 different factions and the dems 2 or 3. A program of a 100% single payer is a long way off if ever in the U.S.

View user profile

Sponsored content


View previous topic View next topic Back to top  Message [Page 1 of 1]

Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum