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26 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/5/2017, 3:15 pm

PkrBum wrote:Look at the large cities where the dems have been entrenched for decades... or even the states that are spending their way to failure to maintain unreasonable  public services, pensions, projects... etc.

Your comparison doesn't follow logic... it cherry picks a few statistics. Good enough for some tho.

Cities aren't nearly as autonomous. They're still subject to state budgets and mayors have little real power to do policies that affect people's fates in any serious way.

I repeat: if you look at the overall pattern, non-conservative policies perform much better than conservative ones. That's not cherry-picking a few stats, it's the overarching trend. Conservatism has very little success to back it up, which is why it's been fading out almost everywhere on the globe other than the United States. You're going to keep trying to look at it because it rattles all the stuff you want to believe.

I used to consider myself Republican when I was a kid, but when I grew up enough to actually be taking part in society, I wised up. You could, too, if you were honest enough with yourself.

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27 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/5/2017, 3:35 pm

Look at the large cities where the dems have been entrenched for decades... or even the states that are spending their way to failure to maintain unreasonable public services, pensions, projects... etc.

Your comparison doesn't follow logic... it cherry picks a few statistics. Good enough for some tho.


pure historical idiocy. Which came first, Detroit losing 75% of its population or democrats running government. It is such a false narrative. History shows us that the large American cities are where Economy of scale manufacturing explodes with Americans migrating to large cities to fill the factory jobs from the 1880s until the 1950s as cities became the center of increases in productivity and prosperity in America.

With the post WWII America industry began to migrate to rural America where an efficient interstate system could deliver goods across America from decentralized manufacturing. The Population began to migrate to once to areas which were deserts before air conditioning and modern American engineering where water systems turned the deserts into utopia. The economy of scale necessary to keep infrastructure working began to shift to rural America and the cities were faced with having to rebuild from manufacturing to distribution, and services. This transition dominated American economic life during the fifties through seventies when the American Suburb became a reality, but then in the early 80s our wealth in manufacturing no longer was heading for rural America, rather with changes in the tax code, the wealthy could steal two centuries of American ingenuity and export our jobs to foreign labor markets as we lost 50k factories under the Reagan trickle down economic theory.

Yes, the democratic machines in large cities were corrupt and self serving, but they were when the American miracle in manufacturing happened a century earlier, and they were no more or less responsible for that boom than they were for the decline. I have fought the Chicago democratic machine my entire life. I am about to be fighting a senate committee which is controlled by the machine, but to suggest that they were responsible for the decline in American manufacturing is pure Oligarch propaganda. No The truth is simple. President Trump has sold his soul to those evil forces who are selling America out to the wealthy. Every legislative thing he has done has confirmed the same. You seem to be the only one who tries to rationalize this traitor. You are wrong, and he is evil.

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28 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/5/2017, 5:31 pm

2seaoat wrote:precisely because of the engrained leftist racism

I am so tired of revisionist history which is not even in the same zip code as the truth.   The democratic machines from after the civil war consolidated government benefits by voting as a block.  However, when the civil rights movement was spreading after WWII where men of color equally sacrificed defending their nation, the die was cast.   In order to keep the Tammny Hall Southern machine together which secured all the military bases and were net takers of federal dollars they had to find a new path which allowed them government control of the south which kept Jim Crow and De Jure laws which denied people of color shared political power.   The path became more clear by the time of Goldwater, and it was perfected by Nixon in his southern strategy.

The above statement is nonsensical and you and Cap should take a vacation where both of you can read some cliff notes or history for dummies, because what you have stated is blatantly wrong, lie demand drives productivity in economic theory......at some point we need people to use their brains, or open books because this place has been degraded to dummy town.

Demand drives economic growth.

https://www.thebalance.com/five-determinants-of-demand-with-examples-and-formula-3305706

5 Determinants of Demand with Examples and Formula
The Five Factors Affecting Demand Using Examples in the U.S. Economy



By Kimberly Amadeo
Updated March 20, 2017

Demand drives economic growth. Businesses want to increase demand so they can increase profits. Governments and central banks boost demand to end recessions. They slow it during the expansion phase of the business cycle, to combat inflation. If you offer any paid services, even you try to raise demand for them.

But what drives demand? In economics, there are five determinants of individual demand, and a sixth for aggregate demand.


What Are the Five Determinants of Demand?
The five determinants of demand are:

The price of the good or service.
Prices of related goods or services. These are either complementary (purchased along with) or substitutes (purchased instead of).
Income of buyers.
Tastes or preferences of consumers.
Expectations. These are usually about whether the price will go up.

For aggregate demand, the number of buyers in the market is the sixth determinant.."

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29 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/5/2017, 6:22 pm

Demand drives economic growth.


Correct, and in a consumer oriented economy it is almost 70% in America.

It does not drive productivity. Productivity is a concept which deal with the efficiency of of an economic system. The Soviet Union was a very inefficient economic system where demand had less to with economic growth, and full employment with antiquated industry in a closed market resulted in a dropping GDP where China, Japan, Korea, and Brazil passed them up, and although they still export arms and oil their productivity still falls woefully short of the German or American models of productivity. There are independent economic factors which impact productivity and demand is not a DIRECT factor. Economist have always argued that opening up markets which create greater demand can lead to successful economy of scale in some industries, while others who fail in that larger open market can be destroyed. So the increased demand for a shirt manufactured in North Carolina would seem to open the door for an economy of scale and higher productivity, but the Asian economies were able to invest capital in more efficient production which with the higher demand put American garment production in a deadly downward spiral. Demand is a distinctly different concept than productivity.

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30 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/5/2017, 6:31 pm

In Latin America in the 1940s every nation had inefficient and low productivity in their auto industries. Once LAFTA was formed, nations began to widen their market and increase the demand for autos, but they wisely began to cherry pick industry which each nation could support and therefore increased the demand and economy of scale, and capital investment might be glass for Chile, Autos for brazil, tractors for Argentina, and they created a protective tariff structure which allowed those investing capital into more productive capital equipment to get a guaranteed rate of return. Brazil during this transition had their GDP pass that of Russia whose productivity in the closed soviet market had given monopoly to highly inefficient industries who could not compete on the world market. Russia has been evolving from being totally dependent on exporting oil, to now trying to export war where its military industrial complex is actually able to compete on the world market. Economics is a science, and when somebody says 2 + 2 =5 it is self evident as when somebody says demand increases productivity.

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31 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/7/2017, 9:03 am

I guess Seaoat learned his Econ from Rick Perry:

Secretary of Energy Rick Perry on Thursday was widely mocked on Twitter for his definition of supply-and-demand economics during a visit to a West Virginia coal-fired power plant.

"Here's a little economics lesson; supply and demand," Perry told the crowd, according to reports. "You put the supply out there, and the demand will follow."

Well, no. As those who know economics pointed out on Twitter, Perry's use of the term is defined as the law that "...an increase in supply will lower prices if not accompanied by increased demand, and an increase in demand will raise prices unless accompanied by increased supply."

https://patch.com/texas/downtownaustin/energy-secretary-perry-cites-fundamental-economics-rule-speech-gets-it-wrong

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32 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/7/2017, 9:25 am

Stupid is hard to fix. I will just avoid conversations with you when all you are doing is the Markle cut and paste and cannot conceptualize reality to apply your own words, and the cut and past is non responsive and irrelevant. When you have an intelligent original thought, please share the same, but grinding tedious stupid is not worthy of an exchange of ideas.

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33 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/7/2017, 11:01 am

2seaoat wrote:Stupid is hard to fix.  I will just avoid conversations with you when all you are doing is the Markle cut and paste and cannot conceptualize reality to apply your own words, and the cut and past is non responsive and irrelevant.  When you have an intelligent original thought, please share the same, but grinding tedious stupid is not worthy of an exchange of ideas.

Oh, ferchrissakes, lighten up. Serious people don't take themselves so seriously.
People that know they're intellectually inadequate take on an ever-so-serious mien to cover it up.

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34 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/7/2017, 12:51 pm

2seaoat wrote:Demand drives economic growth.


Correct, and in a consumer oriented economy it is almost 70% in America.  

It does not drive productivity.   Productivity is a concept which deal with the efficiency of of an economic system.   The Soviet Union was a very inefficient economic system where demand had less to with economic growth, and full employment with antiquated industry in a closed market resulted in a dropping GDP where China, Japan, Korea, and Brazil passed them up, and although they still export arms and oil their productivity still falls woefully short of the German or American models of productivity.   There are independent economic factors which impact productivity and demand is not a DIRECT factor.   Economist have always argued that opening up markets which create greater demand can lead to successful economy of scale in some industries, while others who fail in that larger open market can be destroyed.  So the increased demand for a shirt manufactured in North Carolina would seem to open the door for an economy of scale and higher productivity, but the Asian economies were able to invest capital in more efficient production which with the higher demand put American garment production in a deadly downward spiral.   Demand is a distinctly different concept than productivity.

Oy vey, Seaoat. Without demand, you can produce all the widgets you want, but your enterprise will sink like a stone.

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35 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 12:19 pm

Guest


Guest
Does anyone force you folks to watch? Can't you turn the channel? That's what is wrong with the left today. If you don't agree with them, you have to be a racist, homophobic, intolerant, bigoted, islamaphobic deplorable. That's exactly the attitude that cost you the House in 2010, the Senate in 2014, and the WH in 2016.

36 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 12:33 pm

Guest wrote:Does anyone force you folks to watch? Can't you turn the channel?  That's what is wrong with the left today. If you don't agree with them, you have to be a racist, homophobic, intolerant, bigoted, islamaphobic deplorable. That's exactly the attitude that cost you the House in 2010, the Senate in 2014, and the WH in 2016.

Here we go! This is gonna be fun to watch.

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37 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 12:36 pm

Oy vey, Seaoat. Without demand, you can produce all the widgets you want, but your enterprise will sink like a stone.


Again, economics is a science. The false concept that demand increases production has been rebutted. I have personally seen where a new CNC machine which replaced a WWII screw machine tripled production of a bearing which went into large conveyor systems for mining when the demand for those dropped off the face of the earth. The tripling of productivity still remained as an economic fact and had absolutely nothing to do with the three year downturn in demand in the mining industry. Once the demand based on copper prices returned the productivity of bearings had tripled. You either understand economic concepts, or you do not. Most have never even taken a course in economics.

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38 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 12:43 pm

Does anyone force you folks to watch? Can't you turn the channel? That's what is wrong with the left today. If you don't agree with them, you have to be a racist, homophobic, intolerant, bigoted, islamaphobic deplorable. That's exactly the attitude that cost you the House in 2010, the Senate in 2014, and the WH in 2016.

I still depend on my digital antenna to get network TV. The airwaves are regulated by the FCC. The standards of getting the privilege to get a license to broadcast are distinct and different than what is delivered via computer or cable. I am a Republican. The Republicans in Kansas and Illinois have said enough with the crazy chit, and have voted against governors who have no connection to the party of Lincoln, but are part of the Dixiecrat invasion of the Republican party. The hateful agenda which allows the oligarchs to continue the militarization of America, while trying to disenfranchise Americans of color is where the battle line has been drawn. It is not by accident that the popular vote was lost by this president, and without political gerrymandering the democrats would have a majority in the house......no a half million people died the first time fighting this crazy hate, and the evil will not go away.

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39 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:03 pm

2seaoat wrote:Oy vey, Seaoat. Without demand, you can produce all the widgets you want, but your enterprise will sink like a stone.


Again, economics is a science.  The false concept that demand increases production has been rebutted.   I have personally seen where a new CNC machine which replaced a WWII screw machine tripled production of a bearing which went into large conveyor systems for mining when the demand for those dropped off the face of the earth.  The tripling of productivity still remained as an economic fact and had absolutely nothing to do with the three year downturn in demand in the mining industry.  Once the demand based on copper prices returned the productivity of bearings had tripled.  You either understand economic concepts, or you do not.   Most have never even taken a course in economics.

Great...the owner had deep pockets and could afford to sit on the inventory until demand kicked in.  Many businesses cannot.  That's why they spend the big bucks analyzing their target markets and producing advertising that motivates buyers.

Oh, and economics is not pure science...it's applied science that uses mathematical probabilities.

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40 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:10 pm

2seaoat wrote:Again, economics is a science.

BULLSHIT!
“You can disguise charlatanism under the weight of equations, and nobody can catch you since there is no such thing as a controlled experiment.”
Nassim Nicholas Taleb in his ground-breaking book Fooled by Randomness

And any fool knows you can't use a Micro econ example to prove a Macro hypothesis which is what you're doing with that ridiculous CNC machine drivel.

Economics is NOT a hard science like Physics. It's a soft science like Social Science that uses the trappings of science, the dense mathematics, to SEEM serious--the same way Astrology uses hard Astronomical data to make their predictions.

Try reading something more current than John Stuart Mill or Adam Smith, try reading Taleb or Piketty. You're getting your Econ theory from the Middle Ages. Maybe you should stick to the Horoscope books.

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41 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:20 pm

No, quite the contrary. The CNC machines could easily be set up to do other bearing sizes where the old screw machines were static and often would sit idle because they did not have the computerized set ups which could change production with simple changes in the program. American manufacturing increases productivity with worker training, more parts per labor hour, and capital investments in capital equipment which does not make war, but produces bearings which can compete in the world market. Again, understanding economic concepts requires being educated. Not every person with a college degree can make plastics from natural gas, or understand Economic theory, but people have the freedom of speech to put their foot in their mouth.......it is the American way. President Trump claiming he is an educated man from a top business school, has proven that the same is not true.

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42 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:34 pm

2seaoat wrote:No, quite the contrary.  The CNC machines could easily be set up to do other bearing sizes where the old screw machines were static and often would sit idle because they did not have the computerized set ups which could change production with simple changes in the program.  American manufacturing increases productivity with worker training, more parts per labor hour, and capital investments in capital equipment which does not make war, but produces bearings which can compete in the world market.  Again, understanding economic concepts requires being educated.  Not every person with a college degree can make plastics from natural gas, or understand Economic theory, but people have the freedom of speech to put their foot in their mouth.......it is the American way.   President Trump claiming he is an educated man from a top business school, has proven that the same is not true.

The witness is not being responsive, your Honor.

Although, in this case, it should really be "the WITLESS".

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43 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:41 pm

the dense mathematics, to SEEM serious-

Too funny. Somebody who has never taken a graduate level economics course is going to explain that economics is like a horoscope. As someone who has taken econometric graduate courses which use statistical methods to verify economic truths, it was hardly trying to seem serious, the math was certain, and the replication was done with scientific certainty. All police are bad, the DC code does not apply to DC, demand increases productivity, and on and on.......ok we get it.....you are a dumb asz. Follow Lincoln's advice and keep your mouth shut because you seem dedicated to prove you are a fool.

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44 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:48 pm

Economics is just a pseudoscience for those that can't pass/understand real science.

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45 Re: Sinclair broadcasting on 7/8/2017, 1:53 pm

2seaoat wrote:the dense mathematics, to SEEM serious-

Too funny.  Somebody who has never taken a graduate level economics course is going to explain that economics is like a horoscope.   As someone who has taken econometric graduate courses which use statistical methods to verify economic truths, it was hardly trying to seem serious, the math was certain, and the replication was done with scientific certainty.  

Economists have faced a deluge of negative press in the past few years, ranging from criticisms over the failure to forecast the financial crisis, to the more recent disbelief over the granting of the Nobel Prize in Economics to three economists, two of whom hold views that can be said to be polar opposites. Indeed, the reputation of mainstream economics—specifically macroeconomics—is arguably at its worst since the formation of the field in the 1930s, with the advent of the Great Depression.

It seems as though economics is fighting for its right to stay in the exclusive group of fields deemed worthy enough to be called “science,” where subjects such as physics, chemistry, and molecular biology reside comfortably. Some instead opt to call economics, along with psychology and sociology, a “social science”—a vague term, often blurred with humanities, which is neither here nor there. Nevertheless, the underlying implication behind this battle is that to be a “science” is to be credible.

Merriam-Webster’s definition of science is “a study of the natural world based on facts learned through experiments and observation.” What physics and chemistry and molecular biology have in common is that the building blocks of what they observe and experiment with don’t change. Such is the natural world. But what is the building block of economics? People. Economics does not study any unit smaller than a collection of people. And human behavior can never be absolutely predicted or explained—not if we wish to believe in free will, at any rate.

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2013/12/13/economics-science-wang/

That, by the way is from the HARVARD Crimson. Perhaps you should adjust your opinion of my education.

You might look into some of the very good medications they have for dementia. You're obviously experiencing some age-related cognitive distress.

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